OBT Help 243
- Thread starter MAinAR
- Start date
I must've run this wrong. Are you getting any pressure signs or anything?
Reason I ask is the pressure shown in QL is pretty high running this load in a 20" barrel. I moved the burn rate up (a bunch) to reach 3400 with it.
With all that said, here it is:
took it off as it was not correct. readjusted on lower post...
Reason I ask is the pressure shown in QL is pretty high running this load in a 20" barrel. I moved the burn rate up (a bunch) to reach 3400 with it.
With all that said, here it is:
took it off as it was not correct. readjusted on lower post...
- Thread starter
- #4
Speed are with Magneto Speed. I don't know why but this is the only 20" barrel gun I have ever built loads for that every combo tested reaches Loading Manual 24" barrel velocities easily.
4 Firings in on brass and primer pockets are approx .2085, just neck sizing in wilson neck die and the 4th fired brass just snug enough to feel closing the bolt.
Bolt opens smooth as glass. Again I don't know why, it just does. The shots over magneto speed last nite went.
3399
3410
3405
Then today first shot in once fired brass went 3401. This load is from Barnes old manual stating max at 45.5gr H4350 with bullet seated 2.61 OAL. That is exactly what I am loading. Started at 43gr and worked up .5gr at a time and was at 44.5gr before primers flattened at all. I stopped at max book but had no bolt lift feel at all, NONE.
Only pressure i see at all is primer crater that you can barely hook finger nail on to feel, but the factory Nosler 90AB load craters around the pin more than this load. You know come to think it shot the factory nosler 90ab at 3,175, and you know the advertised velocity was probably tested in a 24" barrel and it is listed on the ammo box at 3,100.
I will usually ease load up til feel some bolt lift but did not with this load due to speed it is cranking out.
It did the same thing with 90AB and IMR4831 as I worked up to near max (actually .5gr under their max listed of 44.5gr) it would reach 24-26" barrel velocity. At 44gr it was running the 90ab 3235.
Thanks for any help.
4 Firings in on brass and primer pockets are approx .2085, just neck sizing in wilson neck die and the 4th fired brass just snug enough to feel closing the bolt.
Bolt opens smooth as glass. Again I don't know why, it just does. The shots over magneto speed last nite went.
3399
3410
3405
Then today first shot in once fired brass went 3401. This load is from Barnes old manual stating max at 45.5gr H4350 with bullet seated 2.61 OAL. That is exactly what I am loading. Started at 43gr and worked up .5gr at a time and was at 44.5gr before primers flattened at all. I stopped at max book but had no bolt lift feel at all, NONE.
Only pressure i see at all is primer crater that you can barely hook finger nail on to feel, but the factory Nosler 90AB load craters around the pin more than this load. You know come to think it shot the factory nosler 90ab at 3,175, and you know the advertised velocity was probably tested in a 24" barrel and it is listed on the ammo box at 3,100.
I will usually ease load up til feel some bolt lift but did not with this load due to speed it is cranking out.
It did the same thing with 90AB and IMR4831 as I worked up to near max (actually .5gr under their max listed of 44.5gr) it would reach 24-26" barrel velocity. At 44gr it was running the 90ab 3235.
Thanks for any help.
- Thread starter
- #5
Oh may make a difference OAL is at 2.61 and case is not 100% has noticeable shake space more like 92% according to Barnes, they emailed me this load data.
Bullet Weight: 80 gr Case Trim Length: 2.035" S.D. 0.194
Bullet Style: TTSX BT Primer: Fed 210 B.C. 0.331
COAL: 2.610" Barrel Length: 24"
Case: Winchester Twist Rate: 1:10"
Charge Velocity Charge Velocity Load
Powder (grains) (fps) (grains) (fps) Density (%)
RL 17 41.5 3166 45.5 3467 92
IMR 4350 42.0 3149 46.0 3425 96
♦ H4350 41.5 3159 45.5 3398 92
Hunter 42.5 3127 46.5 3374 89
HyBrid 100V 41.5 3122 45.5 3399 98
Supreme 780 47.5 3166 51.5 3401 98
Bullet Weight: 80 gr Case Trim Length: 2.035" S.D. 0.194
Bullet Style: TTSX BT Primer: Fed 210 B.C. 0.331
COAL: 2.610" Barrel Length: 24"
Case: Winchester Twist Rate: 1:10"
Charge Velocity Charge Velocity Load
Powder (grains) (fps) (grains) (fps) Density (%)
RL 17 41.5 3166 45.5 3467 92
IMR 4350 42.0 3149 46.0 3425 96
♦ H4350 41.5 3159 45.5 3398 92
Hunter 42.5 3127 46.5 3374 89
HyBrid 100V 41.5 3122 45.5 3399 98
Supreme 780 47.5 3166 51.5 3401 98
- Thread starter
- #6
Wyo7200
Handloader
- Aug 20, 2014
- 565
- 1
-Post removed to avoid confusion-
QL was for an 243 AI.
QL was for an 243 AI.
- Thread starter
- #8
This is what has been so amazing to me, this is a new all factory Model 11 Trophy Youth with 20" barrel at 9.25 twist. In Savage plastic stock and it shoots near as good as any Brux barrel I got in the vault, only the 280AI is any more consistent.
Bought for easy to get around 100 yd gun and dang it shoots. After 3 powders and 5-6 bullets it has yet to shoot an over moa group at 200yds.
Shot this morning at 200 with this load, have not tweaked anything straight Book load matched exactly as posted above. Not in need of tweaking that I can tell.
It just shoots, period. And it is not an easy gun to shoot being short and lite!
Bought for easy to get around 100 yd gun and dang it shoots. After 3 powders and 5-6 bullets it has yet to shoot an over moa group at 200yds.
Shot this morning at 200 with this load, have not tweaked anything straight Book load matched exactly as posted above. Not in need of tweaking that I can tell.
It just shoots, period. And it is not an easy gun to shoot being short and lite!
- Thread starter
- #9
Here you go. Wyo was correct. I had not adjusted for overbore. Did so on this one.
Look about right?
Nodes should be around .855 and .924
Code:
Cartridge : .243 Win.
Bullet : .243, 80, Barnes 'TTSX' BT 30208
Useable Case Capaci: 49.232 grain H2O = 3.197 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.710 inch = 68.83 mm
Barrel Length : 20.0 inch = 508.0 mm
Powder : Hodgdon H4350 ?
Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !
Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms
-10.0 92 40.95 3066 1670 47059 12999 93.0 1.008
-09.0 93 41.41 3100 1707 48488 13168 93.5 0.996
-08.0 94 41.86 3134 1745 49963 13335 93.9 0.984
-07.0 95 42.32 3168 1783 51484 13499 94.4 0.972 ! Near Maximum !
-06.0 96 42.77 3202 1821 53054 13661 94.8 0.958 ! Near Maximum !
-05.0 97 43.23 3236 1860 54673 13818 95.3 0.944 ! Near Maximum !
-04.0 98 43.68 3270 1900 56344 13972 95.7 0.931 ! Near Maximum !
-03.0 99 44.14 3304 1940 58069 14123 96.1 0.917 ! Near Maximum !
-02.0 100 44.59 3338 1980 59849 14269 96.4 0.904 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
-01.0 101 45.05 3373 2021 61687 14412 96.8 0.891 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+00.0 102 45.50 3407 2062 63584 14550 97.1 0.878 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+01.0 103 45.96 3441 2103 65544 14685 97.5 0.866 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0 105 46.41 3475 2145 67569 14815 97.8 0.853 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.0 106 46.87 3509 2188 69661 14940 98.1 0.841 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 107 47.32 3544 2231 71823 15060 98.3 0.829 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+05.0 108 47.78 3578 2274 74059 15176 98.6 0.817 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Results caused by ± 5% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 5% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 102 45.50 3491 2164 68909 14616 98.9 0.846 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 5% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 102 45.50 3311 1948 58319 14324 94.4 0.914 ! Near Maximum !Look about right?
Nodes should be around .855 and .924
- Thread starter
- #11
- Thread starter
- #13
Wyo7200
Handloader
- Aug 20, 2014
- 565
- 1
My mistake! Thanks for catching that. I thought it was an AI that you had. I'll remove my post above to avoid confusion.
- Thread starter
- #15
MAinAR":37a9an5q said:
Dwh7271,
Dwh I just noticed on this QL run you ran at OAL of 2.71" could I get you to run again at 2.61" to see what OBT and pressure predicts? Fixing to load some more test loads and move to OBT so just wanted to double check or is there enough difference to change results?
Code:
Cartridge : .243 Win.
Bullet : .243, 80, Barnes 'TTSX' BT 30208
Useable Case Capaci: 48.055 grain H2O = 3.120 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.610 inch = 66.29 mm
Barrel Length : 20.0 inch = 508.0 mm
Powder : Hodgdon H4350
Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !
Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms
-10.0 86 37.13 2639 1237 37357 10093 88.1 1.172
-09.0 87 37.54 2667 1264 38460 10236 88.7 1.160
-08.0 88 37.95 2696 1291 39595 10377 89.3 1.147
-07.0 89 38.36 2724 1318 40761 10516 89.9 1.135
-06.0 89 38.78 2753 1346 41957 10653 90.5 1.123
-05.0 90 39.19 2781 1374 43183 10789 91.0 1.111
-04.0 91 39.60 2810 1402 44439 10922 91.6 1.099
-03.0 92 40.01 2838 1431 45728 11053 92.1 1.087
-02.0 93 40.43 2867 1460 47054 11182 92.6 1.076
-01.0 94 40.84 2896 1489 48419 11308 93.1 1.064
+00.0 95 41.25 2924 1519 49826 11432 93.6 1.053
+01.0 96 41.66 2953 1549 51276 11553 94.0 1.041 ! Near Maximum !
+02.0 97 42.08 2982 1579 52770 11672 94.5 1.028 ! Near Maximum !
+03.0 98 42.49 3010 1610 54309 11787 94.9 1.014 ! Near Maximum !
+04.0 99 42.90 3039 1641 55896 11900 95.3 1.001 ! Near Maximum !
+05.0 100 43.31 3068 1672 57532 12010 95.7 0.987 ! Near Maximum !
Results caused by ± 5% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 5% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 95 41.25 3006 1605 54000 11643 96.3 1.016 ! Near Maximum !
Data for burning rate decreased by 5% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 95 41.25 2834 1427 45657 11107 90.0 1.094Maybe around 43.7 or so?
- Thread starter
- #17
Wyo7200
Handloader
- Aug 20, 2014
- 565
- 1
I think you are pretty close in your estimates.
Code:
Cartridge : .243 Win.
Bullet : .243, 80, Barnes 'TTSX' BT 30208
Useable Case Capaci: 49.258 grain H2O = 3.198 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.610 inch = 66.29 mm
Barrel Length : 20.0 inch = 508.0 mm
Powder : Hodgdon H4350 ?
Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !
Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms
-10.0 90 40.14 2999 1598 45176 12533 91.5 1.008
-09.0 91 40.59 3032 1633 46464 12703 92.0 0.997
-08.0 92 41.03 3065 1668 47787 12871 92.5 0.986
-07.0 93 41.48 3097 1704 49150 13037 92.9 0.976
-06.0 94 41.92 3130 1740 50555 13201 93.4 0.965
-05.0 95 42.37 3163 1777 52005 13361 93.8 0.954 ! Near Maximum !
-04.0 96 42.82 3196 1814 53499 13520 94.3 0.944 ! Near Maximum !
-03.0 97 43.26 3229 1852 55041 13675 94.7 0.934 ! Near Maximum !
-02.0 98 43.71 3262 1890 56631 13828 95.1 0.923 ! Near Maximum !
-01.0 99 44.15 3295 1928 58272 13977 95.5 0.913 ! Near Maximum !
+00.0 100 44.60 3328 1967 59964 14123 95.9 0.903 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+01.0 101 45.05 3361 2007 61711 14266 96.3 0.893 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0 102 45.49 3394 2047 63514 14405 96.6 0.883 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.0 103 45.94 3427 2087 65375 14540 96.9 0.873 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 104 46.38 3461 2128 67296 14671 97.3 0.864 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+05.0 105 46.83 3494 2169 69280 14799 97.6 0.850 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Results caused by ± 5% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 5% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 100 44.60 3413 2069 64815 14267 98.1 0.877 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 5% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 100 44.60 3232 1856 55190 13832 92.9 0.931 ! Near Maximum !- Thread starter
- #19
