I tried this tonight for the first time and not sure of the results the one picture shows the 3 I resized next to a 25-06, you can see the bulge. I tried to chamber one and the bolt wouldn't close. So i ran them back through the die a couple times and tried again photo with just the 3, seems to be less bulge. They chambered this time but thought i could feel a little resistance on one of them. I am using standard RCBS dies. It was just a trial because ive never do it before. So before i do anything else i wanted to ask. I dont want to load anything thats not going to be safe to shoot. What might I be doing wrong?
Resizing 30 to 25-06 help
- Thread starter Slimfinn
- Start date
Just my opinion and an educated guess but I neck down brass regularly for schitz and giggles.
If going from 30 cal to 25 cal in one swoop, I'd expect issues myself. About 20 thou is the max I'll downsize in a single step. IF ME I'd be going 308 to 284 to 277 OR 264 (a BETTER step but both work) and then to 257.
Pushing too much brass in a single step CAN but wont always give you a big whopping hunk of metal at the bottom of your neck. This is caused by the bottom of the neck in the die shoving brass ahead of it instead of sizing it down.
Also make sure the brass is COMPLETELY in the die for the end stop in your case and use GOOD case forming lube. I use it INSIDE and out for best results.......but I'm a picky ol' fart too. LOL
I take .366 down to final .257 and .243 calibers.........but oh lordy, lordy.......it takes like 8 steps. (Hey, I never ONCE said I was normal.
)
If going from 30 cal to 25 cal in one swoop, I'd expect issues myself. About 20 thou is the max I'll downsize in a single step. IF ME I'd be going 308 to 284 to 277 OR 264 (a BETTER step but both work) and then to 257.
Pushing too much brass in a single step CAN but wont always give you a big whopping hunk of metal at the bottom of your neck. This is caused by the bottom of the neck in the die shoving brass ahead of it instead of sizing it down.
Also make sure the brass is COMPLETELY in the die for the end stop in your case and use GOOD case forming lube. I use it INSIDE and out for best results.......but I'm a picky ol' fart too. LOL
I take .366 down to final .257 and .243 calibers.........but oh lordy, lordy.......it takes like 8 steps. (Hey, I never ONCE said I was normal.
)
- Thread starter
- #4
So if I go with an intermediate sizing, would you get just a neck sizing die and just full size with the 25-06, or would you go with a full sizing all the way? I just looked at midway and you can get the Lee RGB 2 die set cheaper than just a neck sizer. Or buy a Hornady set and get a free box of bullets. OH!!...could be a reason it build a 6.5-06....
Either would work just fine IMO as long as the full length dies dont change your end headspace. I try to buy RCBS dies all the way through simply because they have worked for me. I've picked up like new dies off GB auctions for 25-26 bucks shipped. Picked up a set of RCBS 270 Win just today for 18 and shipping.
Depends on how big a hurry you are in. The faster you wish to do something........the more it will end up costing most times.
God Bless
Depends on how big a hurry you are in. The faster you wish to do something........the more it will end up costing most times.
God Bless
- Thread starter
- #6
Decided to dig deeper, looks like it bulges out like a little ridge almost. Was curious if it was making a thicker ring at that location but you can see the valley on the inside. So once this is fire formed do you think it will go away and not be an issue?
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You don't have a set of 30-06 dies you could borrow by chance do you?
Since the length of the 25-06 case from bottom to neck bottom is 0.0772" longer (by what I could find) than the 30-06 I have to wonder if you ran it through a 30-06 die now if it wouldn't push that down.
Being larger in diameter around the 25 cal neck, the shoulders both at the same height and the shoulder angle the same........I'd wager it would but it may not get all of it. It depends on the diameter where the bulge is. You may then have to run it through the 25-06 die again too though if it pushes it down. It may shove the neck up a tad too.
Stepping down a piece at a time is usually the best option. What's your case OAL? It looking ok or are you short?
Sorry I'm not more help. I don't play with 06 rounds much.
God Bless
Since the length of the 25-06 case from bottom to neck bottom is 0.0772" longer (by what I could find) than the 30-06 I have to wonder if you ran it through a 30-06 die now if it wouldn't push that down.
Being larger in diameter around the 25 cal neck, the shoulders both at the same height and the shoulder angle the same........I'd wager it would but it may not get all of it. It depends on the diameter where the bulge is. You may then have to run it through the 25-06 die again too though if it pushes it down. It may shove the neck up a tad too.
Stepping down a piece at a time is usually the best option. What's your case OAL? It looking ok or are you short?
Sorry I'm not more help. I don't play with 06 rounds much.
God Bless
- Thread starter
- #8
Of the 3 i put thru, 2 were ok at 2.495 and the other needed trimmed back. now the 2 were shot out of my sako and the 3rd was one i picked up at the range just for this experiment. I did it first then ran the other 2 thru when i noticed the bulge do see if i got the same result. I dont have any other -06 based dies, keeping my eyes open for a 280 or 270. Ive got 18 test brass left till i get to my good ones and still 60 empty 25-06 so not in a big rush.
Good catch on the neck wall thickness, Dwh. Not ever working with 06 brass, that one blew right over my head. No clue what the thickness runs on the 06 and family.
That case has been so worked over and adapted........I give it a general "pass" on my wildcat planning.
HATE turning necks with a passion.
God Bless
That case has been so worked over and adapted........I give it a general "pass" on my wildcat planning.
HATE turning necks with a passion.
God Bless
Guy Miner
Master Loader
- Apr 6, 2006
- 17,503
- 4,720
Since I have 30-06 & 25-06 rifles here, I don't neck down any of my 30-06 cases.
I try to be careful and not mix up the ammo. No problem yet, but... Sometimes I take both the 25-06 and the 30-06 along on hunting trips, like I did last fall.
I keep it simple and just buy 25-06 brass when I need some.
FWIW, Guy
I try to be careful and not mix up the ammo. No problem yet, but... Sometimes I take both the 25-06 and the 30-06 along on hunting trips, like I did last fall.
I keep it simple and just buy 25-06 brass when I need some.
FWIW, Guy
joelkdouglas
Handloader
- Jun 5, 2011
- 1,310
- 3
I have a couple 30-06s (and a bunch of 30-06 brass) and a 25-06, I’ll try to size one down and see how it goes.
After spending time and effort making 7 Mashburn brass from 300 Win Mag, I wouldn’t personally make 25-06 brass from 30-06 unless I had a really compelling reason. You can get 25-06 brass that’s almost as good as 30-06, except Lapua that’s only for 30-06.
Now, if you only had a 25-06 and somehow came across a bunch of 30-06 brass, that would be a compelling reason.
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After spending time and effort making 7 Mashburn brass from 300 Win Mag, I wouldn’t personally make 25-06 brass from 30-06 unless I had a really compelling reason. You can get 25-06 brass that’s almost as good as 30-06, except Lapua that’s only for 30-06.
Now, if you only had a 25-06 and somehow came across a bunch of 30-06 brass, that would be a compelling reason.
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- Thread starter
- #13
joelkdouglas":stms523h said:
I do have a bit of a compelling reason, does it make sense to everyone, probably not.
I can buy quality factory loaded Sako bonded 30-06 rounds that shoot great in my rifle cheaper than I could load them, and less than nosler, or norma 25-06 brass and about the price of rem
So i want to take that good quality brass and use it in my 25-06 rather than holding on to a bunch of brass i may never reload or throw it in the bucket at the range. My 30-06 is a light hunting rifle and my 2506 is a heavy barrel so having them out on a hunt at the same time is unlikely, reloads will be in a plastic box while factory will be in original box. Also plan to strike out the 30 on the case head before i reload them. The plan with the 3006 has always been to shoot factory loads for hunting just out of ease and availability if/when I travel. The rifles I use more for shooting plinking and target are my 260s and 2506 right now.
On another note i did another trial last night and neck sized 2 down to .264 and then full sized to 25-06 and had no bulge issue and looked real good.
joelkdouglas
Handloader
- Jun 5, 2011
- 1,310
- 3
Sounds like you figured it out!
Any reason compelling for you is really all you need.
If you run into any abnormal pressure signs I might suspect the brass necks first. Several of us here mess around with forming brass, and have seen weird stuff! If you need help identifying brass neck irregularities you might consider a set of pin gauges. Not too expensive and those demon pins will teach you hidden stuff about your brass.
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Any reason compelling for you is really all you need.
If you run into any abnormal pressure signs I might suspect the brass necks first. Several of us here mess around with forming brass, and have seen weird stuff! If you need help identifying brass neck irregularities you might consider a set of pin gauges. Not too expensive and those demon pins will teach you hidden stuff about your brass.
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joelkdouglas
Handloader
- Jun 5, 2011
- 1,310
- 3
I tried it. I don't have any cartridges for a non-magnum round between the 25-06 and 30-06, so no way to size the 30-06 down into 270 and then 25-06 or anything like that.
Here's the piece of 30-06
After the 25-06 FL Sizer
Tried to improve it by running it through a Lee Collet Die and then a Redding Body Die, better but still not great. I tried it and it will chamber in the 25-06 this way. That means after fire forming it will come out looking fine. But you might still have a problem (see last image).
Here it is next to a piece of commercial 25-06 brass
Here's a potential problem pictured below:
Even though the piece of brass will chamber there's a brass donut at the base of the neck. The pin in the neck is from my pin gauge set. The brass at the base of the neck is stopping the pin from going any further into the case. If you force something (i.e. like a bullet) further into the case with a press/seating die it will go past the donut. Then you have a portion of the neck that's too thick and generates high pressures when fired. The brass will chamber, and fire form looking good. But this hidden little devil will/could potentially cause pressure problems. What I've started doing for 7 Mashburn brass is forming, then inside neck reaming, then neck turning, then firing, then checking with the pin gauge and neck reaming/neck turning again if needed.
If you have to do all the above you will end up with good brass...just takes a little time and effort to get there.
Here's the piece of 30-06
After the 25-06 FL Sizer
Tried to improve it by running it through a Lee Collet Die and then a Redding Body Die, better but still not great. I tried it and it will chamber in the 25-06 this way. That means after fire forming it will come out looking fine. But you might still have a problem (see last image).
Here it is next to a piece of commercial 25-06 brass
Here's a potential problem pictured below:
Even though the piece of brass will chamber there's a brass donut at the base of the neck. The pin in the neck is from my pin gauge set. The brass at the base of the neck is stopping the pin from going any further into the case. If you force something (i.e. like a bullet) further into the case with a press/seating die it will go past the donut. Then you have a portion of the neck that's too thick and generates high pressures when fired. The brass will chamber, and fire form looking good. But this hidden little devil will/could potentially cause pressure problems. What I've started doing for 7 Mashburn brass is forming, then inside neck reaming, then neck turning, then firing, then checking with the pin gauge and neck reaming/neck turning again if needed.
If you have to do all the above you will end up with good brass...just takes a little time and effort to get there.
clearwater
Handloader
- Feb 5, 2005
- 392
- 129
I size down to 25 caliber from 7mm and 30 cal for a couple of wild cats. I use a 270 die first, then the 25. I end up needing to neck turn or ream a bit. I also anneal the cases afterwards.
Another thing that might help is to size without the expander first, then run it thru the dies again with the expander in place. It seems to reduce the force I need to use.
Another thing that might help is to size without the expander first, then run it thru the dies again with the expander in place. It seems to reduce the force I need to use.
- Thread starter
- #19
joelkdouglas
Handloader
- Jun 5, 2011
- 1,310
- 3
Some Mashburn brass that I form from 300 Win Mag has donuts, some not. I haven’t been able to figure out a way to predict yet!
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