Long range cartridges

Thebear_78

Active member
Sep 30, 2004
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Over the years I have played around with longer range shooting. Starting out with larger and larger cartridges. Velocity and horsepower seemed the only way to be able to shoot farther. Cartridges like the 7mm mag, 300 win, 300 RUM, and 338 RUM.

All this horsepower came at a cost, recoil and muzzle blast. It was very difficult to manage all that recoil while still maintaining good trigger control and accuracy.

Then good optics and efficient smaller cartridges and high BC bullets came around. This has totally changed my long range shooting. Suddenly you didn’t need all that horsepower. scopes with repeatable accurate adjustments and reticles that allowed range estimation and holdover points. Suppressors and purpose designed, adjustable stocks, replacing loud muzzle breaks and poorly adjusted hunting stocks. It got a whole lot easier to shoot at longer ranges.

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My current cartridge choices are 22 creedmoor, 6.5 creedmoor, 260 rem, and 308 win. The 22 creedmoor is the newest one I’ve been shooting.

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The 22 creedmoor using 95gr SMK at 3085fps. It’s shoots as flat with less wind drift than any of the big boomers I previously used. No recoil and very minimal muzzle blast.

It’s pretty impressive times we are living in.
 

Desert Fox

New member
Aug 14, 2006
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It all depend on the application. Small diameter cartridge like you mentioned here are all great at ranges 1000 yards or less for paper punching. It's even less if the target bleeds. I compete at Extreme Long Range shooting. In this discipline, size and horsepower reign supreme.
 

Thebear_78

Active member
Sep 30, 2004
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I was specifically speaking to long range shooting, not hunting.


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Guy Miner

Well-known member
Apr 6, 2006
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Thebear_78":36vz2pv0 said:
I was specifically speaking to long range shooting, not hunting.


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Ya, so was Desert Fox. :grin: He's shooting really crazy long ranges in competition, and it seems most of the competitors are using pretty doggone big cartridges.

I'm messing with a 6mm Creedmoor (NOT the 6.5) now and enjoying it. Have only taken it to 600 yet, but am sure it will prove to be a worthy 1,000 yard cartridge and... If I can, I'll stretch that range some.

That little 108 gr Hornady ELD-M bullet is pretty slick, and now the 110 gr ATip Hornady is avail... I honestly haven't even chronographed the 6 Creedmoor yet, but it's hitting nicely at 600, where Strelok predicted for a MV of 2960 fps. Probably close to that, and I'm not loading at max yet either.

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Good stuff. I'd thought about using that Ruger Precision Rifle for the PRS series, but... I think it's just becoming a longish range toy rifle for my own entertainment instead.

Regards, Guy
 

FOTIS

Moderator
Staff member
Oct 30, 2004
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building the one to the right currently! Pictured case before fire forming
 

Cleveland48

New member
Jul 28, 2015
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I started shooting out to 500 yards last summer, which is long range for around here lol. This summer I have stretched it out to 984 with great luck. That wind though, it can be a humbling experience lol. I have only shot the 6.5 CM at longer ranges at steel targets. When it come to deer I prefer them to me close enough to get burned from the muzzle [emoji1787]

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Guy Miner

Well-known member
Apr 6, 2006
16,179
49
Nearly 1,000 yards! Excellent.

Yes, elevation is simple. Wind... That's the bugaboo.

Hang in there.

Guy
 

remingtonman_25_06

Active member
Nov 17, 2005
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Yah that 22 creed is impressive, but you're not mentioning the fact it's a barrel eater and throat burner that goes south after 1000 rounds. Either way you look at it, there's no freebies. LR performance always comes at some price...Plus it's still lacking in the wind bucking department, which is your biggest factor in LR shooting, not elevation.
 

remingtonman_25_06

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Nov 17, 2005
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Give me a 6.5 or 7mm of whatever flavor in at least an 06' base case and itll do all 3, shoot a long ways, kill a long ways, and you still have twice to three times the barrel life. They do make muzzle brakes for recoil also, so that's a dismal point these days. My 15# 7-300 win mag with a 162g amax at 3175fps and a 4 port brake kicks like my 12# 223 varmint rifle...spot my own shots with the 20x leupold and could shoot it all day if I wanted.
 

Thebear_78

Active member
Sep 30, 2004
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Well the accompanying chart shows how it stacks up with wind drift, looks pretty good. I also stated not for hunting so the bleeding target comment isn’t really pertinent. I’m also betting your 7-300 win isn’t going to win any longevity records with barrel life. Barrels are perishable items, replacing them is just a part of the game if you shoot enough.

There are a great many excellent long range cartridges big and small that run the hammer from paper punchers go big game cartridges. I’m not sure why the 22 creedmoor is so offensive to you. No matter what you stack onto the end of your 300 it will never recoil less than the 22 creedmoor.

I suggest you shoot what you enjoy. I enjoy my little 22 creedmoor.


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remingtonman_25_06

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Nov 17, 2005
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It's not offensive, it's just a barrel burner. My 7-300 will last almost twice as long. I wouldn't shoot a cartridge strictly for paper at LR with 1000rds of barrel life, when there is better, that's all. It does beat those other rounds in wind for the simple fact it has the velocity to go with the BC...but again, it's done in a 1000 rounds.
 

Thebear_78

Active member
Sep 30, 2004
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I’ve only got 700 rounds thru my 22 creedmoor but I have a buddy who uses one as his long range coyote rifle. At last count he was at 1200+ rounds using 75-88gr bullets. Still going strong. It won’t bother me a bit if I only get 1000-1200 rounds out of this one, if I do then that means I’m getting out there and shooting, win win.

The beauty of choice is we can each build and shoot whatever strikes our fancy.

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remingtonman_25_06

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Nov 17, 2005
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Agreed. I've played with the idea of rebarreling my 223 to a 223AI with a 26-28" 8 twist to shoot the 80g eldms as a cheap 1K plinker that will last thousands of rounds. Just haven't done it yet. It's nothing special but will reach 1K fairly easy, just the wind you gotta deal with at that point.
 

jmad_81

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Feb 14, 2007
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When I built my 22 CM I went with a Proof Research barrel because I wanted to keep the weight down a bit and I figured it would last me 5 years....but as much as I enjoy shooting it, I'll have 1,400 rounds down it in a 2 year time span. I've never enjoyed shooting a rifle as much as I have this one. I can reach out to the 1,200 yard gong pretty easy. My next barrel will not be a carbon barrel. It doesn't make sense to me to replace it every two years with such a costly barrel. I figure the more I shoot it the better shooter I'm becoming and the more barrel life I'm saving on my larger hunting rounds. If I was putting the same number of rounds down the range to hone my skills with my bigger hunting rifles, I figure I'm saving enough in components to pay for the barrel in two years. The 22CM loaded with a 95 SMK is burning half the powder of the 28N or 338 RUM, bullet cost is half, and it is so much more fun to shoot. I mainly play at the range with it, but it also has 4 deer and around 12 coyotes on it in a year, it's pretty versatile, and just flat out fun. Could a 6.5CM run a barrel longer and be just as accurate, absolutely. But it will never scratch my need for speed.

Funny how we all justify things to ourselves.
 

Ridge_Runner

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Sep 29, 2006
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Any batch of bullets of the same BC, launched at the same velocity drift and drop exactly the same, regardless of weight or diameter. BC outruns velocity every time, but velocity is a plus, thats why big cartridges with high BC bullets reign supreme at long range, TOF matters with drift!
RR
 

SJB358

Well-known member
Dec 24, 2006
30,975
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jmad_81":1lgked1r said:
When I built my 22 CM I went with a Proof Research barrel because I wanted to keep the weight down a bit and I figured it would last me 5 years....but as much as I enjoy shooting it, I'll have 1,400 rounds down it in a 2 year time span. I've never enjoyed shooting a rifle as much as I have this one. I can reach out to the 1,200 yard gong pretty easy. My next barrel will not be a carbon barrel. It doesn't make sense to me to replace it every two years with such a costly barrel. I figure the more I shoot it the better shooter I'm becoming and the more barrel life I'm saving on my larger hunting rounds. If I was putting the same number of rounds down the range to hone my skills with my bigger hunting rifles, I figure I'm saving enough in components to pay for the barrel in two years. The 22CM loaded with a 95 SMK is burning half the powder of the 28N or 338 RUM, bullet cost is half, and it is so much more fun to shoot. I mainly play at the range with it, but it also has 4 deer and around 12 coyotes on it in a year, it's pretty versatile, and just flat out fun. Could a 6.5CM run a barrel longer and be just as accurate, absolutely. But it will never scratch my need for speed.

Funny how we all justify things to ourselves.

I will definitely be putting together a 22 CM soon. Probably a little lighter to carry in the SxS or other random places I'd want to have a rifle ready to roll.

I'd likely just run the plain old 77 Sierra Tipped Matchking or 88 ELD. Not the extreme range some of you shoot, but the fast 22's are just great all around'ers in my opinion. Good for younger or new hunters too.
 

truck driver

Active member
Mar 11, 2013
6,783
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I know this thread is getting long on legs but since I haven't been on here as much as I use to I thought I would comment about what we used in the last Twentieth century for long range shooting.
The 243 Win and the 6mm Rem in factory guns were the go to calibers along with the 257 Roberts.
The 222 Rem and the 222 Rem mag preceded the 22-250.
Winchester, Weatherby and Remington came on board with new and improved magnum cartridges to up date the older H&H cartridges design using the old gal's old design by straightening out the cartridge walls to increase powder capacity which increased pressure and velocity that the older rifles metallurgy couldn't handle.
There were tons of wildcat cartridges which some made it into factory offerings from the likes of P.O Ackley.
This is a great century to live in with all the new developments in the different cartridges developed and adopted by the bullet makers.
We didn't have the bullets back in the 60's and 70's that would hold up to the velocities that we see today in the smaller calibers.
A friend built a 6mm Rem AI that would push a 6mm bullet well past 4kfps but the only part of the bullet that would reach a 100yd target was the core that left a tiny pin point hole in the paper. You could watch the vapor trail with the naked eye almost like a tracer .
We went with the larger caliber cartridges because the bullets were stouter and would hold up to magnum velocities.
The 7mm magnum wild cats were the King of the day for long range shooting and hunting, 7-300Wby being the most popular.
The Mashburn wild cats were liked also but very little was said about them in the gun rags of the day.
For me the standard 257 Roberts was my go to caliber for long range varmints. I opted for a 1-12 twist barrel which would handle the lighter bullets with less stress at higher velocities that the bullets of the day could handle.
 
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salmonchaser

Active member
Dec 13, 2013
3,129
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My excuse for being so far behind on this stuff was guiding all summer. Little time to shoot. Absolutely amazing to me how accurate the tools are and how good the shooters are becoming.
 
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