barrel cleaning and copper fouling?

[Sas874runner]

Not sure if this is normal or copper fouling. I have spent hours cleaning this barrel just because I thought it was coper fouling. I have run hoppes no.9 and sweets 7.62. As well as other cleaners. The gun shoots deadly accurate. Talking 1/4 moa at 100 yards. So I'm really not worried at this point. The gun is a rem. 700 adl 3006. My loads are 165 ab or pt with either 60gr RL19 @2830 fps or 62 gr RL22 @ 2950.

 

[SJB358]

Looks fine to me. Shoot it till accuracy drops off.. No real sense in scrubbing it clean constantly, if it is still shooting well.

 

[BeeTee]

It's copper. Not bad, but still copper.

Put the rifle in a gun vise or on a short bipod with the barrel slightly muzzle down. Run your rod with patch tip through the barrel from the action. Soak a patch with Sweets, and pull it back into the bore 10-12 inches. Work it back and forth a dozen times, then push the patch out just far enough to add more Sweets to it. Pull the patch back into the first 2-3", then let soak for 10-15 minutes.

Doing this once or twice should remove the copper you're seeing. I've done this many-many dozens of times.

Removing the copper is important because it allows the steel to be polished by the bullets as they're being shot. Eventually, the bore will smooth to a point that copper fouling decreases, and the need to use Sweets diminishes over time.

Once the copper is gone, push a dry patch through to remove the Sweets, then follow with a couple solvent patches to get any remaining. Oil the bore before it goes back into the safe/cabinet. BT

 

[Guest]

I'll suggest if you want to be rid of that copper, order some BoreTech Eliminator. While you're waiting for it to arrive, search this forum and find the regimen I use. Follow that regimen, using copper free jags (nickel plated Tipton Ultras or BoreTech Proof Positive are copper free) and a good cleaning rod. I've tried just about everything else there is, and BTE is the stuff I use. Follow it with a patch oiled with your favorite gun oil (I like Birchwood-Casey Barricade) and then a single dry patch after that. Should be fine.

 

[Kodiak]

I advise that everyone read dub's post more than one time!

He's right-in the bullseye with that statement.

BTE cleaned-up the crudyest (is that a word?) old model 70 (.270) I have ever seen, after over 30 years of neglect by it's current owner! NO!, it wasn't mine :roll: .

Good stuff there,

 

[OU812]

The guys have offered some great ideas and choices of copper cleaners that do work very well. I use either wipeout or patch out and either one works amazing on copper and your not stuck hanging around your rifle all day. Spray in wipeout or swab in patch out and walk away. Come back at a later time run a dry patch through. You would be amazed at how well either product removes copper. I've done the other methods with various copper cleaners and would never go back. Just my .02

 

[Sas874runner]

Thanks guys. Dub- would you mind posting a link to your post?

 

[Guest]

Here's a synopsis of what I'm doing:

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=18726&p=165731&hilit=Bte+regimen#p165731

See my post (#15) at the bottom of the first page.

 

[BK]

Crickey, a 1/4 MOA sporter? I wouldn't be screwing with it!

 

[onesonek]

Looks fine to me. Shoot it till accuracy drops off.. No real sense in scrubbing it clean constantly, if it is still shooting well.

I totally agree. I never clean the bore untill the accuracy falls off by 1/2. Unless one absolutely needs the .25 moa or whatever it may be, otherwise you are still under .5 moa. But then, it usually takes a number of fouling rounds to settle the barrel back in. Most of the time, the copper is just smoothing out bore of microscopic imperfections of the tooling imo. Unless accuracy falls off too quickly, then lapping is in order, also imo.
Otherwise, unless for long term storage, and then just a coat of good preservant, but then not totally stripped. The copper ain't going to hurt nothing if it is shooting as expected.

 

[CatskillCrawler]

I agree with the "let it be" side of the house. It doesn't look too bad right now. I really can't tell as to when the copper is starting to affect accuracy in any of my guns as I'm a terrible shot so I just apply BTE once a year to get them all back to a zero copper state.

Both of the methods described above will work when you decide to remove it though.

Sounds like you have some great loads out of that ADL. Not surprised with the accuracy you enjoy from your fine Remingtom product. :wink:

 

[Guest]

My only issue with the "leave it alone" theory is the carbon buildup and what that will do to the throat of the rifle. I clean every 40-50rds whether accuracy falls off or not. As time passes, the amount of copper is less and less in all my rifles. The amount of carbon pretty well stays the same, though. At least carbon is easy to get out. It will interact with the steel and cause molecular changes, I think. Maybe Charlie or some other engineer with some metallurgy knowledge can help out with some explanation of that. Maybe they'll teach me I'm over-cleaning. But for now, it's every 40-50, regardless of copper. I don't own a rifle that will not go that long with my handloads and maintain accuracy, so copper isn't the issue most of the time for me.

 

[SJB358]

My only issue with the "leave it alone" theory is the carbon buildup and what that will do to the throat of the rifle. I clean every 40-50rds whether accuracy falls off or not. As time passes, the amount of copper is less and less in all my rifles. The amount of carbon pretty well stays the same, though. At least carbon is easy to get out. It will interact with the steel and cause molecular changes, I think. Maybe Charlie or some other engineer with some metallurgy knowledge can help out with some explanation of that. Maybe they'll teach me I'm over-cleaning. But for now, it's every 40-50, regardless of copper. I don't own a rifle that will not go that long with my handloads and maintain accuracy, so copper isn't the issue most of the time for me.

I do hit the carbon a little more often Dub, good point. About the same as you, but I won't get aggressive with copper till I need to. Makes sense. Good point. Just the observation of a little copper doesn't bother me as much as it once used to.

 

[Kodiak]

I'm an old guy with old ways; that said, I clean rifle bores with the same regularity (25-100 shots + -), kinda in the shadow of changing the oil in my truck motor every few thousand miles, sorta :roll: .

 

[Sas874runner]

Great info. I'm just very maticulous about my guns. I ran some more sweets through tonight while waiting for the BTE to show up. My first pacth came out royal blue... never seen that before. Then the patches were spotless after that. Any ideas on why it was so blue. Normaly the copper is a greenish blue?

 

[Guest]

High copper concentration will give you a darker blue color. These are some post TTSX patches from one of my 'bees:

That's after only about 30rds of TTSX. It's the reason I don't shoot those in my rifle anymore. The pure copper and that particular barrel did not agree with one another.

 

[SJB358]

Yeah, I will see deep blue patches as well after my rifles have been shot quite alot. Pretty normal really.

 

[OU812]

Yeah, I will see deep blue patches as well after my rifles have been shot quite alot. Pretty normal really.

The norm for me as well. I don't clean the copper until my accuracy falls off.