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- #21
tim knight
Beginner
- Jul 20, 2006
- 12
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again thanks for all your replies still not decided which one to get but its between the 30 06 and the 300 wsm ?
.30 Caliber
- Thread starter tim knight
- Start date
roysclockgun
Handloader
- Dec 17, 2005
- 736
- 0
tim knight wrote: " but its between the 30 06 and the 300 wsm "
My evidence is only anecdotal, but it is my contention that all of history is nothing more than a compilation of accepted anecdotal reports, so here goes:
I owned two Winchester M70 rifles in 300WSM. Sold both. Reasons: Feeding was not as smooth or as positive as with 30-06. Fired cartridge cases from Winchester factory ammo showed signs of too high pressure. I hand load, so I know the signs and I believe that Winchester was pushing the envelope on this cartridge, in order to have the 300WSM complete with longer magnum cartridges. The gain in MV was not enough to accept the increase in recoil and muzzle blast when compared to 30-06.
I own a number of rifles chambered for 30-06. I will probably die still owning my two favorite rifles in that caliber. Reasons: No problem finding ammo just about anywhere in the world. Performance comes up to and beyond anything that I have ever asked the cartridge to do. Feeding with the long case is flawless. Nearly an endless selection of hand load components. My own personal limit on range is 400 yds. My 30-06 cleanly kills at that range, if I do my job. Just about any action from single shot to semi-auto is readilly available off the rack, chambered for 30-06. Lastly, millions of hunters cannot all be wrong when they say, "If you are limited to one rifle, make it in 30-06!"
My evidence is only anecdotal, but it is my contention that all of history is nothing more than a compilation of accepted anecdotal reports, so here goes:
I owned two Winchester M70 rifles in 300WSM. Sold both. Reasons: Feeding was not as smooth or as positive as with 30-06. Fired cartridge cases from Winchester factory ammo showed signs of too high pressure. I hand load, so I know the signs and I believe that Winchester was pushing the envelope on this cartridge, in order to have the 300WSM complete with longer magnum cartridges. The gain in MV was not enough to accept the increase in recoil and muzzle blast when compared to 30-06.
I own a number of rifles chambered for 30-06. I will probably die still owning my two favorite rifles in that caliber. Reasons: No problem finding ammo just about anywhere in the world. Performance comes up to and beyond anything that I have ever asked the cartridge to do. Feeding with the long case is flawless. Nearly an endless selection of hand load components. My own personal limit on range is 400 yds. My 30-06 cleanly kills at that range, if I do my job. Just about any action from single shot to semi-auto is readilly available off the rack, chambered for 30-06. Lastly, millions of hunters cannot all be wrong when they say, "If you are limited to one rifle, make it in 30-06!"
DIXIE
Beginner
- Nov 12, 2006
- 96
- 0
308 leaves little to be desired
A 300RUM with a 180 Partition moves out around 3000fps ish A puny old 308 is 2500-2600 fps (All this is generalized). but with prety close to only half the powder. Both sighted in at 200yards the dif in drop at 300yards is 3 inches. Just past a hundred yards the 300RUM is going the same speed as the 308. So if twice the powder and recoil can kill elk at 600yards the little 308 is only good for 500. The most popular round on all long range compitions this year has been the 308 and it has been this way for some time. The 30-06 is about 200-300fps faster than the 308 above 168 grains. Yes in all real world shots the 308 leaves little more to be desired. I have killed more elk with a 308 but this was because my Savage 99 fits on my saddle better then anything else and it is very light.
It is UNAMERICAN to not own a 30-06 Also when I guided in Mt and some old guy showed up with an 06 and during conversation I would find out that this was his only rifle. I knew I was not going to have to track some wounded animal all night long. I cringed when a 300RUM or 338 guy would show up.
It is UNAMERICAN to not own a 30-06 Also when I guided in Mt and some old guy showed up with an 06 and during conversation I would find out that this was his only rifle. I knew I was not going to have to track some wounded animal all night long. I cringed when a 300RUM or 338 guy would show up.
roysclockgun
Handloader
- Dec 17, 2005
- 736
- 0
RRIES wrote : "It is UNAMERICAN to not own a 30-06 "
LOL, I second that......When my uncle returned from the battlefields of Europe in 1946, he picked up his father's Winchester Model 54 in 30-06 and killed everything at which he pointed, up to and including bears, elk and moose. Like Jack O'Connor wrote :"Beware the man who only owns one rifle....." A pragmatic hunter who does not get trapped into accepting every new Whizzer caliber that comes down the pike, can spend a lifetime of hunting successfully with a 30-06 and never be undergunned.
I have to admit, before coming to the above conclusion, I have hunted with a fair number of Whizzer calibers. They have all gone to others, through sales, but the 30-06 is still on my rack.
LOL, I second that......When my uncle returned from the battlefields of Europe in 1946, he picked up his father's Winchester Model 54 in 30-06 and killed everything at which he pointed, up to and including bears, elk and moose. Like Jack O'Connor wrote :"Beware the man who only owns one rifle....." A pragmatic hunter who does not get trapped into accepting every new Whizzer caliber that comes down the pike, can spend a lifetime of hunting successfully with a 30-06 and never be undergunned.
I have to admit, before coming to the above conclusion, I have hunted with a fair number of Whizzer calibers. They have all gone to others, through sales, but the 30-06 is still on my rack.
roysclockgun":1o59fyp4 said:
roysclockgun
Yeah......some folks call this rifle UGLY; http://new.photos.yahoo.com/mulhernric8 ... 0751697/10 my OWN camo design I might add! But when it gets down to the 'nut cuttin' all others would be done away with ceptin this one! It's so DAMN UGLY.....it'll shoot me 8" groups all day long from 1000 yds.!! What's in this stock is my first NRA Match Rifle that I put into a .458 Win stock I had for a while, bedded it with MarineTex compound; in addition I 'Blue-Printed' the action. This is the original Hart barrel that I've got 'umpteen thousands' of rounds through with very little throat erosion!
All them 'chillen' think they gotta have the latest MAG LOUDENBOOMER......but I'm glad! Let 'em keep on thinking that cuz I don't want '06 brass to become scarce!! :lol: :wink:
roysclockgun
Handloader
- Dec 17, 2005
- 736
- 0
Sharpsman wrote : ".....it'll shoot me 8" groups all day long from 1000 yds.!! "
I applaud you, Sharpsman. I can't shoot that well and on my best day, years ago, I could not have done that.
The "PURTY" in your "ugly rifle", is in the fact that it LOOKS so darned deadly. When I see a man sitting at the bench with a rifle that looks as does yours, I assume that he is hitting all at which he aims.
The action looks in the photo to be a Mauser. True?
I applaud you, Sharpsman. I can't shoot that well and on my best day, years ago, I could not have done that.
The "PURTY" in your "ugly rifle", is in the fact that it LOOKS so darned deadly. When I see a man sitting at the bench with a rifle that looks as does yours, I assume that he is hitting all at which he aims.
The action looks in the photo to be a Mauser. True?
roysclockgun
Handloader
- Dec 17, 2005
- 736
- 0
Did the older M700 Rems. have the bolt handle silver soldered to the bolt, or is it forged?
- Thread starter
- #30
tim knight
Beginner
- Jul 20, 2006
- 12
- 0
roysclockgun
thanks for the message just the thing i was looking for ncie to hear the bad points as well as the good. Looks like its the 30-06 for me. Thanks again to everybody who replied its made my decision a lot easier.
thanks for the message just the thing i was looking for ncie to hear the bad points as well as the good. Looks like its the 30-06 for me. Thanks again to everybody who replied its made my decision a lot easier.
roysclockgun
Handloader
- Dec 17, 2005
- 736
- 0
whiplash wrote : "I would much rather spend range time with my 308's, than my 300 Win Mag. "
In a perfect world, the .308Win would always work. Sadly we do not live in a perfect world. Field shots do not always duplicate range shots. The Magnum cartridges came along for good reason. That is to say, in order to reach out farther and hit harder.
How many of us can adhere to a self imposed max range of 300 yds., if and when we finally encounter the buck of a lifetime, standing broadside at 400 yds. or more? The Magnum is nice to have.
How many of us have had a wounded animal look back from a far ridge at 400 yds. +, just before crossing over and being lost forever? Even if this has not happened to you, I wager you have heard similar tales! The Magnum is nice to have!
Range work? You can load down a 300WinMag to recoil no more than does a .308Win. You can practice with that baby until it feels as if it is an extention of your arm. You can shoot from various positions with it until any position feels comfortable for you. Then load up the hunting charge and shoot a couple boxes in the weeks just before the hunt.
It is far better to have a Magnum and not need one, than to need a Magnum's range and killing power and not have one!
A far shooting rifle will always kill close up, but the reverse cannot be said as being true. When you pony up the bucks for guide, license, travel and time away from work, do not go undergunned, unless you are an expert who knows that he can do with a .308Win. what us lesser folk need a .300WinMag to do.
In a perfect world, the .308Win would always work. Sadly we do not live in a perfect world. Field shots do not always duplicate range shots. The Magnum cartridges came along for good reason. That is to say, in order to reach out farther and hit harder.
How many of us can adhere to a self imposed max range of 300 yds., if and when we finally encounter the buck of a lifetime, standing broadside at 400 yds. or more? The Magnum is nice to have.
How many of us have had a wounded animal look back from a far ridge at 400 yds. +, just before crossing over and being lost forever? Even if this has not happened to you, I wager you have heard similar tales! The Magnum is nice to have!
Range work? You can load down a 300WinMag to recoil no more than does a .308Win. You can practice with that baby until it feels as if it is an extention of your arm. You can shoot from various positions with it until any position feels comfortable for you. Then load up the hunting charge and shoot a couple boxes in the weeks just before the hunt.
It is far better to have a Magnum and not need one, than to need a Magnum's range and killing power and not have one!
A far shooting rifle will always kill close up, but the reverse cannot be said as being true. When you pony up the bucks for guide, license, travel and time away from work, do not go undergunned, unless you are an expert who knows that he can do with a .308Win. what us lesser folk need a .300WinMag to do.
YoteSmoker
Handloader
- Oct 3, 2006
- 1,602
- 0
or an '06 
roysclockgun
Handloader
- Dec 17, 2005
- 736
- 0
YoteSmoker wrote : "or an '06 "
I am the last person who will argue with a man who prefers a rifle in 30-06. Heck, that cartridge has done it all and more, over the past 100 years.
That said, the bar has been raised, in terms of the cost of hunting, especially when one is paying an outfitter/guide and out of state license fees. All of that adds up to me to mean that someone just getting into hunting and needing a first rate rifle/cartridge combo to hunt the great west, would be better served to take advantage of the extra range and hitting power that a .300WinMag provides.
Can one expect to hunt successfully any legal garm animal in N. America using a 30-06? You bet they can!...........In certain situations, will a hunter carrying a rifle chambered in 300WinMag or other .30cal Mag have a number of advantages over the shooter of the 30-06? You bet they do.
Last time I looked, the biggest .30cal Mag was the 30-378. That thing is a monster that I do not care to shoot, but some love it. I had a 300RUM and sold it after working up loads for a year and never getting much more out of it then I was getting from a .300WinMag. It all boils down to what one wants, what works for them and the dream.
This site provides an exchange of opinions and like noses, everyone should have at least one.
I am the last person who will argue with a man who prefers a rifle in 30-06. Heck, that cartridge has done it all and more, over the past 100 years.
That said, the bar has been raised, in terms of the cost of hunting, especially when one is paying an outfitter/guide and out of state license fees. All of that adds up to me to mean that someone just getting into hunting and needing a first rate rifle/cartridge combo to hunt the great west, would be better served to take advantage of the extra range and hitting power that a .300WinMag provides.
Can one expect to hunt successfully any legal garm animal in N. America using a 30-06? You bet they can!...........In certain situations, will a hunter carrying a rifle chambered in 300WinMag or other .30cal Mag have a number of advantages over the shooter of the 30-06? You bet they do.
Last time I looked, the biggest .30cal Mag was the 30-378. That thing is a monster that I do not care to shoot, but some love it. I had a 300RUM and sold it after working up loads for a year and never getting much more out of it then I was getting from a .300WinMag. It all boils down to what one wants, what works for them and the dream.
This site provides an exchange of opinions and like noses, everyone should have at least one.
Jeff Olsen
Handloader
- Nov 10, 2006
- 294
- 2
moreloader":272ed4nr said:
The 300 WSM I shot kicked harder than my 30-06... but then they were different rifles (Savage vs. Remington) so who knows...
-jeff
