LEOSA (HR-218)

[diverdown]

Some good news for all the active and retired police on this forum. The State of New Jersey was taken to court by a number of entities over the fact that they would not honor the HR-218 Bill on its own and insisted that you get a NJ state pistol permit (which they constantly denied). Their initial attempt at having the case dismissed failed and they were scheduled to appear in court. I'm sure they thought a lot about how much money they were going to spend on this issue and the other fact that they were going to lose the case. They have just made it law that HR-218 will be honored for active and retired police officers. They lost their first lawsuit a number of years ago that cost them a considerable amount of money and this time I guess they didn't want to get burnt again so for those of you travelling through the "Garden State" we are now covered.

 

[Charlie-NY]

My understanding is a bit different but I could be wrong too.

NJ only required NJ retired LEOs to obtain a pistol permit. They also required a recertification class every 6 months. At a certain age (70 something) they will not even issue the permit, thus negating LEOSA for their own retired officers.

NJ also bans hollowpoint ammo. However, I believe that LEOSA specifically permits the carry of ammo that is the same as a LEO qualified with when active. Every agency that I know of qualifies with HP ammo. A call to NJ State Police confirmed that they would arrest anyone who carried HP ammo regardless of the provisions of LEOSA.

High capacity magazines (I believe) are also banned for LEOs who carry under LEOSA even though that is standard issue in all departments virtually everywhere. NY specifically allows Hi-cap mags for retired LEOs if they are consistent with the mags used when they were active.

 

[diverdown]

Based on what I heard this is now applying to all Active and Retired officers. The hollow point issue was settled in a court a while back. There is actually an addition to the law on that issue. I'm sure there will be more coming out on it.

 

[diverdown]

One other item, in regards to the magazine capacity NJ has required that it be ten rounds or less and that is still in effect and has not been challenged. To the best of my knowledge the pistol permit was originally required of everyone.

 

[Charlie-NY]

One other item, in regards to the magazine capacity NJ has required that it be ten rounds or less and that is still in effect and has not been challenged. To the best of my knowledge the pistol permit was originally required of everyone.

Is hollowpoint ammo now legal in NJ?

Does NJ even issue permits to non-residents? What about non-res LEOSA qualified people? The Federal law was drafted, in part, to avoid this; wasn't it?

LEOSA does not specifically address magazine capacities so states can do whatever they want with magazine limitations.

Could you tell me exactly what was gained in the new change? I live in NY and frequently travel to NJ where my buddy (a retired LEO) just moved to.

For the record - Both NY and NJ are terrible states for gunowners regardless of whether or not you are a retired LEO.

 

[diverdown]

Hollow point ammunition has been legal for a while in NJ. If you talk to three different NJ law enforcement people you will get three different answers. My go to person was a State Trooper lieutenant who worked in the firearms division. He also was difficult to get information from. The head prosecutor in NJ is basically causing the uproar over firearms. As a non resident retired LEO you can get a permit from NJ. (good luck with that.) Now it appears you won't have to go through that process. Again, I'm sure there will be more coming out. A retired LEO that I worked with was stopped in NJ quite a while back (for speeding) and had a good conversation with the trooper. His HR-218 was honored and the trooper commented on a few other things that I won't mention. (I think you get the gist of where I'm coming from).

 

[FOTIS]

Excellent. I hate those states

 

[Charlie-NY]

The hard part isn't complying with the state laws, it's actually understanding them. When the people who enforce the laws don't agree on the interpretation or application of the law it leaves very little for the law-abiding civilian to go by.

Then you have to deal with laws that are changed, amended or are newly enforced due to a change in policy or a change in prosecuting personnel. All of this happens with little or no notification to the public. Residents who make every attempt to comply with the laws, as they know them, get caught up in this BS all the time.

 

[Charlie-NY]

After a bit of research and a review of NJ on-line information I have come to the conclusion that the State of New Jersey ONLY allows the possession of HP ammo in the home, while hunting or target shooting & includes the restricted (locked) transport of the ammo. Carrying HP ammo by anyone who is not an active duty LEO is still a crime.

LEOSA is barely recognized by NJ and they distinguish between activity duty LEOSA and retired LEO LEOSA. The latter is not entitled to carry HP ammo regardless of the protections of LEOSA as intended in the Federal law. If you could direct me to an authoritative source for information to the contrary it would be appreciated.

 

[diverdown]

your comment to the hollow point issue is incorrect. A federal court has stated that Law Enforcement whether active or retired can carry hollow point ammunition. NJ fought against that for quite a while and now has backed off according to the sources I have talked to. I'm waiting to hear more about the new laws that have been accepted.

 

[Charlie-NY]

your comment to the hollow point issue is incorrect. A federal court has stated that Law Enforcement whether active or retired can carry hollow point ammunition. NJ fought against that for quite a while and now has backed off according to the sources I have talked to. I'm waiting to hear more about the new laws that have been accepted.

My comment regarding HP ammo is merely a reiteration of what I read on-line at several locations, including the NJ State Police site. It may not represent the latest changes and that's why I asked for a link which would provide newer or additional information.

 

[FOTIS]

Even so 45acp 1911 with 230 Winchester ball will do fine.

 

[Ridgerunner665]

I'm no LEO of any sort, but I read somewhere that the NJ hollowpoint ban didn't apply to bullets like the Hornady FlexTip bullets (rubber in the hollowpoint)... can anyone confirm that?

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

 

[Charlie-NY]

I'm no LEO of any sort, but I read somewhere that the NJ hollowpoint ban didn't apply to bullets like the Hornady FlexTip bullets (rubber in the hollowpoint)... can anyone confirm that?

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk

It's true that the HP ban did not include Hornady HP ammo (Critical Defense) that has a little red ball stuffed into the cavity or other similar ammo. The NJ State Police site specifically names 4 different types/brands of ammo that are excluded. The whole issue is incredibly stupid. Apparently there has never been a HP ban anywhere else in the country.

I have yet to find any definitive indication that the ban on HP ammo is null & void. To say that NJ PD are just no longer enforcing the ban is clearly inadequate. While it may be permitted, it would nice to see this posted on the NJ State PD web site.

 

[diverdown]

I'm not a fan of on-line information and would rather talk to someone when requesting information. Again, be patient, I'm sure more information will be forthcoming from NJ in regards to the new regulations. I'm sure they will do their best to screw things up as much as possible. This entire problem is due to the Head prosecutor in NJ.

 

[JD338]

I sure don't understand why HP bullets are banned in NJ.
LEO's certainly have their backs against the wall even though they put their lives on the line for us every day.

JD338

 

[Charlie-NY]

I sure don't understand why HP bullets are banned in NJ.
LEO's certainly have their backs against the wall even though they put their lives on the line for us every day.
JD338

NJ hasn't been particularly kind to its retiring officers. They require their own retired LEOs to get a pistol permit which clearly flies in the face of LEOSA. They also require recertification every 6 months which is contrary to LEOSA. They restrict the required permit to retirees under a certain age. HP ammo is another whole situation which was created and convoluted for no apparent reason. Some of these issues are what gave birth to the lawsuits that the OP is referring to.

Living in NY is no picnic for firearm owners but they don't impose any of these ridiculous requirements on their LEOs or retirees. To the contrary, in NY they passed a law that specifically exempts retired LEOs from the current 10rnd magazine limitations. There are some parameters but they are reasonable. So no, you can't have a 30rd magazine hanging out of your Glock under the exemption. All of my magazines are inscribed "For Law Enforcement Only". They all exceed the 10rd limit but are all compliant under NYS law.

 

[diverdown]

Still waiting patiently for the State of NJ to come out with the new rules and regulations. My State Police source advised that paper is in the works but nothing has come forward yet. I'm sure they're trying to figure out a way to get around the new regs.