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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2019 8:29 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 6:44 am
Posts: 1807
Location: Sandy, Utah
Love a .308 , to me its just a "30-06 in a smaller action/lighter rifle". "Maybe" if we got into the 200-240 weights from an '06 on Rhino/Elephant it "might" be better ( compared to a 308 with a 200 Nosler or 180 Barnes, etc.) AK47s and FMJ have wiped out many herds of each by poachers! My M1A tricked out Springfield seems to shoot the South African 147 surplus to 1000k at and hit breadbox size rocks just fine! I shoot the same rock/distance with an M1 30-06/150 Remington fmj target ammo. The M1A just doesn't go "ping" after 8 rds....about the only difference I can tell, ha. War with an M16 sucks, rather have an M60 or M14.


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2019 6:37 pm 

Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:04 pm
Posts: 150
Location: WI
I am a little late on this one. For 25yrs I hunted with my trusty 7400 in 308 and piled up a bunch of deer. Now in the last 5 yrs my 308s (I have 2 of them) and 30-06 just sit in back of the safe to no fault of theirs. My 6mm and 6.5mm Creeds are so accurate that they are the first grab to do range work.


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 7:04 pm 

Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 9:05 pm
Posts: 338
The 308 Win is neither new nor special in the sense that it catches attention for what it can do. It can do damn near anything a non-magnum can do. Period. As a service rifle it’s great—-M-1As and M-24s. As a plains game rifle it does it very well.
It’s not dead. It’s a jewel.

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Speed is great, but nothing beats accuracy----Wyatt Earp


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 7:22 pm 

Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:29 am
Posts: 2
In my opinion the 308 win is best "deer rifle" you can have. Most any thing short of half mile shooting in the mountains can be done with it. With right bullet, you can take anything from coyote to black bear. 308 was the first hunting rifle I bought, killed my first deer with it. And after 16 years and 6 other calibers I own the 308 is still my go to round for hunting. The 308 win is an older round but it is golden one in my book.

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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:11 pm 

Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 10:13 pm
Posts: 1381
"It's funny, people who spit on the .308 but gush about the '06 often fail to realize that modern .308 loads exactly duplicate the ballistics that made the '06's vaunted reputation as a world wide hunting cartridge. I've had a bunch of them, I never found it wanting."

I like the .308. Probably my favorite deer rifle, when I hunted deer, was a Ruger M77 RSI in .308 Win. pushing the 165 gr. Speer Hot core at 2550 FPS. I couldn't get it to go faster from that 18.5" barrel. That same load did 2610 FPS from the 22" barrel of a Winchester M70 I have. Powder was W760, WLR primer and Winchester brass. Killed deer just fine. Closest shot was about 35 feet, the longest at 250 yards laser measured.
The only place where I give way to the 30-06 is maybe with heavier bullets and maybe not by much. I once did a velocity comparison, 180 gr. Winchester Power Point ammo for the M70 and a 30-06 Remington M700. :roll: Probably should have run a few through the RSI for spits and grins. Long story short there wasn't a nickel's worth of difference between the two I'd spot maybe 30 FPS tops for the 06, if that much. I also brought a Mauser custom 24" and Ruger #1 26" barreled 30-06 rifles along to see how speed might be affected. The Mauser was a bit faster by 40 to 50 FPS and the Ruger was the only one to even come close to the advertised 2700 FPS.
Heavier bullets in the .308? I never did much with 180 and 200 gr. bullets but did do a test series with the 220 gr. Sierra round nose and W760. I have an earlier copy of those One Book/One Caliber manuals for the .308 that showed data for a 220 gr. bullet. Showed the max charge to be 44.0 gr. for 2295 FPS at 46,900 C.U.P. Velocity over the chronograph was 2320 FPS. :shock: (y) Now that speed won't make magnum lovers jump for joy but two things come to mind. In the early days of the 30-06, many experienced hunters believed the 30-40 Krag's 220 round nose load at 2000 FPS later raised to 2200 FPS was a better elk cartridge than the 06 because the bullets held up better when from the Krag. I've never gotten around to running some 220 gr. 06 ammo over the Chrony but based on what the 180 gr. loads did, it wouldn't surprise me if a factory 220 gr. 06 was much, if any faster than my load for the .308. FWIW, I did run a few though the 18.5" RSI over the Chrony and it did surprisingly well in speed and accuracy. I got 2230 FPS from that short barrel with lots of flash and a very loud report. That's at the Krag level in a reasonably lightweight rifle. Accuracy was at the 2.0 to 2.5" level at 100 yards. If I though shot where I might be hunting would be 200 yards or less, I'd use that load.
Paul B.


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 Post subject: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:41 pm 

Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2018 8:52 am
Posts: 133
I picked me up another junk 308 this week!


Last edited by coop22250 on Thu Oct 24, 2019 6:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2019 3:12 pm 

Joined: Mon Oct 30, 2017 7:17 pm
Posts: 71
Sounds awesome I have two 308 AR’s and in bolts I have a Rem 700 270 win with a 1-8 twist, a custom 700 Rem 284 win with a 28” 1-8 twist and Rem 700 338 win Mag I hand load them all and I have wanted a Rem 700 308 26” Sendero profile 1-9 twist rifle. I can get 2,450 out of my 20” AR with a 225 gr HPBT which is sick. With the new modern powder choices and a custom throat you can compete with the 30 06. The 308 is just such a efficient and versatile round. Love it. Since all my Rem 700,s are Remage set ups I could just order a barrel and switch out either the 284 or 270 depending on what I want to shoot. Love the 308


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 6:33 am 

Joined: Tue May 01, 2007 9:05 am
Posts: 719
I would say I'm not a hater and only owned one for a short time and never fired it. I won it at a Bar in a pool as I bought a square for $3. The Rifle was a Savage 99 in .308 I gave it to my Brother for Christmas that year.
I have a 6mm Rem a .264 Win Mag and 300 H&H Mag just didn't see a need for a .308 and my younger Brother had yet to get a Rifle as he was much younger.
He never did fire it either as he was in the Army and injured in a accident and will never hunt with it or use.
It still sits in my Fathers Gun safe in new condition.
Some day I will most likely get it back and I might have to get into the woods.


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 11:12 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2016 7:29 am
Posts: 821
The .308 has been the standard for accuracy a long time. Still is in my opinion.
Yes, the 6.5 Creedmoore may be a hair more accurate, and flatter shooting. But it still has to live up to the .308 reputation.
Nothing wrong with the .308, it just Palin works, and you can get pin point accuracy on a game animal.
Target punchers can still use it to get the job done.

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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 12:42 pm 

Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 10:13 pm
Posts: 1381
I do remember the first .308 I bought, a Remington 660. I thought it was ugly as sin and kicked like an angry mule. At that time I really didn't respect the cartridge thinking it was just a 30-06 wannabe. I bought it because it was cheap ($99.95 plus tax) but mostly because it was much lighter in weight than my 1909A3 sporter that weighed out at almost ten pounds. Between that rifle and the fact I was a severe heavy chain smoker at the time the little 660 looked good to me. For the record, I quit smoking in 1975. For my birthday, the kids got me some of those ear muffs used for hearing protection and when I shot that 660 while wearing them, WOW! where did the kick go. It was the muzzle blast that made me think the recoils was so stiff. Live and learn. I've learned that if I'm properly concentrating on the sight picture/shot I don't seem to hear the bang, especially when on game.

Ruger RSI, also in .308.I had it restocked to fit me with a Bishop Mannlicher style and it still kicked like that very angry mule. Well I'd worked up a top load using the 150 gr. Sierra Pro-hunter and H335 powder. I don't remember what brass I used but the first animal I shot was a badger at roughly 150 yards, give or take. That's what it paced off to. That deer season I shot a running Mule Deer my hunting partner had wounded at what turned out to be 426 paces averaged out between the three of us. I was getting a serious like for that rifle. I used it on just about every deer hunt I did in Nevada and for a few here in Arizona until I got. In the meantime the 660 got a new stock. I forget what Precision called it but the material was called fiberthane and the stock was really really lightweight. Scope on the gun is an old Weaver 3X with post and crosshair and will still punch out 1.0 to 1.25" groups when I do my part. So, yes, I've learned to respect the .308 Winchester. (y)
Paul B.


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 7:34 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2012 6:44 am
Posts: 1807
Location: Sandy, Utah
My "308" now is a reduced load I made up in my recently acquired 300WM CA Mesa, ha. I am going about 2750-2800 with the Hornady 150 SST. I figure, hey, no use hammering a deer where I normally hunt them...I recall my "average range" on mule deer is around 75yds! I like to hug the edges of dark timber/aspens and even sneak up game trails in the timber. My furthest shot on an Axis buck in Del Rio, Tx was with a 308, right at 230yds. It was while the BT was still "soft" and I purposely used the 165gr, less soft lead in the shorter nose than the 180NBT I had previously been using, also in a 300 WM. I never got to clock that load, but in a 22" Mod 70 FWT I suspect 2600fps. Complete penetration btw.


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2019 8:29 am 

Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2019 11:49 am
Posts: 67
Like so many things in this world today there is a lack of respect for elders, tradition and history. Nothing wrong at all with the old .308. I don’t shoot one but I certainly wouldn’t feel under gunned or out classed if I was carrying one. But, I hunt differently than most and everything I do happens from 0-400 yards and a.308 has that covered. I suppose if I was in a blind shooting over a field I might want or need something different.


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 2:58 am 

Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2011 3:39 pm
Posts: 614
Location: Western Michigan
.308 Win is boringly predictable and doesn’t make the gun & ammo companies a ton of money in new sales.

But it kills stuff as dead as can be, does so with regularity and authority, is typically accurate, and ammo is available in most places where such things are sold.

Same goes for the .30-06 which will take a trip with me (as it always does) as backup rifle this fall.

Those dumb articles are meant to raise hackles; the gun mag equal to an internet troll.


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 10:18 am 

Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 8:42 am
Posts: 14484
Location: Washington State
What's funny, is that the same author, Ron Spomer, also published an article about a year ago talking about how the 308 was a wiser choice than the 30-06...

He does like to stir up controversy. I enjoy his articles. Ya just gotta read 'em with a sense of humor. His is there, just hidden a bit. He likes the 308 just fine...

Guy


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 10:58 am 

Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2018 8:52 am
Posts: 133
Guy Miner wrote:
What's funny, is that the same author, Ron Spomer, also published an article about a year ago talking about how the 308 was a wiser choice than the 30-06...

He does like to stir up controversy. I enjoy his articles. Ya just gotta read 'em with a sense of humor. His is there, just hidden a bit. He likes the 308 just fine...

Guy


He removed my comments on a FB post once, because he had 3 or 4 articles in a row titles like 6.5 for elk? 308 vs 30-06. I told him those questions were clickbait and he was just asking hot button questions to drive traffic to his site.

Maybe I was being a jerk, but I get tired of questions intentionally controversial that nobody can agree on because or personal preferences. Heck so far I’ve refused to get a creedmore just to be contrary haha.

I dislike 30-06 and love 308. Its irrational and I can’t even understand it. I know I can reload 308 to 30-06 factory loads, but if you load 30-06 you can out perform the 308, but still don’t shoot one. It may have something with the fact that I shot one for so many years just want something different. I’ve come to just deal with the fact I like short fat cartridges.




I have yet to begin to procrastinate


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 10:01 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 8:04 am
Posts: 2483
Location: Delta Junction, AK
coop22250 wrote:
He removed my comments on a FB post once, because he had 3 or 4 articles in a row titles like 6.5 for elk? 308 vs 30-06. I told him those questions were clickbait and he was just asking hot button questions to drive traffic to his site.


Yeah- it's something of a struggle for most gun writers to stay relevant and a lot of web traffic leads to a whole bunch of articles written as "this v. that".

For instance, I read one by another writher that went "7-08 v .308". I've used them both quite a bit and neither I or the critters that I shot could tell the difference. Most of that is just churning electrons for profit. The internet is a river of information a mile wide...and an inch deep.


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 Post subject: Re: When Did The 308 Win Become Trash?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2019 10:56 pm 

Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2012 1:00 pm
Posts: 672
Location: BC Canada
I have always liked the little 308 Win cartridge - my Newest buy is a Ruger GSS Rifle and i installed a Bushnell Red Dot on it . Very Fast to come up and Point and get off a shot ! Horn 150 SST and 165 SST Handloads ahead of H4895 shoot quite accurately . RJ

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