longrangehunter
Handloader
- Jun 19, 2011
- 1,479
- 7
So I finally decided to load up some of the 200 pcs. of Nolser 280 AI Brass I bought when it first came out. BTW I had check this stuff years ago with the FF Rem Brass Kenny Jarrett sold decades ago, and still does, that said the headspace was the same. ( These are the first run Nosler brass in the Tan, and Burgandy box with the Bull Moose on them, #10175)
That said please read the following. Note: Kenny had always used PO Ackley's design vs. the SAAMI submitted design from Nosler, but in 2001 or '03 I had to send my brass and dies back to Redding to adjust for proper headspace because they wouldn't chamber.... this was with the R.P. Brass once fired in my gun....... so I'll post this below:
280 Ackley Improved vs. 280 Rem. Improved 40 Degree
The SAAMI spec cartridge carries the approved name of " 280 Ackley Improved " .
The older wildcat has several names including 280 Ackley Improved 40°, 280 Rem Improved 40°, 280 Imp 40°, 280 Ackley, 280 Rem Imp, and more.
The SAAMI spec 280 Ackley Improved chamber is .014 inches shorter at the datum line headspace dimension than the traditionally accepted wildcat chamber spec as previously produced.
Our current production dies are for chambers that are cut to the SAAMI specification and are stamped "280 Ackley Imp".
Any Redding dies made before 2011 are stamped " 280 Rem Imp 40° " and are built to the originally accepted wildcat specs.
These older dies will not bump the shoulder of cases for a SAAMI chamber. In other words, the old dies are too deep for the current SAAMI chamber.
Redding makes a Competition shellholder that is .014 deeper than the standard #1 shellholder so the owner of a wildcat chamber can use the current SAAMI spec dies for safe resizing.
Failing to use this shellholder or to back the die away from a standard shellholder by a minimum of 0.014" will result in too much shoulder bump which may create an unsafe, excessive headspace condition when fired in a traditionally dimensioned wildcat chamber.
To find the die part numbers for a current production SAAMI spec. rifle, please download our current catalog as a .pdf from Home | Redding Reloading Equipment: reloading equipment for rifles, handguns, pistols, revolvers and SAECO bullet casting equipment.
You will find these dies listed in Series C and Category II. Limited quantities of the traditional wildcat dies which are marked " 280 Rem Imp 40° " are available at Custom Series Die prices.
Bottom line, don't rely on only the web.
The names many list for this cartridge can be misleading.
Remember, they are wildcat cartridges and adhere to no formal standard.
Note: Any dies that Redding makes for SAAMI approved cartridges are always stamped with the SAAMI approved name or abbreviation.
Ok, a lot of stuff to read, this is a short test due to the fact I don't like to burn up a barrel or bullets which both cost money. That said, I wondered what's going on with the fliers I'm seeing, and the fact the bullets were not seating to the same length in my Redding Comp Seating Die...... well the friction and or the slight .002" in bullet to ogive I noticed or something else? Which is nothing but loaded round coming out of my seating die would sometimes move .040-.060" shorter? Stranger things have been known to happen.... it's just I'm not lazy, but I don't like finicky anything, and prefer simple tasks that require repetition. i.e. reloading!
Ok, so the down a dirty is I think I don't have a 1:9" twist barrel.... testing this with a rod is always a little off, but look like a 1:10" so I called Jay at Jarrett Rifles Inc. and was told I have a 1:10"........ really, know wonder this things doesn't shoot these long bullets! And why I went to fast twist barrels and long throats long ago, and had to ditch gunsmiths that didn't see the light of that work!?!
Ok, a picture is worth a thousand words as they say. I had read about how great this bullet was working and decided to give it a try....... No I didn't try all the powders I have on hand.... that would have burnt up two boxes and wasted a lot of time IMO, so here is the results to see. No further comment needed IMO.
BTW the bottom right is where I started after finding a max load touching the lands. 2878 fps @ 20' from the muzzle working up. It was suppose to be a three shot group, but the flier left me making two more loads and I loaded it short like the flier.... so I put blue on the bullet tip and it went right into the same hole, and the 2nd round made the .52" triangle group.
If you asked me, like most bullets IMO tend to work best very close to the lands. Except some mono's.
This Hornady ELD-X is no different IMO.... the old load I shot last, was at the lands, although a slow load if memory serves me well. The ELD-X needs at least a 1:9.5 twist....... and why I stopped testing.
Oh, I have the other 80 pieces for sale if anyone is interested in testing them!
That said please read the following. Note: Kenny had always used PO Ackley's design vs. the SAAMI submitted design from Nosler, but in 2001 or '03 I had to send my brass and dies back to Redding to adjust for proper headspace because they wouldn't chamber.... this was with the R.P. Brass once fired in my gun....... so I'll post this below:
280 Ackley Improved vs. 280 Rem. Improved 40 Degree
The SAAMI spec cartridge carries the approved name of " 280 Ackley Improved " .
The older wildcat has several names including 280 Ackley Improved 40°, 280 Rem Improved 40°, 280 Imp 40°, 280 Ackley, 280 Rem Imp, and more.
The SAAMI spec 280 Ackley Improved chamber is .014 inches shorter at the datum line headspace dimension than the traditionally accepted wildcat chamber spec as previously produced.
Our current production dies are for chambers that are cut to the SAAMI specification and are stamped "280 Ackley Imp".
Any Redding dies made before 2011 are stamped " 280 Rem Imp 40° " and are built to the originally accepted wildcat specs.
These older dies will not bump the shoulder of cases for a SAAMI chamber. In other words, the old dies are too deep for the current SAAMI chamber.
Redding makes a Competition shellholder that is .014 deeper than the standard #1 shellholder so the owner of a wildcat chamber can use the current SAAMI spec dies for safe resizing.
Failing to use this shellholder or to back the die away from a standard shellholder by a minimum of 0.014" will result in too much shoulder bump which may create an unsafe, excessive headspace condition when fired in a traditionally dimensioned wildcat chamber.
To find the die part numbers for a current production SAAMI spec. rifle, please download our current catalog as a .pdf from Home | Redding Reloading Equipment: reloading equipment for rifles, handguns, pistols, revolvers and SAECO bullet casting equipment.
You will find these dies listed in Series C and Category II. Limited quantities of the traditional wildcat dies which are marked " 280 Rem Imp 40° " are available at Custom Series Die prices.
Bottom line, don't rely on only the web.
The names many list for this cartridge can be misleading.
Remember, they are wildcat cartridges and adhere to no formal standard.
Note: Any dies that Redding makes for SAAMI approved cartridges are always stamped with the SAAMI approved name or abbreviation.
Ok, a lot of stuff to read, this is a short test due to the fact I don't like to burn up a barrel or bullets which both cost money. That said, I wondered what's going on with the fliers I'm seeing, and the fact the bullets were not seating to the same length in my Redding Comp Seating Die...... well the friction and or the slight .002" in bullet to ogive I noticed or something else? Which is nothing but loaded round coming out of my seating die would sometimes move .040-.060" shorter? Stranger things have been known to happen.... it's just I'm not lazy, but I don't like finicky anything, and prefer simple tasks that require repetition. i.e. reloading!
Ok, so the down a dirty is I think I don't have a 1:9" twist barrel.... testing this with a rod is always a little off, but look like a 1:10" so I called Jay at Jarrett Rifles Inc. and was told I have a 1:10"........ really, know wonder this things doesn't shoot these long bullets! And why I went to fast twist barrels and long throats long ago, and had to ditch gunsmiths that didn't see the light of that work!?!
Ok, a picture is worth a thousand words as they say. I had read about how great this bullet was working and decided to give it a try....... No I didn't try all the powders I have on hand.... that would have burnt up two boxes and wasted a lot of time IMO, so here is the results to see. No further comment needed IMO.
BTW the bottom right is where I started after finding a max load touching the lands. 2878 fps @ 20' from the muzzle working up. It was suppose to be a three shot group, but the flier left me making two more loads and I loaded it short like the flier.... so I put blue on the bullet tip and it went right into the same hole, and the 2nd round made the .52" triangle group.
If you asked me, like most bullets IMO tend to work best very close to the lands. Except some mono's.
This Hornady ELD-X is no different IMO.... the old load I shot last, was at the lands, although a slow load if memory serves me well. The ELD-X needs at least a 1:9.5 twist....... and why I stopped testing.
Oh, I have the other 80 pieces for sale if anyone is interested in testing them!
