Powder Choice for Competition?

[TeamWolfy]

:?: I am new to the forum and would like some ideas one a good powder for an AR-15 shooting the 69 gr. CC. I live in the Columbia River Gorge and the wind is almost always blowing (at time 40+). The 69 gr. is the heaviest bullet the guns will shoot without "key Holing". I am currently using H 335 with o.k results but I'm sure someone out there can at least point me in another direction. I have also tried the following powders:
W748 - poor results; IMR 4320 - best results of all; IMR 4895 - fair results; IMR 4198 - fair results. I just hate the thought of buying a pound and finding that it doesn't work and then it just sit on the bench for the next 5 years. I have been told Varget is good are there any others I should try? Thanks for the help.
Joe and Jan Wolford
The Dalles, Oregon

 

[cal sibley]

I suspect Varget may be your best option. All my competition rifles are .224s, and my best results come with VihtaVouri133. Until them I had used IMR4198 for a number of years. IMR4895 has been known to produce good results also in the smaller calibers. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

 

[Asa Yam]

If it's simply the smallest posssible group that you're looking for, keep this in mind: Benchrest competitors have spent 50 years trying to shoot a perfect group (all 5 shots going through a single hole that measures exactly the diameter of one bullet). Even when using custom bullets in near perfect ammunition, highly tuned rifles costing over $3000, and anywhere from 3-12 wind indicators along the length of the range, NOBODY on the planet has managed to do it yet. If they can't do it while using all these tools, it is somewhat unrealistic to think that you can with a mass produced rifle - a benchrest quality rifle an AR-15 isn't. Having said that, you can still get good accuracy from one - sub-MOA for 10 shots is a realistic goal.

Accuracy of the rifle depends on a lot of things. Some of it is the ammunition, some is the rifle itself. (And a lot of it is the shooter.) Barrel quality is very important.

• Fortunately, most factory barrels today are usuable, though some are better than others. When properly installed, a good quality factory tube can shoot well.
• The quality of the throat and crown job have an effect. For these, you're at the mercy of the person doing the barreling (and thier tools).
• Barrel length may come into play, since the vibration of the barrel changes with length. Gas port and muzzle pressure affect how the rifle cycles, which can also determine how the rifle shoots.

The AR-15 is designed so best function occurs with medium burn rate powders - i.e., between IMR 4198 (fast) and 4320 (slow). Go too fast, and there may not be enough gas pressure to cycle the action. Use too slow of a powder, and port pressure becomes excessive - the case rim may tear during extraction. Using bullets heavier than the rifle is designed for may require using a slower powder, but this isn't a ironclad rule.
There are lots of powders that fall in the range of "appropriate". These include:

• Hodgdon's H335, Varget, H4895, BL-C2;
• IMR-4895 and 4064;
• Accurate 2495, 2230, 2520, and XMR4064;
• Vitavhouri N135 and N140;
• Ramshot TAC.

And there are lots of other choices I haven't named.

The really important question you haven't answered is "what do you plan to do with the rifle?" First, figure out what it is that you want to do, then determine what you need to do to get there. Only then can you realistically determine what is "good enough". Otherwise, you can spend years looking for the "perfect" load, and never find it, while a 1 MOA load might accomplish everything you need to do. For example:

• There are several different types of competition where a 1 MOA rifle/ammo combination can easily win, if the shooter does thier part (i.e., good sight alignment, trigger control, and position).
• There are days where even sub-MOA ammo doesn't help - shooting at 1000 yard targets with a crosswind gusting over 25 MPH comes to mind. (This happens at Rattlesnake Mountain over in the Tri-Cities fairly frequently.) When things get this bad, the shooter that is best at reading conditions and breaking the shot will probably win. Good ammo and good rifles will only get you so far.
• There are other shooting events where 1 MOA ammo is good enough. Shoot at sage rats or prairie dogs out to 200 yards, and you'll probably still hit 'em if you can hold, squeeze, and read the wind.

 

[Accubond Believer]

Team Wolfy -

Lots of Highpower shooters in Montana use varget. H4895 and reloader 15 are two other popular good medium burn rate powders. I use Reloader 15 myself with the 69 and 80 gr HPBT's, and I have done a bit of testing with benchmark. The speed with the benchmark are impressive so far but I haven't done any longrange (600 yard) testing with it and the 80 gr HPBT.

What ever is available for you will probably be the deciding factor.

Just my two cents.

Steve D. the HP

 

[cal sibley]

I think Asa Yam says it about as well as it can be said although it doesn't mean we won't continue to keep trying for that elusive.000" We've come agonizingly close on several questions, but we're not quite there yet. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal