Berger Bullets
- Thread starter ldg397
- Start date
- Nov 4, 2004
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Berger bullets claim their Match VLD hunting bullets penetrate up to 2" and then expand very rapidly inside a game animal. Their testing is based on the bullet test tube. They also have a DVD available that shows their bullet in action.
Myself, I sold on using proven hunting bullets on game. All my hunting rifles shoot Nosler bullets well under MOA and on game performance is very predictable.
JD338
Myself, I sold on using proven hunting bullets on game. All my hunting rifles shoot Nosler bullets well under MOA and on game performance is very predictable.
JD338
Powerstroke
Handloader
- Feb 24, 2006
- 1,792
- 33
I've played with some of the VLD's.... can't say I've given them a real good chance or effort like I do most of the time working up loads. I will say so far I've shot better groups with the Noslers.
+1 with JD for keeping it simple
+1 with JD for keeping it simple
rick smith
Handloader
- Apr 6, 2005
- 1,249
- 0
After reading John Barsness's article on the VLDs I decided to give them a try in my 30/06 this past hunting season. I killed seven deer with them. They did work quite well but didn't put them up against a large hog as I had hoped. Shots ranged from 30-175yds. Can't say they will replace any of the other bullets I use, just another option. Currently working up loads in my and my son's 30/06 for an Elk/Mule Deer hunt in Montana this fall. We both will be shooting partitions.Rick.
- Thread starter
- #6
I don't think I really agree with the concept of how they expand (meat damage, etc.) It seems like your walking on the edge when they say they penetrate 2" and then explode; seems to be a fine line from that to exploding without penetration in a shot placement that may be a little difficult. Just curious about actual trials on animals which seems to be just beginning.
My theory is I want a bullet in my gun when I go hunting to be able to penetrate consistantly on the chosen game even from the toughest angle. My standard it must be effective on the worst case scenario for that particular game.
My theory is I want a bullet in my gun when I go hunting to be able to penetrate consistantly on the chosen game even from the toughest angle. My standard it must be effective on the worst case scenario for that particular game.
- Oct 30, 2004
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I am not much on bullets that get consumed inside the animal.
rick smith
Handloader
- Apr 6, 2005
- 1,249
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I did not recover any of the bullets from the deer I shot. All heart/lung shots were pass throughs. Last deer I shot was approx 175yds, center punched a rib going in, made a perfect 30 caliber hole in the rib, jellied the lungs and took four ribs going out. I pass shots if I don't think I can place the bullet where it needs to be. We have a long season and liberal limit so there isn't any pressure about getting your deer for the year.Rick.
Charlie-NY
Handloader
- Mar 11, 2005
- 1,390
- 747
I always preferred regular hunting bullets for whitetails and have had good luck with all the Noslers and several others. However, this past season I decided to use the Hornady A-Max which was shooting VERY small groups in my 7STW.
Performance on deer was exceptional with mostly bang-flops. Shots on the shoulder dropped them like rocks, bullets did not exit. Broadside shots to the lungs either dropped them on the spot or within about 25yds. Terminal performance was significant with silver dollar size exit holes.
Some match bullets are particularly accurate AND expand reliably while holding together sufficiently for adequate penetration. Many of these bullets make fine varmint and thin-skinned biggame bullets.
I just bought a few boxes of Berger's VLD's so that I can see, first hand, what all the huppalla is all about. :lol:
Performance on deer was exceptional with mostly bang-flops. Shots on the shoulder dropped them like rocks, bullets did not exit. Broadside shots to the lungs either dropped them on the spot or within about 25yds. Terminal performance was significant with silver dollar size exit holes.
Some match bullets are particularly accurate AND expand reliably while holding together sufficiently for adequate penetration. Many of these bullets make fine varmint and thin-skinned biggame bullets.
I just bought a few boxes of Berger's VLD's so that I can see, first hand, what all the huppalla is all about. :lol:
- Nov 4, 2004
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matts318":1s1y81p8 said:
Post some pics dude! :grin:
JD338
nomosendero
Handloader
- Apr 13, 2006
- 536
- 0
ldg397":30tmqb33 said:
I have not heard that was the concept at all. The going in 2" before they did much was right, but they did not "explode" after that, at least not in the Barness article or the many threads that I have read on LRH or anywhere else. But your info may be different.
Guy Miner
Master Loader
- Apr 6, 2006
- 17,571
- 5,006
I've been messing with them for target shooting for a couple of years now. As stated above, a little picky about seating depth. Right now I've got loads worked up pretty well for the following:
.25-06, 115 Berger VLD @ 3215 fps w/excellent accuracy
.308, 155 Berger VLD @ 2850 fps (24" barrel) w/excellent accuracy
.300 WSM, have loads for both the 168 and 190 gr Berger VLD's but have not chronographed them. They're shooting very well at 400 yards.
I have not tested them on game, but am willing to give them a try.
The lines between match bullets and hunting bullets seem to be blurring a bit. At least for me, and for deer size game. I know too many guys making good use of the Hornady A-Max and Berger VLD's to dismiss their potential on game. These guys have taken mulies, elk and caribou with them, at various ranges. I see much the same from Nosler's Ballistic Tip - which has proven nearly as accurate as many match bullets in my rifles, and in the rifles of others. At one point Dan Lilja wrote very good things about his results with the Ballistic Tip, comparing the accuracy with that of match bullets for long-range hunting.
I doubt we "need" all these different cartridges and bullets, but they sure are fun to play around with!
By the way - I still think very highly of Nosler bullets. Just picked up another 700 .30 cal competition Noslers to help see me through this season of highpower shooting and have at least 400 - 500 Noslers of various varieties ready for my hunting rifles; solid base, partitions and ballistic tips! :grin:
Regards, Guy
.25-06, 115 Berger VLD @ 3215 fps w/excellent accuracy
.308, 155 Berger VLD @ 2850 fps (24" barrel) w/excellent accuracy
.300 WSM, have loads for both the 168 and 190 gr Berger VLD's but have not chronographed them. They're shooting very well at 400 yards.
I have not tested them on game, but am willing to give them a try.
The lines between match bullets and hunting bullets seem to be blurring a bit. At least for me, and for deer size game. I know too many guys making good use of the Hornady A-Max and Berger VLD's to dismiss their potential on game. These guys have taken mulies, elk and caribou with them, at various ranges. I see much the same from Nosler's Ballistic Tip - which has proven nearly as accurate as many match bullets in my rifles, and in the rifles of others. At one point Dan Lilja wrote very good things about his results with the Ballistic Tip, comparing the accuracy with that of match bullets for long-range hunting.
I doubt we "need" all these different cartridges and bullets, but they sure are fun to play around with!
By the way - I still think very highly of Nosler bullets. Just picked up another 700 .30 cal competition Noslers to help see me through this season of highpower shooting and have at least 400 - 500 Noslers of various varieties ready for my hunting rifles; solid base, partitions and ballistic tips! :grin:
Regards, Guy
I am using Berger VLD bullets in the rifles that they make them for when hunting on the farm here.
The VLD's have a superior BC, Bill Davis the inventor helped me with a program and Barsness says they work well on deer sized game.
I killed two deer with them and they are superb.
The VLD's have a superior BC, Bill Davis the inventor helped me with a program and Barsness says they work well on deer sized game.
I killed two deer with them and they are superb.
I read JB's article about their results hunting with them in New Zealand, and decided to give them a try in my 6.5-'06 on a WY antelope hunt last fall. The results shown in John's article show include both results on animals and also results in the Bullet Test Tube. The apparent reason for the 2" of penetration is the nose shape of the VLD: very small hollow point out there on the end of the very long nose. They look like they are flying 3,000 fps just sitting there in the loading block.
I of course wondered if you could combine this shape with a harder bullet for larger animals?
I found a pronghorn buck, and took a shot about 290 yards. The bullet hit too far back (behind the diaphragm), and I had to shoot again to put it down. The shots exhibited very small entrance wounds. The effect on the antelope of the wounding shot was dramatic. He acted like he was very hard hit and glued in place to the ground, he just lowered his head. He did not try to run even though the other buck with him zoomed off around the side hill. The sound of the bullets striking the antelope were also markedly louder than with other bullets.
I have some .308/165s too, but have not used them on an animal yet (too busy shooting Noslers into deer to get 'roundtoit).
jim
I of course wondered if you could combine this shape with a harder bullet for larger animals?
I found a pronghorn buck, and took a shot about 290 yards. The bullet hit too far back (behind the diaphragm), and I had to shoot again to put it down. The shots exhibited very small entrance wounds. The effect on the antelope of the wounding shot was dramatic. He acted like he was very hard hit and glued in place to the ground, he just lowered his head. He did not try to run even though the other buck with him zoomed off around the side hill. The sound of the bullets striking the antelope were also markedly louder than with other bullets.
I have some .308/165s too, but have not used them on an animal yet (too busy shooting Noslers into deer to get 'roundtoit).
jim
Hunter Jim,
What Berger bullet did you use? Did the bullet or its fragments exit the lope?
I shot a whitetail doe with the 155 VLD at 130 yds with a 308. I aimed for the only spot available as she moved into brush and that was the top of her hips or the spine. The bullet hit her spine and of course anchored her.
As far as I could tell all the 155 .308 VLD did was break the spine and push some hip bones into the adominal cavity.
My point in all this is that I feel that a VLD will act similar to any other cup and core in that the depth of penetration is dependent more upon the specific bullets weight and striking velocity.
On the 168 7mm VLD I found deep penetration and so have others reported that. With the 155 Palma bullet not so deep at all. I know its only two bullets plus the reports of others but it follows theory.
What Berger bullet did you use? Did the bullet or its fragments exit the lope?
I shot a whitetail doe with the 155 VLD at 130 yds with a 308. I aimed for the only spot available as she moved into brush and that was the top of her hips or the spine. The bullet hit her spine and of course anchored her.
As far as I could tell all the 155 .308 VLD did was break the spine and push some hip bones into the adominal cavity.
My point in all this is that I feel that a VLD will act similar to any other cup and core in that the depth of penetration is dependent more upon the specific bullets weight and striking velocity.
On the 168 7mm VLD I found deep penetration and so have others reported that. With the 155 Palma bullet not so deep at all. I know its only two bullets plus the reports of others but it follows theory.
- Oct 30, 2004
- 24,139
- 2,734
They look like awesome bullets but still make me nervous...........
Berger VLD's don't make me nervous at all.
To me the VLD's give me an advantage for deer hunting on the farm. Then on the other hand I am not a moderator here or employed by any bullet co.
I shot a large buck in the ribs at 193 yds twice with the 140 Ballistic Tips from a 270 WSM. The buck just stood there moving his foot. Then he took a step backwards. Finally I shot him again in the neck. None of the bullets exited.
So it goes with bullets and game. A million variables.
To me the VLD's give me an advantage for deer hunting on the farm. Then on the other hand I am not a moderator here or employed by any bullet co.
I shot a large buck in the ribs at 193 yds twice with the 140 Ballistic Tips from a 270 WSM. The buck just stood there moving his foot. Then he took a step backwards. Finally I shot him again in the neck. None of the bullets exited.
So it goes with bullets and game. A million variables.
- Nov 4, 2004
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- 7,028
Savage99
Thats weird, deer don't normally hang around waiting for a follow up shot.
I seem to recall you posting that story some time back. You are right though, you just never know what a bullet will do.:?
If you recovered any of those bullets, any chance you could post some pics?
Thanks Savage99.
JD338
Thats weird, deer don't normally hang around waiting for a follow up shot.
I seem to recall you posting that story some time back. You are right though, you just never know what a bullet will do.:?
If you recovered any of those bullets, any chance you could post some pics?
Thanks Savage99.
JD338
