Why No Love for The .308 Winchester

[Ralt71]

Noted - CBTO... Thx.

I only have anecdotal evidence or experience as it relates to coppers and barrel life. I don't get a lot of fouling, but I also don't send a lot down range once I settle on a load. I think that the relief grooves may assist in decreased fouling. Maybe?

I do a lot of shooting. For form, for load development, for testing equipment etc.. That is why I worry about all these copper bullets, but supposedly the Barnes TSX and TTSX are the worse. I see such good results from them, I often think it's worth the chance though lol. Especially since I really don't know it for sure.

A guy in our camp has been hunting with one or the other in his 30-06 for years. Great shooting, no issues with well hit deer going far, bullet does it's job.

He also gets that gun out in early November, shoots a three shot group to know it's on, carries it for deer season, shoots two to three times killing two to three deer, cleans it mid December and doesn't touch it again until early November the next year. In ten years time that gun has had less shots fired than my PRC in the first week I owned it. haha

 

[JD338]

I've shot the Nosler E-Tip and Barnes TTSX, LRX bullets in a few different calibers and haven't noticed any excessive copper fouling.

JD338

 

[xphunter]

Fouling with mono's is partially dependent on how the mono is made, and the other part of that is is the quality of your barrel.
Generally speaking, if you look through a bore scope of a custom barrel versus a factory barrel you will usually notice a distinct difference.

 

[JD338]

I am trying to find a load for the ttsx’s . My initial attempts were with Varget as that is what I use either the accubonds, but haven’t been successful there.
I’ve got some loads worked up using TAC but haven’t had the chance to get to the range lately. Soon I hope!
3248 is pretty quick!
COL 2.12 is that base to ogive?

The 130 TTSX shoots great in the 308 with TAC.
MV 3050 fps

JD338

 

[Blkram]

I do a lot of shooting. For form, for load development, for testing equipment etc.. That is why I worry about all these copper bullets, but supposedly the Barnes TSX and TTSX are the worse. I see such good results from them, I often think it's worth the chance though lol. Especially since I really don't know it for sure.

A guy in our camp has been hunting with one or the other in his 30-06 for years. Great shooting, no issues with well hit deer going far, bullet does it's job.

He also gets that gun out in early November, shoots a three shot group to know it's on, carries it for deer season, shoots two to three times killing two to three deer, cleans it mid December and doesn't touch it again until early November the next year. In ten years time that gun has had less shots fired than my PRC in the first week I owned it. haha

When you have rifle/ammo combo that performs consistently like that, you use it as is, and maintain complete trust and confidence in it!
I feel fortunate that I have a few rifles that perform like that!
My LH Sako AV in 7MM STW is one, as is my LH Rem 700 300 WSM, and my LH Browning X Bolt in 6.5 CM is another. My LH Sako 85 in 338 Federal is proving to be this way too!
In my lever guns, that was my BLR in 358 Win. I have put a new scope on it and have yet to get it dialed in to my satisfaction...and I have run out of my supply of handloads, so need to get back to the bench and produce some more for it.

 

[xphunter]

@JD338 ,
Nice Shooting!

 

[FOTIS]

The 130 TTSX shoots great in the 308 with TAC.
MV 3050 fps

JD338

Killer load right there!

 

[Ralt71]

When you have rifle/ammo combo that performs consistently like that, you use it as is, and maintain complete trust and confidence in it!
I feel fortunate that I have a few rifles that perform like that!
My LH Sako AV in 7MM STW is one, as is my LH Rem 700 300 WSM, and my LH Browning X Bolt in 6.5 CM is another. My LH Sako 85 in 338 Federal is proving to be this way too!
In my lever guns, that was my BLR in 358 Win. I have put a new scope on it and have yet to get it dialed in to my satisfaction...and I have run out of my supply of handloads, so need to get back to the bench and produce some more for it.

You had me at Sako AV in 7STW.. The LH part could be a problem for me though haha

 

[Wolfshead]

The 130 TTSX shoots great in the 308 with TAC.
MV 3050 fps

JD338

Thanks!
That is and awesome group. Hopefully I can find that kind of success!
I’ll let you all know my results when I get a chance.

 

[Blkram]

Well, you all enabled another rifle deal!
Chatting with a fellow lefty with a penchant for the LH version of the Browning X Bolt All Weather rifles, we are now trading his 308 Win for my 7mm Rem Mag.

I want to try that Federal 308 Win 175 gr Terminal Ascent ammo I have on hand, and he says it is getting 3 shot groups he can cover with a quarter in it at 110 yards with this ammo. And he wants to try the Terminal Ascent 155 gr ammo in a 7mm, which is producing .902" groups in my rifle.

It'll get me reaquainted with the 308 Win in preparation for next year's trip to Africa, where the PH's rifle we'll be using is his son's suppressed LH Rem 700 in 308 for black wildebeest, white blesbok, lechwe, and bushbuck.

In the end, if I cannot finally fall "in love" with the 308, I can still rebarrel it to 6.5 CM, as Susan is still trying to get my rifle as it is "prettier" than her Hunter.

 

[Joec7651]

I have a Remington 783 in 308 Win that I just put a 26” McGowen barrel, and PT&G bolt head on it. I was only looking to get it on paper but zero’d it and completed load work up with 3 rounds. First 3 rounds down the tube went into one hole, 1” left and 1 1/4” high. at 100 yards. I didn’t have my chrono or much of anything else with me so I still have no idea of velocity. H4895 , CCI200 primers, and 150gr E-Tip bullets seems to make it and me very happy. It’s the first McGowen barrel I’ve used and if this is indicative of their accuracy won’t be the last.

 

[Blkram]

The McGowan barrel on 358 Win is also showing good accuracy...also my first experience with them...may not not be my last one either.

 

[JMRhino]

I continue to get great velocities and ES/SD numbers out of my Barnes 130 TTSX and TAC. The third "pulled" shot was not in fact pulled. In error, after my rifle settled from the recoil, I unknowingly rested my barrel direct on the rest when shooting. Stupid mistake on my part. I corrected my form and fired a fourth round that found its way back nested into the group.

 

[Blkram]

View attachment 27219
I continue to get great velocities and ES/SD numbers out of my Barnes 130 TTSX and TAC. The third "pulled" shot was not in fact pulled. In error, after my rifle settled from the recoil, I unknowingly rested my barrel direct on the rest when shooting. Stupid mistake on my part. I corrected my form and fired a fourth round that found its way back nested into the group.

At least you know what you did in error and can/did correct it. Always a good thing!

 

[Blkram]

The LH X Bolt is shooting the Federal 175 gr Terminal Ascent ammo well...averaging 0.757" groups at 100 yards at 2570 fps. 2.2" high at 100, zeroed for 200, and down 9" at 300. Retains 1996 fps at 400 with 1547 ft lbs of energy and a drop of 25.7"
Will continue to practice with it for the the trip to SA in May. Maybe use it for a moose here this fall.

But I am leaning heavily towards having it rebarreled to 25 Creedmoor next summer...24" barrel with 1:7.5 twist for 125-130 gr bullets.
Thinking of another Benchmark 5R barrel, as the one on my 6.5CM is performing so well.

 

[TexasLife]

The LH X Bolt is shooting the Federal 175 gr Terminal Ascent ammo well...averaging 0.757" groups at 100 yards at 2570 fps. 2.2" high at 100, zeroed for 200, and down 9" at 300. Retains 1996 fps at 400 with 1547 ft lbs of energy and a drop of 25.7"
Will continue to practice with it for the the trip to SA in May. Maybe use it for a moose here this fall.

But I am leaning heavily towards having it rebarreled to 25 Creedmoor next summer...24" barrel with 1:7.5 twist for 125-130 gr bullets.
Thinking of another Benchmark 5R barrel, as the one on my 6.5CM is performing so well.

I'm thinking about jumping into the quarter bore soon
25creed

 

[PJGunner]

As I have menioned before, my favorite load for the .308 is the 165 gr. Speer Hot Core for two reasons. One, it is the only load I have found that would at least give me a consistent 1.50" at 100 yards from a Ruger M77 RSI that I got into cheap because the previous owner couldn't even come close. Second, the load is very accurate from a Remington M660 and a Winchester M70. FWIW, the load is a duplicate of the Speer Nitrex ammo which for some reason didn't stay in the market for very long. Too bad as it was good stuff in the RSI. In fact it was the only factory load that worked in that rifle. I broke a couple of rounds down and the charge was 49.0 gr. of a ball powder that I suspected was W750 or something very similar.

I did some research and in an earlier copy of the One Book/One caliber series they show a load with W760 and 165 gr. bullet.
Start: 47.0gr./2551 FPS/46.400 C.U.P.
Max: 49.0gr./2640 FPS/ 50,000 C.U.P.

Strikingly similar to that Speer Nitrex load.
The following is MIA in later issues of this book but it's interesting to see.
220 gr. round nose bullet and W760.
Start: 42.0gr./2177 FPS/42,000 C.U.P.
Max: 44.0 gr./2295 FPS/46/900 C.U.P.
I did a quick work up in the M70 22" barrel and got 2300+ FPS. I don't exactly remember the exact figure but it was something like 2315 FPS. Not all that far off from the advertised 2400 FPS for the 30-06. I found it interesting.
Paul B.