Dr. Mike & others - powders for 300 WSM?

[sithlord6512]

Dr. Mike and others with extensive experience developing loads for the 300 WSM - If you only had three powders to choose from for launching 165-168 gr pills out of a 300WSM, what would they be? How about for 180 grainers?

I have a newish 300WSM and two friends have just purchased this caliber as well. We are combining our $ resources to buy different powders to try out.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[DrMike]

H380, RL15, Varget or N550 for 165/168 grain bullets. IMR4831, N550, N560 or RL19 for the 180 grain bullet.

 

[FOTIS]

Cartridge : .300 WSM (CIP)
Bullet : .308, 165, Nosler PART SP 16330
Useable Case Capaci: 73.662 grain H2O = 4.783 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.860 inch = 72.64 mm
Barrel Length : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 63000 psi, or 434 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 110 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

139 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 90%. These powders have been skipped.
Powder type Filling/Loading Ratio Charge Charge Vel. Prop.Burnt P max P muzz B_Time
% Grains Gramm fps % psi psi ms
--------------------------------- -----------------------------------------------------------------
Norma MRP 106.7 75.6 4.90 3223 99.5 63000 12454 1.095 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N560 108.4 75.2 4.87 3206 97.0 63000 12617 1.093 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate MAGPRO 108.6 78.4 5.08 3193 95.5 63000 12620 1.098 ! Near Maximum !
Raufoss RA15 108.7 74.6 4.83 3186 98.6 63000 12203 1.098 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-22 108.7 74.6 4.83 3186 98.6 63000 12203 1.098 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP5/NP ~approximation 108.7 74.6 4.83 3186 98.6 63000 12203 1.098 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 7828 SSC 106.7 74.4 4.82 3184 97.3 63000 12188 1.086 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Magnum 110.0 80.0 5.18 3180 97.6 62164 12339 1.093 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-17 95.8 68.3 4.42 3171 100.0 63000 11040 1.097 ! Near Maximum !
SNPE Vectan SP 12 110.0 79.7 5.17 3169 97.6 61539 12291 1.098 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2213 107.5 73.8 4.78 3167 97.2 63000 12059 1.086 ! Near Maximum !
PB Clermont PCL 517 110.0 79.7 5.17 3164 97.4 61179 12294 1.101 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R905 109.7 74.0 4.79 3143 96.9 63000 11805 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2209 104.4 70.5 4.57 3138 98.3 63000 11529 1.091 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-19 105.1 71.4 4.63 3137 98.4 63000 11608 1.099 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Hunter 100.6 70.5 4.57 3137 99.8 63000 11321 1.104 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S365 102.6 69.3 4.49 3135 100.0 63000 10535 1.111 ! Near Maximum !
Winchester WXR 110.0 73.9 4.79 3135 98.0 59754 12079 1.125 ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 760 95.0 68.2 4.42 3134 99.4 63000 11343 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H414 95.0 68.2 4.42 3134 99.4 63000 11343 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP14 ~approximation 105.9 71.9 4.66 3130 98.4 63000 11519 1.099 ! Near Maximum !
Norma URP 100.1 67.3 4.36 3118 100.0 63000 10862 1.111 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP19 ~approximation 100.2 67.3 4.36 3118 100.0 63000 10859 1.111 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N550 97.3 67.5 4.37 3117 100.0 63000 10998 1.115 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4350 103.9 67.5 4.37 3114 100.0 63000 10832 1.127 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 204 99.6 69.8 4.53 3110 98.2 63000 11290 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP4 ~approximation 102.9 69.8 4.53 3110 98.2 63000 11290 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
Raufoss RA4 102.9 69.8 4.53 3110 98.2 63000 11290 1.100 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4831 SC 106.1 72.8 4.72 3103 96.5 63000 11347 1.097 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AP 2214 110.0 77.5 5.02 3103 96.7 60158 11751 1.109 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S385 105.3 72.3 4.68 3099 99.0 63000 11114 1.118 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4831 105.1 68.3 4.43 3098 100.0 63000 10623 1.119 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot BigGame 93.5 65.5 4.25 3097 100.0 63000 10467 1.110 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 7828 110.0 72.6 4.70 3096 96.2 57500 11932 1.132 ! Near Maximum !
SNPE Vectan SP 11 93.6 65.6 4.25 3095 100.0 63000 10452 1.110 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4831 110.0 72.6 4.70 3091 96.4 62184 11311 1.103 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP4 NT ~approximation 100.4 69.2 4.49 3089 99.3 63000 10927 1.112 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP5 NT ~approximation 110.0 76.2 4.93 3087 94.4 60706 11667 1.110 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4895 90.3 61.3 3.97 3086 100.0 63000 10374 1.117 ! Near Maximum !
Winchester Supreme 780 103.4 74.0 4.80 3083 98.2 63000 10982 1.104 ! Near Maximum !
Raufoss RA11 91.1 61.9 4.01 3079 100.0 63000 10342 1.116 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP11 ~approximation 91.1 61.9 4.01 3079 100.0 63000 10342 1.116 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-15 91.1 61.9 4.01 3079 100.0 63000 10342 1.116 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Hybrid 100V 102.8 67.5 4.38 3076 100.0 63000 9999 1.110 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R904 103.6 69.4 4.49 3076 97.3 63000 10973 1.104 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 203B 91.6 62.2 4.03 3075 100.0 63000 10256 1.118 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S070 99.7 66.9 4.34 3073 99.5 63000 10760 1.121 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H380 92.4 64.1 4.16 3072 100.0 63000 10487 1.120 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4350 102.4 68.0 4.41 3071 99.0 63000 10709 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-25 110.0 74.3 4.81 3071 99.6 53659 11815 1.170
IMR 4350 100.5 67.9 4.40 3071 99.1 63000 10691 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP7 NT ~approximation 94.4 64.7 4.19 3066 99.6 63000 10436 1.095 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 203 old 92.8 63.7 4.13 3062 100.0 63000 10089 1.131 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4320 93.1 62.2 4.03 3061 100.0 63000 9971 1.103 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N165 110.0 73.9 4.79 3060 98.6 61569 10776 1.120 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R903 94.9 63.7 4.13 3057 100.0 63000 10008 1.130 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S355 95.0 63.1 4.09 3053 100.0 63000 10020 1.125 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R907 97.3 64.8 4.20 3051 99.0 63000 10565 1.116 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S065 98.5 65.4 4.24 3050 99.9 63000 10376 1.121 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4007 SSC 94.2 64.9 4.20 3050 99.0 63000 10557 1.116 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2208 93.6 61.7 4.00 3043 100.0 63000 9986 1.107 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon VARGET 94.0 61.7 4.00 3043 100.0 63000 9986 1.107 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP3 NT ~approximation 96.1 64.8 4.20 3043 99.8 63000 10172 1.106 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N160 110.0 71.6 4.64 3041 97.0 61969 10713 1.115 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S361 102.4 74.1 4.80 3038 96.5 63000 10713 1.115 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4064 94.5 60.6 3.93 3035 100.0 63000 9797 1.111 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S062 92.2 60.9 3.95 3027 100.0 63000 9638 1.126 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 3031 90.4 57.4 3.72 3026 100.0 63000 9294 1.123 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4064 96.6 61.3 3.98 3017 100.0 63000 9468 1.152 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R902 91.2 59.7 3.87 3009 100.0 63000 9481 1.129 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N150 100.1 64.2 4.16 3007 100.0 63000 9425 1.124 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N540 91.0 62.4 4.05 3005 100.0 63000 9436 1.124 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 2700 95.3 66.8 4.33 2998 98.9 63000 9957 1.120 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N140 90.8 60.4 3.92 2975 100.0 63000 8939 1.124 ! Near Maximum !
Norma MRP 2 110.0 74.7 4.84 2970 94.8 48588 11957 1.233
Vihtavuori N135 96.4 59.3 3.85 2964 100.0 63000 8723 1.134 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N570 110.0 78.8 5.10 2950 87.7 47443 12468 1.242
Accurate 3100 110.0 70.6 4.58 2947 98.9 53562 10586 1.216
Lovex S071 110.0 70.6 4.58 2947 98.9 53562 10586 1.216
Alliant Reloder 33 110.0 82.1 5.32 2947 88.8 47982 12384 1.237
Hodgdon H1000 110.0 73.9 4.79 2911 93.9 49517 11141 1.214
Vihtavuori N133 90.7 56.4 3.65 2910 100.0 63000 8218 1.125 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Retumbo 110.0 75.1 4.87 2844 95.5 42759 11693 1.301
Lovex D100 110.0 80.4 5.21 2807 82.6 49807 10191 1.231
ADI AR 2218 110.0 79.6 5.16 2773 81.9 43275 11642 1.298
Vihtavuori 24N41 110.0 79.6 5.16 2766 78.9 45978 10482 1.269
Vihtavuori N170 110.0 73.9 4.79 2748 85.4 44564 10254 1.308
Hodgdon H870 110.0 77.1 5.00 2699 84.8 37674 11192 1.390
Alliant Reloder-50 110.0 80.8 5.23 2634 80.2 34588 11209 1.450
Bofors 12,7mmRA NC1214 Lot20115087 110.0 79.0 5.12 2602 72.9 36661 10307 1.451
Hodgdon 50BMG 110.0 75.8 4.91 2563 70.1 37092 9557 1.408
Hodgdon US 869 110.0 79.6 5.16 2561 74.1 36877 9627 1.414
SNPE Vectan SP 13 110.0 76.3 4.95 2505 78.4 33246 9558 1.474
Vihtavuori 20N29 110.0 80.4 5.21 2436 72.8 31578 9331 1.509
PB Clermont PCL 513/520/9520 110.0 76.3 4.95 2436 74.9 31358 9173 1.511
Accurate 8700 110.0 76.5 4.96 2400 74.3 30936 8998 1.518
NC A3502 ,test only 110.0 73.1 4.73 2245 51.1 30261 6754 1.545
TLP A 502(RH) ,test only 110.0 73.1 4.73 2220 55.5 28122 7209 1.588
Vihtavuori N32C Tin Star 99.3 33.6 2.18 2207 100.0 63000 4054 1.225 ! Near Maximum !
IMR TrailBoss 110.0 25.2 1.63 1897 100.0 40479 3166 1.482
ADI AS 25 BP 110.0 25.2 1.63 1897 100.0 40479 3166 1.482
V1734 7-multiperf ,test only 110.0 73.1 4.73 1593 25.1 15897 3289 2.093

 

[300WSM]

I will give you more than three ...but in order of priority

IMR 4831 Easy to get, very accurate, good performance
IMR 4350 Also easy to get, good performance, accurate
Win 760 Very easy to get, and a good overall generalized powder
Reloader 17 Not as easy to get as the above three, a little higher velocity in my experience

I can basically guarantee you sub 1" three shot groups with one of the above mentioned I listed.

IMR 4831 in almost every rifle I've loaded in this caliber, mine or customers or friends, performs so well. I always start with this one because most times there is no need to even try a different powder.
Plus it is a good powder to keep on hand as it can be used in a wide range of applications.
IMR 4350 is another great powder that can be used in so many different calibers. It performs just about as good as IMR 4831

WIN 760
good powder that can be used in many different calibers. This flows the best of these four powder as it is a ball powder so if you have a powder dispenser that you raise the lever to throw the charge, this will throw to the tenth of a grain every time all the time..(given your powder dispenser is of good quality.)

Reloader 17 A little harder to get the above three but good performance. Tends to have the highest velocity...all things being equal

You really should have IMR 4831, IMR 4350, and Win 760 in your reloading stock. They can be used in so many calibers

Also, if winchester 760 is not available..no big deal...Hodgdon H414 is the EXACT same stuff. Same exact powder..different label. One hundred percent identical.

Good luck and you will love the 300 WSM

 

[gerry]

When I had a 300 WSM I used RL 15 with several 165 gr bullets for speeds in the 3050 fps range with moderate recoil and good accuracy. With 180 gr Partition's H 4831 SC was very good in 2 different guns. Both loads were taken from the Nosler #6 and were the max load for each powder.

 

[257 Ackley]

A powder that will work well for both the 165 and 180 bullets is R19. Great accuracy and velocities. I have great results with H414/W760 as well.

 

[SJB358]

A powder that will work well for both the 165 and 180 bullets is R19. Great accuracy and velocities. I have great results with H414/W760 as well.

I am with Joel here. RL19 has been excellent from 165's to 200's.. Pretty sure it would work fine with 220's and 150's as well.

If I was going to try another powder, it would be 760, as Joel has had excellent results with it and that is what Winchester loads with their 180 factory loads.

Everytime I have tried a slower powder than RL19, I have ran outta space before I could get the speed up. RL19 will run 2900 with 200's, 3000 with 180's and 3100 with the 165's without any drama and usually the accuracy will be right there.

Good luck. It is pretty fun working with this little 300..

 

[wildgene]

...RL-17 has given me the best accuracy/ velocity in 3 different .300 WSM's, (Nosler, Hornady, Sierra, Speer) 165grs. over 68grs. RL-17 @ 3200fps, 180gr. over 66grs. RL-17 @ 3050fps (Alliant MAX loads, but Alliant seems to be pretty conservative)...

...I shoot in temps. between +90 & -0, temps don't much matter, if the wind isn't blowing you shoot, & haven't noticed any more difference in RL-17 than H4350, but I don't leave ammo up on the dash out pdawg hunting, most of my spare ammo is packed in small insulated lunch containers...

(P.S. Superformance gave good accuracy/ ES/ SD, but the MV's were disappointing, to say the least, when compared to the advertised MV's...)

 

[big rifle man]

I spent this past monday at the range testing what would be the best powder for a 180 Sierra Gameking in my Kimber .300WSM. I normally shoot 180 grain prohunters which have a flat base and wanted to change over to the gameking which is a boattail. I came up with some interesting results. I've tried 4350, 4831, RL19 and RL22 over a period of time and found IMR4831 the best for accuracy for the 180 grain prohunter. Velocity was 3030FPS with 67.5 grains of 4831, a Fed 215M primer and Norma cases. At the range on monday I shot the gamekings with 67.5 grains of IMR4831 and 64 grains of RL17. all other components were the same. OAL was 2.850. I was set up to shoot at 200 yards. The IMR4831 gave me 2 3/4 inch groups with a velocity of 3030FPS, the same as with the prohunter. The RL17 gave a very pleasant surprise. Velocity came in at just under 3100FPS with a five shot 1 1/2 inch group. I'm thinking that a max charge of 66 grains of RL17 might show a very interesting velocity although I'm very happy with what I found.

 

[SJB358]

I did pretty well with RL17 in mine as well Gene. RL19 edged it a little in initial accuracy, so I stuck with it, but 17 could have been tweaked pretty easily and given more speed. Either way, something in that burn range seems to really work well with the 300.

 

[300WSM]

Sith,

As you can see from the ones I posted and others, you can't really go wrong with several choices on this. As far as accuracy it will rival any of the best out there. They will all give you good accuracy and speed.

One thing I failed to mention and is important to me is the ignition.

Use a Federal Gold Medal Primer GM215M
That is a gold medal match large rifle magnum primer. In this case they are worth the little extra cost.

 

[sithlord6512]

Thanks for the input fellas. Can't wait for warmer weather. Brass in prepped, powders and primers are ordered and my Sako with a new McMillan Edge stock is ready to be picked up at my gunsmith's.

We've ordered the following
Viht N550 and 560
H380
RL19 and RL17
W760

We already have plenty of Varget and RL15 - surprised and happy to see these recommended (unexpected). These are my go-to powders for by .308.

 

[SJB358]

I think you'll have an easy load work up. It seems to shoot most bullets pretty well with the RL19/4350 burn rate. Speed is pretty easy to come by as well. The little 300 is very surprising to me, at it's ability to just about match my old 300 Win Mag.

 

[big rifle man]

Scotty, I have a friend with a Rem. 700 in 300WM and we've run both his rifle and mine through the chrony with 180 grain bullets. He has a 24 inch barrel as I do. The short mag with RL17 and RL22 surpasses his 300WM.

 

[300WSM]

Scotty, I have a friend with a Rem. 700 in 300WM and we've run both his rifle and mine through the chrony with 180 grain bullets. He has a 24 inch barrel as I do. The short mag with RL17 and RL22 surpasses his 300WM.

The traditional "WIn Mag" is by no means a slouch but bullet weights up to and including the 180 grain the shorter mag will edge it in a lot of cases. After 180 gr...190 gr and higher the longer 300 win mag in most cases will edge the shorter, fatter kid. :lol:


Take a look at what the big main stream companies are offering. In a lot of combinations the WSM edges out the older longer mag often times to the tune of about 10-20 FPS.
Federal, Winchester, Remington cruise around those factory offerings and you will see exactly what I mean.

 

[SJB358]

Either one has been pretty easy to work with. Loaded to the same spec's PSI, the Win Mag handles the 200's a little better IF the magazine will let you seat the rounds out a little further. If you are cramped into a 3.34" mag for the 300 Win Mag, but allowed to seat out further in a 300WSM, such as a M70 WSM action, they both do about the same thing. At least, that has been my experience.

I have alot of magazine room in my M70 300WSM, so I am actually looking forward to working with the 190 and 210 ABLR... I am thinking mid 2900's for the 190 and higher 2800's for the 210, but I won't know till they drop.. I am very much chomping at the bit to give them a go though.

 

[Guy Miner]

I'm thinking that will be about right Scotty. With H4350, am running 210 Berger VLD's at 2815 fps from my 24" .300 WSM Model 70, with good accuracy and not pushing them too hard.

Am thinking that ABLR could turn out to be one heck of a bullet.

Guy

 

[SJB358]

Am thinking that ABLR could turn out to be one heck of a bullet.

Guy

Yeah, it should be fun, that's for sure.

 

[sithlord6512]

Tested RL 15 and N550 last weekend with 168 TTSXs. N550 had the smallest group (.43"), but the other 4/5 groups with this powder were in the 1.46"-2.40" range - may retry the loads just above, at, and below the accuracy load since we've got more N550 powder.

Next tried RL 15 with 165 TSXs and 168 TTSXs. Tested to 58.5 g with TSXs and to 58.0 g with TTSXs (reduced TTSX max loads - just in case). For both bullets (TSX and TTSX), the 57.5 g RL 15 load was the most accurate - .54" and .73", respectively. Also, the groups of the other loads were "tigher" with RL15 (1.59" was the largest group with both bullets).

While the velocities with RL 15 were slower (accuary loads=3030 fps ave) vs N550 (30 fps), I would choose RL15 over N550. Next up, IMR 4831.

 

[sithlord6512]

My attempt at posting - see how it goes. First Pic should be RL15 load+ 168 TTSX

http://s1125.photobucket.com/user/sithl ... sort=3&o=1

Second Pic should be N550 + 168 TTSX

Oops - did not load the N550 load - wasn't impressive anyways.

Plus - a little more explanation - for the 3rd (57 g) and 4th (57.5 g) 168 TTSX groups on the photo, a 4th shot was outside the group at about same location - "11:30" positions.

I use 3-shot groups for measurement and comparative purposes (most people seem to use 3-shot groups) while the 4th shot is to help me decide between 3-shot groups that are pretty close in size.(the measurements I use were for 3-shot groups - I use the fourth to help me decide between two groups that are very close to the same). I'm guessing that barrel heating starts become a bigger issue after the 4th shot for my fluted Finnlight barrel.