165 Sierra Gamechanger/Tipped Gameking (TGK) and 7 Mashburn

joelkdouglas

Handloader
Jun 5, 2011
1,310
3
I'm trying to use the 165 Sierra Tipped Gameking for elk this year. I've learned a lot from using a 7 Mashburn/wildcat and I'm getting close to figuring it out. Much thanks to Bob, Scotty, Matt, Dober for their assistance.

Long story that I will omit, but here's an image of 3 seating depths of the 165 Sierra Tipped Gameking. Doesn't appear to be overly seating depth sensitive. My next step will be to work up a consistent powder charge with Scotty's 10-shot load development step.

What seating depth would you use going forward? These are all 6-shot groups, left side of the target board. The top left is 0.02 off, middle left is 0.05 off, bottom left is 0.075 off.

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And honestly I'd take any of these groups elk hunting out to 500. Thanks ladies and gents!
 
Be careful and pick your shots. They are soft. The video on you tube that sierra features shows them as tough. Going through bone and ballistic gel . What they did not tell you is they were driven at 2500 fps........
 
I would shoot some into jugs and try to recover them before I would make a commitment on a bullet that is new and untried.
All your groups look good to me also but I think the .070" would be the one to use. As you seated shorter your groups shrank from the looks of them in your pictures.
 
Thanks for the comments re: bullet toughness. I’m concurrently working with some 150 Ballistic Tips also, Nosler doesn’t recommend it for elk but it’s got a long and proven track record as an elk killer.

In general I’m using bullets that aren’t as tough this year, my 30-06 has 200 ELD-Xs in it. And I hope to fill my general tag with a bow!


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I took some time to get away from work to just shoot a 10-round velocity check.

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After work I deprimed the cases and re-primed them to check the primer pocket tightness. This rifle just shows pressure signs earlier than some other Mashburns. I think I'm going with 69.2 grains. Right in the middle of a node, tight primer pockets, no ejection marks on the brass. This winter I'll continue to work to identify if I can get more velocity, but I'll probably try 160 Accubonds and 150 Sciroccos first thing. Elk rifle opens in 13 days.

I ran numbers through a ballistic calculator, the difference between 3000 fps and 3100 fps is essentially nill out to past 500 yards. I'm using a Leupold 6x36 LRD with holdover dots at 2.19 MOA and 4.8 MOA. Zeroed at 275 yards (about 2.8 inches high at 100) the dots are within 3 inches of aim at 400 and 500 yards, respectively. Not exact, but close enough for elk.
 
Your groups look good, minute of elk for sure.
Stay off the shoulders and you'll be dining on backstraps.
Good luck to you this season!

JD338
 
It looks like .075 is the spot. That should be an easy shooting load at 3000.

We’re you getting pressure problems higher up Joel?

I’m with the others, I might not try busting leg bones with them but they aren’t going to walk away from them either. I think they will be pretty deadly on rib shots.
 
SJB358":rup0p2jj said:
It looks like .075 is the spot. That should be an easy shooting load at 3000.

We’re you getting pressure problems higher up Joel?

I’m with the others, I might not try busting leg bones with them but they aren’t going to walk away from them either. I think they will be pretty deadly on rib shots.

I'm seeing pressure with all the powders I've tried (H1000, Retumbo, IMR7828, RL26) above 3100 fps with this 165. It is a really long bullet, so maybe acting more like a 175 than a 160. The ejection marks don't really bother me, but I don't want to be wasting RWS brass by pushing it too much and having loose primer pockets! This 165 is seated pretty deep in the case too, reduces case capacity and probably generates more pressure.

I will start over with Winchester brass when I have some more time; I started this load with RWS and after some reading the case capacity of the RWS is quite a bit less than the Winchester. It could be showing more pressure just because of that.
 
I’ve been tinkering with the 165 in my stw and had excellent results with magnum powder. I want to parrot what some others are saying-it’s a soft bullet! I shot several in milk jugs using 7 in a row at 100 yards with a muzzle velocity of 3150 fps (average of 5 shots)-the bullet demolished the first two and penetrated four and was clinging to the back of the fourth jug. At these velocities it acts very similar to a ballistic tip in my opinion. Probably a better long range bullet and certainly for deer but I would wait for a heavier weight before I shot them for elk!
Someone is gonna get on here and tell me they killed a zillion elk with whatever bullet but the reality is-there are better bullets for really big tough game! At these velocities anyway. . .
 

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E11F3127-ABF3-4904-99C6-B83874C27462.jpegDon’t get me wrong-I love the Gamechanger bullet-I found them very forgiving to load and typical expected accuracy from Sierra. Maybe “soft” isn’t the right term, but the tip certainly makes them expand with authority.
Here is my rifle and a ground squirrel that popped up at 200 yards while I was working up my loads for this bullet rifle combo. Trophy bull Range squirrel at 200 yards in back of neck which is where I called it.
 

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The .050” off the lands group looks as good as the 0.075” one to me. Perhaps better.

I’d go for a slightly mild load and forget chasing speed. That thing has horsepower to burn!
 
hahaha-through and through on the squirrel. weight retention was 82 grains which was surprising. The base of the bullet had not washed out in the jugs. In my experience the water jugs are meaner to bullets than animals are. Ill try the experiment again at 2 or 300 yards and see what it looks like but my shooting range is currently impinged by the largest wildfire in the country. . .or something along those lines.
 
It held up better than I’d guess. Maybe Sierra used a bit thicker base. I wouldn’t be worried about it. If the shots true that is.
 
Just so I can reference it in a couple weeks again...

Here it is at 100.

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Many of my 100 yard groups are not outstanding. This is 69.2 gr IMR7828SSC with the 165 Sierra TGK 0.075 off the lands. I can start with another powder (I have plenty of H1000, IMR7977, RL26, and Retumbo) and play more with seating depth.

But good enough for elk, here it is at 300 yards.

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I think you’ll be good buddy.

Making our first Taco Johns stop. See you in a bit!
 
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