Nosler vs Hodgdon load data, WAY different

[Jurome]

Hi there,

It's nothing new, the variations in load data between Nosler and the manuals (editions), Hodgdon site, bullet manufacturers, etc... Most of the group know how to navigate the waters of such, find a good place to start and then slowly start working your way up, safely. However, last night, I found a very strange, if not , out of this solar system delta (difference). Worthy of mention.

Normally one source or the other might have slightly higher or lower data, and as we all do, use your experience, analyze, find a charge that fits both criteria, somewhat near the bottom of the charge, then go from there. However, last night I had a good laugh when I found this one. This is my new personal best/find for a major difference in load data.

6.5 Creedmoor, Nosler 130 grain AccuBond, Win 760 powder:
Nosler: 40.0 - 44.0 grains
Hodgdon: 35.4 - 39.3 grains

This is the very first time I have ever seen one source's start charge exceed the others' max charge lol.

I have used hundeds of Nosler data successfully for a long time...I am fairly certain I can start near the bottom of this Nosler recipe somewhere and figure it out. I was just thinking of a new reloader with minimal experience stumbling into this one... I see that Hodgdon test OAL was seated deeper, which could play into it somewhat.

 

[Ralt71]

As you mentioned, it's all relative. I would look at what case the two are using, what primer, ensure the barrel lengths and also take note that Hodgdons typically stops around 60k on PSI where Nosler may push closer to the edge of 62k. I remember seeing a load in one of their magazines that had the ceiling charge with only 59k. They left a lot on the table there.

 

[Jurome]

Good points. Both 24" barrels 1:8" different primers and brass...and Hodgdon stops at 60K like you mentioned.
But wow...of all the differences I have seen between sources, this one is the king lol.

 

[SJB358]

For sure. I see it all the time. One of the ones Nosler publishes is around 59 grains of H4831 with a 270 Win and 130. They show that as a 3100+ load and I haven’t as of yet ran across any rifle that’ll get more than about 2900-2950 with the load. Not a big deal as deer and elk will still succumb to the load but I’ve never seen any 270 balk at 3100+ with H4831 with 22” barrels. There are a few others but you all are right that it pays to research a few places to see what the data says.

 

[Jurome]

For sure. I see it all the time. One of the ones Nosler publishes is around 59 grains of H4831 with a 270 Win and 130. They show that as a 3100+ load and I haven’t as of yet ran across any rifle that’ll get more than about 2900-2950 with the load. Not a big deal as deer and elk will still succumb to the load but I’ve never seen any 270 balk at 3100+ with H4831 with 22” barrels. There are a few others but you all are right that it pays to research a few places to see what the data says.

I 100% agree with you...I too have played with that .270 load and my start charge was 300fps or more slower than theirs! Granted I am at sea level below freezing temps and it was very dense air, but nowhere close.

 

[Guy Miner]

Another big one was years ago when Varget was fairly new and 308 shooters, like me, were flocking to it.

Sierra and Hodgdon had two entirely different ideas of what a max charge weight was for the 308 with a classic 168 grain target bullet... Several grains apart. Me being a bit of a velocity junkie - I went with the Hodgdon data and had no problems at all. Even did real well in several matches using ammo loaded that way.

Then there's Hodgdon's 45-70 Marlin lever action data... Whoo Boy! Top end load puts a 400 gr Speer out the muzzle at just over 2,000 fps! Yes, I've loaded and shot it. Not doing that again.... LOL! Way over anybody else's "lever gun" data...

Guy

 

[JD338]

Another big one was years ago when Varget was fairly new and 308 shooters, like me, were flocking to it.

Sierra and Hodgdon had two entirely different ideas of what a max charge weight was for the 308 with a classic 168 grain target bullet... Several grains apart. Me being a bit of a velocity junkie - I went with the Hodgdon data and had no problems at all. Even did real well in several matches using ammo loaded that way.

Then there's Hodgdon's 45-70 Marlin lever action data... Whoo Boy! Top end load puts a 400 gr Sierra out the muzzle at just over 2,000 fps! Yes, I've loaded and shot it. Not doing that again.... LOL! Way over anybody else's "lever gun" data...

Guy

Varget and the 308 is fantastic!
45-70 loads are anything from mild to wild.
I shot a few 400 gr loads around 1850 fps from the 1895 Guide and they were exhilarating!

JD338

 

[Heavy Barrel]

I ran into something similar a couple weeks ago with my .270 WSM.

Both Hodgdon and Lyman manuals list 68gr-71gr of Retumbo with a 140gr projectile, both publications show velocities ranging from the upper 2900's to the lower 3100's, whereas Sierra's most recent publication lists 61gr-67gr. for the same velocities.

Shooting loads based on the Hodgdon/Lyman data I was getting early signs of excess pressure at the 69gr/69.5gr point with velocities 300fps faster than the published data.

 

[jimbires]

this is where a chronograph comes in handy . start out at the low powder charge , load towards the max listed velocity , while watching for pressure .

 

[Jurome]

I ran into something similar a couple weeks ago with my .270 WSM.

Both Hodgdon and Lyman manuals list 68gr-71gr of Retumbo with a 140gr projectile, both publications show velocities ranging from the upper 2900's to the lower 3100's, whereas Sierra's most recent publication lists 61gr-67gr. for the same velocities.

Shooting loads based on the Hodgdon/Lyman data I was getting early signs of excess pressure at the 69gr/69.5gr point with velocities 300fps faster than the published data.

These velocities the manufacturers publish...I rarely take note of them to much of a degree. More often than not, they are using test barrels that are premium and long. Not typically an over the counter, affordable 22" variety. I will look at their data to see out of the list of powders which ones yielded their highest velocities...go from there. For me its all about starting safe, watching for pressure and seeking accuracy. Velocity comes last now as I rarely meet the published data.

 

[Heavy Barrel]

These velocities the manufacturers publish...I rarely take note of them to much of a degree. More often than not, they are using test barrels that are premium and long. Not typically an over the counter, affordable 22" variety. I will look at their data to see out of the list of powders which ones yielded their highest velocities...go from there. For me its all about starting safe, watching for pressure and seeking accuracy. Velocity comes last now as I rarely meet the published data.

Well, I just got myself one of them there fancy new croneyographs by Garmin for Christmas and the weather was reasonable that day so I just had to try it out!! Now I don't have to worry about putting holes in it when ladder testing. Tested two other loads that same day and the velocities from those were fairly close to the published data.

 

[Jurome]

Oh man I love these chrony's!! Well done, having one they certainly make range days very fulfilling. I had a hard time making the decision but then once I did the "buy once-cry once" decision there's been no looking back. I get a lot of onlookers at the range; once they see them in action they always tell me "I'm gonna get me one of those!"

 

[RossRR]

Well, this is my first post to the forum but I came here for the same reason. I recently acquired a Model 77 22-250 that came with a few hundred rounds of reloaded cartridges. Not wanting to shoot someone else's reloads, I disassembled them, dumped out the old powder was going to reload them with H380. The bullets are a 55 gr. Spire Point (manufacturer unknown) and my Hodgdon reload handbook said start at 10% less than 41 grains of H380 (36.9 gr) but I have a Hornady handbook from when I first acquired my reloading gear back in '75 that says the max load is 36.3 grains. I went ahead and loaded the first 100 with 37 gr. but haven't had an opportunity to get to the range because it is too danged cold for my taste to be sitting on a cold bench trying out my reloads. I assumed that since I'm at the bottom of Hodgdon's recommendation, I should be OK but am having second thoughts. Normally, I'd pick a powder load that falls somewhere in the middle of different sources recommendations but that doesn't work here. Any thoughts? Should I disassemble again and just go with a lesser charge within the bullet manufacturer's data? I don't want to stress the barrel of the new to me rifle.

 

[jimbires]

Welcome to the Nosler Forum . I dug out my books , you're going to be good . if I could make a recommendation , don't load so many until you shoot a few and be sure they are what you want . loading ammo is fun , tearing ammo apart , not so much . Hope this answers your question .

my Nosler book shows 37.0 as the most accurate load tested .





this book doesn't show H380 powder . here is the info I have for future reference .

 

[RossRR]

Welcome to the Nosler Forum . I dug out my books , you're going to be good . if I could make a recommendation , don't load so many until you shoot a few and be sure they are what you want . loading ammo is fun , tearing ammo apart , not so much . Hope this answers your question .

my Nosler book shows 37.0 as the most accurate load tested .





this book doesn't show H380 powder . here is the info I have for future reference .

I appreciate your feedback. Looking at Hodgdon data, they recommend the same powder loads for 50 or 55 gr. with different velocities resulting.
I admit I was probably a little over zealous with loading up a hundred rounds. Sitting up here on the frozen tundra called MN in the winter leaves me with a lot of time on my hands so once I started reloading, it just felt good to have something to do.