Why match bullets for game?

Not trying to flame or troll anyone, just wondering, and hoping for a healthy debate which I know the ladies and gentlemen on here are capable of. Why would anyone use match bullets for hunting rather than any of the superb selection of hunting bullets currently available. I see this on multiple forums, shooting XXX brand match bullet for game. Can't imagine any real or imagined gain in BC or accuracy potential would be worth the sacrifice in terminal ballistics.

I used to think the same thing and still do for the most part but some of the match bullets such as the AMax, Bergers, Lapua Scenar's and similar get used a bunch and guys seem to do real well with them. I have taken a bunch of smaller animals with the Sierra Tipped Matchking and it has worked well. I don't know that it really hurts anything since most people using bullets like that aren't attempting shots at point blank ranges and are targeting ribs or high percentage shots.

For deer and such, a quicker opening bullet is a great thing in my opinion. Once you get beyond that sized animal I like a bullet that expands and stays wide while holding onto that frontal area.

I guess it comes down to preference since we all get to pick the cars/trucks we drive and what sorta cell phone we use. Same goes for the bullets we put in our guns.

I'm of the opinion that it is much wiser to use bullets designed for the game at hand. That said, if a match bullet preformed as well then why not? Maybe a bigger deal 20 or 30 years ago? Now days there are some game bullets that are pretty close to match accuracy wise. At least, they are more accurate than needed.

For big game, I want to go with a bullet that provides dependable on game performance. Match bullets are great for paper and steel but not game. They are not designed or tested for hunting. In my opinion, we owe it to the animals we hunt to use the right bullet for a quick humane kill.

JD338

JD338":sr2w66j9 said:

For big game, I want to go with a bullet that provides dependable on game performance. Match bullets are great for paper and steel but not game. They are not designed or tested for hunting. In my opinion, we owe it to the animals we hunt to use the right bullet for a quick humane kill.

JD338

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+1
The only match grade bullets I've used was on varmints where I didn't want over penetration and an explosive results before they started making varmint bullets..

...the design concepts are different. While a hunting bullet usually includes accuracy & B.C. in it's design the core is 'consistent terminal performance', expansion, penetration. The features that make a good 'hunting' bullet, like tapered jackets, etc., aren't generally used in 'match' bullets. Results can vary from 'perfect' to massive superficial wounds w/ no penetration to complete penetration w/ a minimal wound channel, either resulting in the probable death, just not where & when you wanted it. For me the theoretical gains in accuracy or distance aren't worth the liability, so I, personally, don't recommend match ammo for hunting...

To me, match bullet construction goes back to the early days of smokeless powder. Sure the BCs and the quality control are better, but the cores are typically soft and the jackets are thin.

The hunting community got away from that type of design decades ago- I just don't think going back to it because the accuracy is "better" is a great idea. Just like years ago, you can kill stuff with them...but there are much better bullet designs that are much more reliable. Even the company that hosts this forum got its start because of a bullet failure using turn of the century designed bullets.

I get the "match" bullet mentality- especially for the current folks looking to shoot animals at long range. I just can't get comfortable with it. If the critter is so far away you need a hyper accurate, super soft match bullet, that just looks like a compromise in terminal performance in favor of range.

I've shot quite a few animals in the last few decades and our modern bullets just perform so much better than what was out there just a few years ago- I can't see wanting to go backward in terms of terminal performance.

I shoot match hunting projectiles... They are supposed to maintain terminal performance but still be"match" quality and have a high BC. I'm also restricted to non-lead projectiles, so using something like the A-MAX our ELD-X isn't an option

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I think most guys shooting match bullets for hunting understand what's going on . what bullet it takes to properly work under " their " hunting conditions . if anything I think most hunters are going way to far the other way . from reading on these forums I get the impression that if you're not using a bonded , mono , or Partition of some type bullet , you are using to frangible of a bullet to hunt deer with .

Polaris":26bcp967 said:

Not trying to flame or troll anyone, just wondering, and hoping for a healthy debate which I know the ladies and gentlemen on here are capable of. Why would anyone use match bullets for hunting rather than any of the superb selection of hunting bullets currently available. I see this on multiple forums, shooting XXX brand match bullet for game. Can't imagine any real or imagined gain in BC or accuracy potential would be worth the sacrifice in terminal ballistics.

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I jumped on to answer a pm and saw this and agree with you sir. I can not image not using the best hunting bullet available when one takes the field. Regardless of what we are hunting, animals like the Elephant, Buffalo, Lion, Crocodile, Hippo, Rhino, Leopard or even a Honey Badger might take note of me, while I am strolling through the countryside.

Best Regards

Jamila

Africa Huntress":38itv6oq said:

Polaris":38itv6oq said:

Not trying to flame or troll anyone, just wondering, and hoping for a healthy debate which I know the ladies and gentlemen on here are capable of. Why would anyone use match bullets for hunting rather than any of the superb selection of hunting bullets currently available. I see this on multiple forums, shooting XXX brand match bullet for game. Can't imagine any real or imagined gain in BC or accuracy potential would be worth the sacrifice in terminal ballistics.

Click to expand...

I jumped on to answer a pm and saw this and agree with you sir. I can not image not using the best hunting bullet available when one takes the field. Regardless of what we are hunting, animals like the Elephant, Buffalo, Lion, Crocodile, Hippo, Rhino, Leopard or even a Honey Badger might take note of me, while I am strolling through the countryside.

Best Regards

Jamila

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Attack of the Honey Badger :shock: seriously they are a very ferocious
critter. I saw one on the Animal Planet take on a pride of young Lions that wanted to eat it and was able to beat the Lions off. :grin:

If I'm going to punch ribs I'm using a Berger VLD Hunting.


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There is a considerable amount of overlap in the performance characteristics of "match" bullets and "hunting" bullets.

In the older Hornady reloading manual they recommended the A-Max (match) bullets for hunting thin skinned big game animals, presumably whitetails, antelope and the like. I used a 162gr A-Max for years and killed a truck load of deer with them. Performance was excellent.

The original Berger "match" bullets are now their "hunting" bullets in a different box. The newer match bullets have heavier jackets and either seem to kill game reliably and have a big following.

More bullets are probably shot at deer then all other biggame animals combined. All that you need is the centuries old Coreloct to get the job done but working with the super tough or incredibly accurate bullets of today sure is fun.

Some years ago, hearing of the great success of the Berger VLD long range match bullet on game, I investigated more. Found that there had been a LOT of highly successful use of the VLD on game. Trying to be open minded, and knowing from my own experience that the Berger VLD could be very accurate, I thought I'd give 'em a try.

I have to admit, that for mule deer, they were great for me! I used the 115 gr Berger VLD at about 3200 fps from my 25-06 Rem 700 CDL on three mule deer. Each was an instant drop! Ranges were 175, 230 and 400 yards. Not one of those three walked a step after being hit.

In each case there was a pin-sized entry hole, penetration through the muscle, then total destruction of organs in the chest cavity of the animal. No wonder death was so quick!

For deer sized game, I remain impressed with the Berger. For larger game? I have no personal experience. I do like my Noslers and have gone back to them even for deer sized game, my favorite deer bullet being the Nosler Ballistic Tip in .25 and .30 calibers.

Regards, Guy

I guess I came from the other side of the spectrum... I shot a fox one time with a Hornady 165gr Interlock at about 20'. That bullet came unglued and disintegrated without exiting. The fox died of course, but considering what sort of bigger animal might have been in the scope, it was obvious the bullet wasn't up to the task.

After that, tougher bullets became my normal.

Bullets like the VLD work well out there where they slow down a bit, but up close or at an angle- I'd bet it could get ugly.

Africa Huntress":36cozfma said:

Polaris":36cozfma said:

Not trying to flame or troll anyone, just wondering, and hoping for a healthy debate which I know the ladies and gentlemen on here are capable of. Why would anyone use match bullets for hunting rather than any of the superb selection of hunting bullets currently available. I see this on multiple forums, shooting XXX brand match bullet for game. Can't imagine any real or imagined gain in BC or accuracy potential would be worth the sacrifice in terminal ballistics.

Click to expand...

I jumped on to answer a pm and saw this and agree with you sir. I can not image not using the best hunting bullet available when one takes the field. Regardless of what we are hunting, animals like the Elephant, Buffalo, Lion, Crocodile, Hippo, Rhino, Leopard or even a Honey Badger might take note of me, while I am strolling through the countryside.

Best Regards

Jamila

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Hodgeman, the last time you were hunting did you run into any Elephants ?, Rodger, any Rhino's where you hunt ? Dr Mike, Do you stumble across quite a few Hippo's up your way, Charles, excluding any red heads you know, do you run into a lot of Lions in Texas ?

Believe me Jamila, if I was to take an evening stroll where you live, I would also only use hunting bullets, and good ones!

O.K. excluding all that, my response to this thread, mirrors Hodgeman;s post above

Europe":3mxn7nvl said:

Africa Huntress":3mxn7nvl said:

Polaris":3mxn7nvl said:

Not trying to flame or troll anyone, just wondering, and hoping for a healthy debate which I know the ladies and gentlemen on here are capable of. Why would anyone use match bullets for hunting rather than any of the superb selection of hunting bullets currently available. I see this on multiple forums, shooting XXX brand match bullet for game. Can't imagine any real or imagined gain in BC or accuracy potential would be worth the sacrifice in terminal ballistics.

Click to expand...

I jumped on to answer a pm and saw this and agree with you sir. I can not image not using the best hunting bullet available when one takes the field. Regardless of what we are hunting, animals like the Elephant, Buffalo, Lion, Crocodile, Hippo, Rhino, Leopard or even a Honey Badger might take note of me, while I am strolling through the countryside.

Best Regards

Jamila

Click to expand...

Hodgeman, the last time you were hunting did you run into any Elephants ?, Rodger, any Rhino's where you hunt ? Dr Mike, Do you stumble across quite a few Hippo's up your way, Charles, excluding any red heads you know, do you run into a lot of Lions in Texas ?

Believe me Jamila, if I was to take an evening stroll where you live, I would also only use hunting bullets, and good ones!

O.K. excluding all that, my response to this thread, mirrors Hodgeman;s post above

Click to expand...

Well there are no 4 legged Rhinos in my area but there are plenty of 2 leg Rhinos , Elephants and Hippos around but not legal to hunt or shoot unless you have a good Lawyer to prove self defense. :mrgreen:

Something interesting that has been pointed out about the Berger VLD - is that it actually expands slower, later, than pretty much any other expanding hunting bullet. At first.

Most expanding type hunting bullets start expanding on impact.

Not the Berger VLD. It penetrates several inches, plenty enough to get into the chest cavity. THEN it expands like crazy. Berger didn't design it to do this, they designed it to win long-range matches. Hunters and reloading tinkers started messing with them, and Berger heard about their success. Then a rather extensive testing program (on wild hogs, etc) was embarked upon. Before the company decided to start promoting them as hunting bullets too.

Most folks don't get that part about the delayed expansion, and very tiny entrance holes... I've seen it on all three mule deer I dropped.

Guy

Like many maturing hunters and shooters, I prefer to use the components designed and tested, that will provide reliable performance on the intended game. I too have experimented and gained experience with magnum cartridges, and respect what levels of performance that they provide. But I still limit their use on game in the field to the ranges that I feel comfortable with through practice. I find that I am enjoying shooting and hunting more with milder cartridges. I also enjoy the hunt and the skill required that brings me closer to my intended game before taking the shot.

Because of this I do not believe that I need higher BC numbers from my bullets that will make up for flatter trajectories and higher retained energy figures needed to provide reliable penetration and expansion to give quick, clean harvests on game at longer ranges. So I do not feel the need to press target or match bullets into hunting service that others may. When the manufacturer tells us that they cannot gaurantee on-game performance with their match bullets, why put an animal through the chance of a questionable harvest? Just my opinion...others are entitled to their own. But if someone wants to test match bullets on a brown bear, just do not ask me to back them up!

I have found that most of the bullets that I have tried to date are capable of better accuracy than I can provide from field positions, so again, not tempted to use match bullets for hunting.

In this AO, because shots may be anywhere from quite near to Waaaaaay out there, I tend to stick with bullets designed to maintain integrity at high terminal velocity to providing a reasonable expansion at lower velocities. Also, since I may encounter anything from a coyote or wolf to a grizzly, I want a bit of integrity giving me a measure of confidence that the bullet will reach the innards. I tend toward premium bullets. I love the Partition and the AccuBond. I like monolithic bullets; I have enjoyed good results with the E-Tip and the TSX. A cup-and-core bullet is better than a stick in the eye in a pinch, but if launched from a magnum cartridge, it may not perform as well as I want on large game in close quarters. I cannot fault Bergers, though I have no used them myself on game. I am fully aware of people I trust who have taken grizzlies and elk with Bergers (and from reasonably mild cartridges); however, they are not my first choice. Part of that is curmudgeon status, undoubtedly.