Reduced recoil load bullet selection

Toying around with some reduced recoil loads using H4895 for a couple new hunters/shooters I'm mentoring. I'm looking for a final product similar to the Remington Managed Recoil or Hornady Custom Lite loads. MVs of 2200-2300fps and impacts speeds possibly as low as 1600fps. Mainly thinking .308 and 6.5CM loads at this point and trying to keep the recoil under 10 ft/lbs.

Dropping back some bullet weight to get the MV up a bit, but also want to load a softer bullet.

The Remington folks use a Core-Lokt and the Hornady guys use the SST...is there a better choice I'm overlooking?

The monometal and controlled expansion bullets I'm most familiar with are all out for this project and I haven't used a soft cup and core in a couple of decades at this point.

Hodgeman, I'm gonna steer you away from Core Lokts in reduced loads. They are a really good cup and core bullet in a variety of calibers at typical bullet weights for those cartridges. 100 gr .243, 150 gr .308, 180 gr .308 for tougher animals, etc.

All the ones I've dealt with are at the top of the toughness chart with cup and core bullets when comparing matching bullet weights and calibers. Really good cup and core bullet, but I wouldn't think they'd be very impressive with reduced loads. Too tough.

Hodgeman in the CM, would you have to go with reduced loads to get to your target recoil level?

By my calculations using Hodgdon's load data, with a 120 gr bullet and H4895 even with a max charge they aren't bad. With a 7 lb rifle and a max charge it still would be just over 10lbs of recoil. A starting load would be under 10 lbs.

Yeah, I'm not a big fan of Core-Lokts as a component bullet. If I'm going to roll my own, I'd like to use something more suited.

I know the SST has a reputation (like several Hornady offerings) of being very soft. I'd never use one in a full load- but I do wonder about it in a reduced load.I also have little experience with Speer or Sierra either.

ShadeTree":s3645qgj said:

Hodgeman in the CM, would you have to go with reduced loads to get to your target recoil level?

By my calculations using Hodgdon's load data, with a 120 gr bullet and H4895 even with a max charge they aren't bad. With a 7 lb rifle and a max charge it still would be just over 10lbs of recoil. A starting load would be under 10 lbs.

Click to expand...

Yeah- in a more or less standard weight rifle, the regular ammo would be just fine. In my lightweight (5 pound) 6.5 Barrett, it can get pretty jumpy for a young kid to shoot much. A little less pop is probably a better bet.

hodgeman":37is4x4q said:

ShadeTree":37is4x4q said:

Hodgeman in the CM, would you have to go with reduced loads to get to your target recoil level?

By my calculations using Hodgdon's load data, with a 120 gr bullet and H4895 even with a max charge they aren't bad. With a 7 lb rifle and a max charge it still would be just over 10lbs of recoil. A starting load would be under 10 lbs.

Click to expand...

Yeah- in a more or less standard weight rifle, the regular ammo would be just fine. In my lightweight (5 pound) 6.5 Barrett, it can get pretty jumpy for a young kid to shoot much. A little less pop is probably a better bet.

Click to expand...

Oh, that does change things. That's an automatic 40% increase in recoil over a 7lb gun.

There is a 308 CTBT RN made for 3030 speeds. It’s a good choice


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If you can find any SSP bullets (single shot pistol) that various manufacturers have produced, they re designed for that exact velocity range. Short of that don't hesitate calling a couple cup and core bullet manufacturers and ask them.

My experience was with 120 Hornady SSP bullets in a 7 BR rifle for my daughter; she killed 4 deer with that before graduating to a 7-08. First deer was as a 110# 10 year old!

Lastly I helped a friend 2 yrs ago get his 13 yr old grandson setup. It was a 243 with 70% load of H4895; 2600+ fps with an 80 gr Sierra Varmit bullet as recommended by Sierra. ( I called them and very helpful)
Velocity was the key to their recommendation. That load worked successfully on 2 antelope and 1 mile deer. Good luck, it ll be great fun getting it all figured out!

Look to the venerable 30-30 for your bullet salvation needs! You have a long standing bullet selection designed for that 2000-2400fps velocity range. There are also several bullets geared towards the 300 BLK that fit the bill.

I went straight to 125gr bullets in the 308 to start my son out. Lots of trailboss and 150 sat @ 1600fps for practice. I was loading 125 BT and 130 TTSX for hunting loads.

Good bullet choices

Hornady
130 FXT
110 zmax
125 JHP

Speer
110 HOTCOR
130 JHP
130 JFP
150 JFP
150 SBT

Sierra
125 Ph
125 PHFN
150 JFN
150 JRN

Nosler
110 etip
125 BT
150 CTBT






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if your gonna run them slow I wouldn't be afraid to use a v-max or the lighter ballistic tips even for deer hunting. I've taken many deer with those bullets in smaller cartridges (6mm PPC and 30 Herrett) a cup core bullet works better at lower velocities anyways, I've shot deer at 800 yards with ballistic tips and can't tell the difference between them and an AccuBond.
RR

I’ve done the Hornady FTX 160gn for a 303 savage (that is a 308 caliber as well). At 2200 FPS, it’s dumped three for three white tail deer

I really liked Bears list.


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I’ve done the Hornady FTX 160gn for a 303 savage (that is a 308 caliber as well). At 2200 FPS, it’s dumped three for three white tail deer

I really liked Bears list.


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Just to add to along the lines of what Bear posted about 30-30 bullets. Not necessarily a bonified reduced load but I bet it runs around 2400 or so.

I know a guy that loads 170 gr FP's in a 308 for his daughter. 40 grains of IMR 4895.

This load was made because of having to track deer hit behind the shoulder with low end loads with standard 150 grain bullets at woods ranges.

This load ended that. The flat point along with a more frangible design meant for the slower 30-30 speeds, according to him makes for a deer stopper that she can handle to shoot.

I could be wrong but in the 6.5 CM I would think you could go with the 100gr NBT and push the velocity up a little to insure bullet upset and still be in the target recoil range.

Bruce

Great information, I don't have nearly the experience of you gentleman, gonna keep following and learning, Thank you!

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Since this here is Nosler, the 120 BT for the Crede and a 125 BT for the 308. Did a bunch of loading with 123 AMaxs and 120 BTs in my Swede at around 2400 all using H4895. Its worked excellent in every cartridge I’ve tried them in.

I loaded up some lighter loads in 308Win for my daughter. I still wanted expansion so I used Rem 150gr RN bullets for the 30-30. They are designed to preform at lower speeds and she would not be shooting over 250 yards. Another good bullet for deer or plinking is the Speer 130gr HO. I have taken many deer and several pronghorns with this on in normal loads in the 308Win and 30-06.

I load my son's .308 down to about 2425 with H 4895 and 150 Speer BTSP bullets. It's very accurate and I think that bullet does a nice job of opening at low velocities, as well as having a good BC to retain energy for longer shots. I fired one into jugs once and it went through 4 gallon jugs (would have been into the 5th, if it hadn't squirted out the side). I found it, separated, but a nice mushroom; about 60% retention if you only count the core, 79% if you count the jacket, too.

My first experiment with H4895 went very well. I loaded up some 129gr Interlocks over 23.6gr H4895 (70% of max).

At 100 yards, the 5 shot group printed just over MOA, 2" below the POA of my 143ELDX hunting load. It would be a simple matter to give it 8 clicks up for a 100yd zero.

Recoil was extremely light. I couldn't tell any difference in recoil between this load and the .223 I was working with as well today. It will be perfect for introducing youth or other recoil shy individuals to centerfire shooting.

Anyone with QL care to run a projected velocity? I'm guessing 2k ish in the 18" barrel.