what do you think ?

[jimbires]

what's your opinion on this brass ? should I use it , or scrap it ? is it discolored from their manufacturing process ? I don't like the looks of some of it . I bought it new , it's right out of the bag . if I remember right it cost roughly $3.00 per piece . anyone else have brass look like this ? thanks Jim

 

[mjcmichigan]

I wouldn’t flinch.

I’d use it.

My annealer will discolor brass, and I’ve noticed,
If for some reason I run it through the wet tumbler with
Lemishine and dawn.. the discoloration gets lighter and sometimes disappears…

I noticed it when I turned necks on some annealed 30.06.
They recommended oil on the inner neck and outer neck to keep it cooler…decided easiest way to make sure my necks were consistent, I tumbled them in lots of 50.. (4 separate lots)..some you can’t see the annealing marks.

Tumble them and see if the color shifts..

I’d use them.


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[JD338]

It should be fine.

JD338

 

[DrMike]

As others have already noted, I wouldn't hesitate to use it. All brass from Lapua shows evidence of the annealing, and that appears to be what you are seeing there.

 

[jimbires]

thanks for posting on this , I wanted a second opinion . I wanted to see if maybe I missed something . I took the above pic back in February I didn't like the looks of the brass .since then I made my mind up these were ok to use , just a cosmetic issue .

this past Sunday I shot some of these virgin cases . I had loaded 12 cases , 3 sets of 4 , for a seating depth test at minimum powder charge . the last shot things went south . the chrony was down about 200 FPS , the bolt was stuck , the magazine door was blown open . the case ruptured , blew back through the extractor groove . the shattered extractor pieces locked the bolt up . I got the bolt to turn , used a dead blow hammer to bump the bolt open . put a cleaning rod down the bbl , and that piece of brass fell out from the weight of the rod . I cleaned up the action , and bolt . I can chamber this piece of brass without any trouble , and it comes right out with the cleaning rod . I've been kicking my tail , I didn't keep track of the discolored brass , so I can't say if this is a piece of it . today it dawned on me to look at the other fired brass . 2 pieces are ok , 9 pieces are cracked at the neck shoulder junction ,and the 1 piece that ruptured is also split at the neck shoulder junction . it looks as though I got a bad batch of brass . this afternoon I called stiller , I have an extractor , spring , and pin on the way . I got to get things cleaned up . clean the trigger, jewel triggers don't like dirt . the chamber has a burn mark , but I think it looks worse than it is . the burn mark lines right up with the extractor , when the bolts closed . hopefully I get it back together and it's ok . couple of pics . thanks again guys , I appreciate it .

 

[wvbuckbuster]

Wow! Have never had that to happen. Dan.

 

[mjcmichigan]

Thanks for sharing. I think I’d go back to the manufacturer… typically when I’m reading on annealing or doing it, they say stay off the case. Sounds like in your first hand experience is consistent with the caution.

I’d add your wise caution probably saved your firearm. I might have been more aggressive on powder loads and that would have made it worse.


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[jimbires]

I didn't want to lead any opinions either way in my original post . I was hoping one of you guys would say heck no , you can't use that , and here is why . but we all had the same thoughts . I'm not sure the discolored markings on the brass have anything to do with it . I was trying to learn something out of this .


things could have been a lot worse . I was getting around 2800 FPS , this should run these bullets around 3050 - 3100 FPS at max loads . it must have been the piece of ejector with the spring that cut my arm , and my face got lightly peppered , I'm very thankful .

 

[PJGunner]

Somehow I missed your post yesterday or I would have been the one to to say the nay, don't use them. looked to me like they were over annealed and some of the evidence didn't polish out.
Still don't know how I missed your post. I am glad you were not seriously injured. When it comes to having doubt on a loading component, my feelings tend to be don't use them.
Paul B.

 

[gbflyer]

The milled out slot in the bolt where the extractor sits looks like it took a beating. Hard to tell from the pic though. Hope everything goes back together for you. I’d be tempted to send it to Stiller to check out.

 

[jimbires]

The milled out slot in the bolt where the extractor sits looks like it took a beating. Hard to tell from the pic though. Hope everything goes back together for you. I’d be tempted to send it to Stiller to check out.

the pic made it look bad . it blew some brass back through it . I have it cleaned up . I lightly rubbed it with a bore cleaning brush , then used a cleaning patch with bore cleaner . the pin came right out , I was worried it would be bent . I don't think any thing like this would have happened if the case rupture wasn't aligned with the extractor groove , but then the pressure wouldn't have escaped as easy . could have caused other trashed parts .

 

[ShadeTree]

Jim, I haven't been on here for a while, been slap busy. So I'm commenting playing Monday morning quarterback after the fact.

First of all and foremost, very thankful you were not substantially injured in any way. That kind of pressure letting loose 4" from your face can be life altering as I know you're aware. Really glad we're not hearing from you or somebody else about something worse.

After the fact, but there should never be heat evidence on the body of the case from my understanding of any annealing process. I always understood that to be a BIG no no.

I've no clue how those cases would look like that from the factory. On your picture of the cases, the heat line on annealed cases should extend below the shoulder at the farthest, down to about where the top of the discoloration is on the case that is second from the right.

Again, super glad it wasn't worse. Hope the manufacture is made aware of a major problem.

 

[jimbires]

you are correct , you should not heat the body or head of the case . heat the neck and shoulder area only .


I'm not even sure if it's a heat coloring . it shows no signs of heat , or discoloring inside the case . if the outside was this hot , I think the inside would show some color . I'm thinking it was from a cleaning wash , maybe ? I sure don't know , but wish I did . another thing , I fired 12 of these cases , 10 have cracked necks , makes me think I got a bad batch of brass .

 

[sako2]

Jim i've only saw brass turn that color from heat.

 

[Nimrod84]

I have to second what Sako2 wrote - I've only seen that discoloration from heat. Center grayish / black is hottest with the red / brown being lower temps.

I've had some virgin brass that went south on me with the first firing - cracked necks. It was either a bad batch or the cases were weakened by ammonia fumes as I kept the brass by my cleaning bench. No discoloration that I saw on the cases.

Ammonia fumes on cases can be read up on at: https://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/20 ... -solvents/

Acids, like ammonia or Lemishine, will do something kind of similar. It tends to look like the red / brown transitional patch the top cases have. Extreme exposure can do the grayish / black look. I sure wouldn't expect to see the red dots inside of the black on the top far right case with acid discoloration from a bad wash cycle.

A decent video is at: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxgn-IVVrk0 About 1:45 in, shows the affects of ammonia fumes on pipe.

Glad you are okay!