22/250 question

[tyson22250]

Just looking for some opinions on this group. What would you do next. Cartridge is a 22/250, cases are all weight sorted, powder charges are all charged with same known Good weight, cases trimmed, neck sized with lee collet neck die, very concentric with .001-.0015" runout. I'm shooting 55gr Speer tnt hp,Remington brass and cci 200 primers. I'm .120" away from lands as that's as far as I can go out and still have .224" of bullet in neck. This rifle seems to be a picky one but think this bullet has pontential I'm just not sure which way I should go. The extreme velocity spread was terrible to say the least at 90 fps.
Should I play with seating depth first, charge weight, or neck tension? Just trying to save amount of times to range. The necks were pretty dirty and this powder is pretty clean burning usually. Wonder if case is just not sealing and I should bump charge weight up a little bit?
Thanks in advance. I did this group and pretty much another identical one, with two shots close together and two close together but away.

 

[joelkdouglas]

I would start seating bullets deeper in 0.005 increments. And just because I think if you screw your seating stem 1/4 turn I think you will pull those two groups toward each other


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[DrMike]

I would start seating bullets deeper in 0.005 increments. And just because I think if you screw your seating stem 1/4 turn I think you will pull those two groups toward each other


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Excellent advice here.

 

[tyson22250]

joelkdouglas...thanks I'll give that a try.

 

[TackDriver284]

.120 from the lands seems far, maybe seat deeper to .020 and start from there.

Did you do a load work up with 3 round shots and work up in .2 increments till you find a node? That should help.

What powder are you using? What is the charge weight? Velocity? Any pressure signs?

Some extra data would help to try to figure out your issue.

 

[tyson22250]

If I start off .020" off lands I am only left with .104" of bullet left in the case..I did load development at .120" off the lands as that was as far as I felt I could go with enough bullet in case. I did load development in .3gr. 4 shot groups. I had worked up to the max load of 36.3gr of IMR 4166. Book max is 36.2gr according to hodgon website. All through this load development with these bullets velocity has been erratic and I know it's not the powder as same powder with different bullets seated deeper into case had velocity spread of 42fps. The ogive is just really far back on these bullets. The velocity spread at 36.3gr was high 90fps with low of 3603fps to high of 3693. This was the load with most potential and have duplicated it twice. Im just not sure which way I should go as .120" from lands does sound far but I don't think I want less of bullet in neck.

 

[joelkdouglas]

Now that I'm back on the computer here's an illustration of 0.005 inches of seating depth, both are 5 shot groups. I'm not suggesting seating depth cures all evils, but I do think it makes a bigger difference than many other actions, such as uniforming primer pocket depth, etc.

 

[TackDriver284]

Sorry I did not take how much of the bullet was in the neck into account before I posted. Seems that you have a very long throat in that rifle. Have you tried a different powder, since you have a big variation in ES, to see if it groups better?

 

[tyson22250]

That's fine tackdriver, yea it has a pretty long throat.all three of my Remington 700's were long throated and both of my vanguards also have long throats. I haven't tried different powder yet but may have to, or just go onto my 55gr varmageddon hp. It did shoot the 55gr varmageddon tipped into ok group on second load, and these are pretty long bullets. I only did couple charge weights as I was very skeptical that these would even look like a pattern in this 1:14 as hornady 55gr v-max looked like shotgun patterns.

 

[tyson22250]

55gr Nosler varmageddon tipped

 

[Guy Miner]

Just for the heck of it, if you have some... Try a shorter bullet.

Perhaps something flat based, and no more than 50 or 53 grains? No plastic tips.

I've found that at least sometimes, going to a shorter bullet helps a lot!

Dad's .22-250 Rem 700 varmint rifle was spraying longer, poly tipped 55 grain bullets and some were going through the 100 yard target slightly sideways.

Switched to flat base, hollow point match bullets and pumped up the powder charge a little... Suddenly the thing became a one-hole wonder of a tack driver! Neither of us ever checked the distance to the lands, just loaded the cartridges to factory spec length.

Here's a photo of a bench-rest group he did some years ago, in his early 80's:


Regards, Guy

 

[hoghunter1951]

Good morning. I'm new to the forum but really enjoy reading everyone's posts. It may not be your load. I had the exact same thing happened to me about 3 months ago after I replace the scope on a Ruger Gunsite Scout. Fortunately it was a known load in that firearm that shot under an inch. My group looked identical to yours. Turned out it was the Ruger rings loose in the factory dovetails that I failed to Loctite. I remounted the scope with blue threadlocker and have since run about 100 rounds through it with no further issues. Just a thought.

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[Guy Miner]

Hoghunter1951, welcome to the forum!

And it's a good thought too. The rifle, optics, bases and rings are always worth checking.

Regards, Guy

 

[DrMike]

Indeed, welcome, hoghunter1951. We sometimes allow ourselves to grow casual about small matters, only to discover that there are no small matters when we are looking for reproducibility.

 

[joelkdouglas]

And usually I glance over the biggest problem--my shooting!


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[shoots_5]

I might be talking out my rear end....but I seem to remember something about the speer TNT having a maximum velocity due to the extremely thin and fluted jackets? Running them at 3600+ perhaps they are starting to come apart causing inconsistent point of impact? Might be something to look into....

 

[tyson22250]

The 50's are pretty thin ,I believe the 55gr were made for 22/250 velocity.

 

[Billyram]

Too much freebore is a problem with most factory barrels. I have found Hornady bullets work well with barrels that have long throats. Flat base bullets have a longer bearing and are less likely to get off axis. I once had a .220 swift with a lot of freebore that wasn't doing well 50-55 gr bullets. I tried some 60 gr Hornady bullets seated .200" into the neck and got the rifle shooting 3/4" groups.
Billy