bullets for whitetails?

[Chazz]

i am using a 30-06 and a .308. both with 150 gr bullets. i have been shooting the AccuBond bullets and had some run 80 yards or so with absolutely no blood trail before piling up dead from well placed shots. would i have better luck with a kill on spot by using the 150gr ballistic tip hunting bullets? i also want to be able to use eat the meat. Recomondations please
thanks
Chuck

 

[Guest]

Even if you switch to the BT, you may have deer run a ways. I had that experience with a 180gr 8mm BT just last season. Shot through both lungs and ran 60+ yard off into the brush. Because the sage bromgrass and other brush in the area was over 5' tall, it took me over 2hrs to find him. Zero blood trail. When I dressed him, his entire chest cavity was filled with blood (flooded out when I cut him). Deer are funny creatures, in that sometimes they drop on the spot, but many times they will run - while effectively quite dead - for a hundred yards or more. I don't think it would harm you to switch to the BTs, but I'm not sure you'll gain much.

I also shoot 168gr BTs in my 30-06, and last year had a doe take a lung shot from 181yds (lasered) and continue to walk around feeding after doing one of those crazy flying buck-kicks. Put another one in her about 30-60sec later and she dropped on the spot. Go figure.

 

[JD338]

Chazz

Welcome to the forum.

The BT will open up quick and produce fast kills on deer with well placed shots.
The 150 gr BT from a 30-06 at 2900 fps should give you the results you are looking for, provided you put the bullet where it needs to go.

JD338

 

[Ridgerunner665]

You'll have better luck putting them down "on the spot" if you shoot the shoulder...not behind it, through it. Ruins a little meat, but they don't (can't) run off to parts unknown.


I like BT's, but AB's should be OK too...I've killed at least 40 deer with 165 and 168 grain Ballistic Tips from a 308...none went anywhere...but I've always been a "shoulder buster".

 

[PJGunner]

I've posted about my "one trick pony" Ruger M77 RSI, a rifle that will only be accurate with one load, the 165 gr. Speer Hot Core at a sizzling 2550 FPS. :shock: At last count I've taken about 10 deer with the load, big Arizona Mule Deer and the farthest any has run was 35 feet. Most dropped on the spot or staggered just a few feet. I've only recovered one bullet, that one from a deer shot st 250 yards facing me. Bullet traveled almost the full length of the deer and retain 65 percent of it's original weight. Most der wer shot broadside or slightly quartering and exit wouns were anywhere from about 1.5" to 3.0" depending on is bones were hit. I've always used the 190 gr. Sierra Pro-Hunters in my 30-06. I gave up on 150 gr. bullets in the .308 and 30-06 due to what I felt was too much good meat being ruined. Frankly, I don't think a premium bullet is necessary for deer. However, choose whatever bullet you feel works best for you and makes your rifle happy.
Paul B.

 

[Chazz]

thanks everyone for the imput. sounds like either is a good choice. i used to shoot the remmington core locked pointed soft points and had lots of deer run especially behind the shoulder shots. there are lots of hunters in my part of pennsylvania and the area i hunt, it is a one shot area. i lost 2 buck to them runing off and other hunters got them. i switched to the AccuBond and had lots more luck. i really like them but thought maybe the hunting bt might expand a little quicker to get a faster knockdown but i have seen older bts really destroy the meat. i have older greet tip bts now are they the same as the ones that are being sold now but say ballistic tip hunting on them?

 

[Guy Miner]

The Ballistic Tip is my favorite bullet for deer, and I've happily used it in several different cartridges, 6mm, .25 & .30 cal mostly. Accurate, rapid expansion and yet tough enough to punch through and exit.

"Ballistic Tip Hunting" differentiates those bullets from the lighter Ballistic Tips intended for varmint shooting.

Depending on how old your Ballistic Tips are, they are likely the same construction as the new ones. Tell you the truth though - I was impressed with the B-Tips even the first versions that some criticized as too fragile back in the 1980's and early 1990's. Admittedly, they did expand real quick, and real big... Worked great in a deer's chest though!

Like some of the other posters, I've come to accept some meat loss and often target the shoulder to drop deer instantly. Time to time they've needed a finishing shot, but they haven't gone anywhere with a Nosler through the shoulders. I'm okay with losing some meat, for an easy recovery.

Not sure why this year I made behind-the-shoulder shots on both the pronghorn and the mule deer on my recent Wyoming trip. That's where the crosshairs settled, and it looked good enough to me, so I took those shots. In both cases the little 115 gr .257" Ballistic Tip dropped them instantly. No follow up shots needed, no tracking involved. Just go over and take care of the game. The little bullets exited, but without any great loss of blood. I suspect it's because the heart stopped beating instantly.

Same results last year on a young whitetail buck with the 165 gr Ballistic Tip from my .308 Win: bang, flop. Done. That was a shoulder hit though, and a bigger exit wound, which I attribute to the bigger .30 cal bullet.

I'd recommend mid weight Ballistic Tips. No need to drive 'em real hard, though they'll take the velocity just fine. Take a look in the Bullet Test section here, a lot of different Ballistic Tips have been tested by hunters & shooters who are members of this site. Interesting results.

Would also recommend that you consider moving your point of aim forward, and accepting some meat loss as a result of the shoulder hits. You'll still get most of the good meat, and those shoulder hits tend to be real good at anchoring game. I'll take that, happily.

Really appreciate your account of your whitetail hunting with the Accubonds. Am always interested in learning more about how different bullets performed for hunters. Maybe they're just too tough a bullet for your lung-shots on whitetail? They are pretty well constructed with a really thick jacket and that bonded core.

Welcome to the Nosler forum and best of luck! Guy

 

[Guest]

Guy brings up an interesting point. Perhaps (though it's more load development) a 165gr bullet would be the better choice. Switch up to a 165gr BT (or the 168 if you like it - I do), and you'll be running something like 2700-2900fps with either rifle, depending on barrel length and the best charge weight for your rifle. Try H4350. Anyway, work them up and you might find they are more devestating to the white-tails, and also hold up better on shoulder shots than the faster moving 150s. Just a thought. Of course, if the 150gr AB load you have is accurate, they'll hold up well through the shoulders, too.

 

[1Shot]

I have killed hundreds of WT deer with about everything from a bow through the 45-70 over the past 40 some years. I helped do crop damage control for 19 years. I can honestly tell you that it is not what you hit them with but WHERE you hit them that puts them down right in their tracks. Put that bullet in the center of the front shoulder and most of the time it drops in it's tracks. I like the 125 gr Ballistic Tip kept below 3000 fps on impact best for 30 cal. drop a deer in it's tracks medicine.

 

[JD338]

thanks everyone for the imput. sounds like either is a good choice. i used to shoot the remmington core locked pointed soft points and had lots of deer run especially behind the shoulder shots. there are lots of hunters in my part of pennsylvania and the area i hunt, it is a one shot area. i lost 2 buck to them runing off and other hunters got them. i switched to the AccuBond and had lots more luck. i really like them but thought maybe the hunting bt might expand a little quicker to get a faster knockdown but i have seen older bts really destroy the meat. i have older greet tip bts now are they the same as the ones that are being sold now but say ballistic tip hunting on them?

Chazz,


If it were me, I would go with the 165 gr BT and take high shoulder shots. :wink:
They go straight down and don't even move.
I shot this crop damage deer this past summer at 439 yds with this shot.

JD338

 

[Mighty Peace]

Stick to the Accubonds, a better big game bullet IMO over the BT's or BST's. I use the BST's for predators in my 243 & 22-250.

Furthest shot I took at a whitetail (8x7) was back in 2004 or 05 ....554 metres....double lung pass thru, the buck flipped over backwards dead. I let him finish mounting a doe and then when he turned to see another doe come out of the timber and he was broadside......BOOM!!!! One shot for my 300WM with 180gr AccuBond.

Same day, about an hour before the whitetail, I took a 150 class mulie at 45 metres, quartering away..1 shot-took 2 steps and flipped over.

Me, I love the Accubonds-proven performance at the range and on big game...its all I reload in my rifles except my 243. When my boys get older I will load AB's in it for deer...a 100gr would be nice if Nosler makes it in the near future.

 

[FOTIS]

150 AB

 

[DrMike]

Shot placement is the key. Deer can and do run when shot through the heart/lungs. They can cover an amazing amount of territory in a very short amount of time. I'd likely prefer the AccuBond, but there is nothing wrong with the Ballistic Tip in the calibres you name.

 

[Oldtrader3]

I still use Partitions and have a lot of success with high lung shots. I like the frangibility of the bullet helps with lung shots at least on deer. They don't go very far or live very long after being shot with a Partition.

I can't remember a deer running more than 10-15 yards sfter being shot in the last 20 years. All except one that I hit too low at long range and he went a couple hundred yards.before I shot him again.

One thing about Partitions that may work for you is they do penetrate and you have two holes for a blood trail. I have never had a Partition not go completely through a deer.

 

[onesonek]

I agree on most, specially the higher forward lung hits. Other than that, give me exits with enough weight to insure exits. Add me to the 165 gr. AB or PT.
However, in the .30-06 I even prefer 180 PT, as it is my everything round since most my shots to date been under 250 yds.
I'll add, in the new .308, my plan for it is the 165 gr. AB.

 

[CatskillCrawler]

It never bothered me to see a deer run off 20-100 yds after a double lung shot. It's dead on its feet and will be easy to find. Unless I need to anchor one, I never consider the high shoulder shot. I like my ground venison and that's what shoulders are for. I've shot a pile of deer with the 140gr AB and have never felt lacking or desiring another bullet. Have seen DRTs and catapult launch starts but they all have the same ending.

YMMV

 

[Polaris]

I favor an older style bullet, the 150 Speer mag tip or other speer hot cor or Hornady interlock, this is in .300 Sav and .308 win. Not a really sexy BC but always leaves an exit hole on decent shot angles doing plenty but not excessive meat damage along the way. For the 30-06 i'd either reduce the velocity to .308 levels or go up to a 165 gr bullet. It's not so much violent expansion you need but a clean exit wound. Conventional lung/heart shots do not lend themselves to DRT on whitetails no matter what bullet you're using.

Northern whitetails are tougher than people give them credit for. They're not that hard to kill but they like to run across the rainbow bridge. On closer shots with deer not on high alert I favor the high neck shot. Always drops them on the spot with little usable meat loss. I abhor deliberate near side shoulder shots, would use one only as a last resort on a wounded deer or with a low velocity round such as a shotgun slug or .45-70. They do waste a lot of meat, sometimes most of both front shoulders and a good chunk of backstrap with a high velocity modern bullet. When you butcher 100+deer per season you learn these things (part time seasonal work at the butcher across the road). I like to informally poll hunters on rifle and bullet used on their deer. Nicest wound channels I see are with conventional cup and core interlock, hot cor or core lokt style bullets in the 150-165 grain range in .30 cals. The old 180 RN core lokt is really sweet but not many folks shoot those anymore. The newer über bullets seem to do more damage. Monolithics are showing some promise but I haven't seen many examples of wound channels with those yet. They are not suitable for my main hunting rifle and i see no need to change in the others.

 

[Oldtrader3]

I have not hunted whitetail for a few years since they are not common here in Washington and only live in one county, 270 miles east of here. I have hunted them in other states that I lived in or hunted in, including: Wyoming, Texas, Georgia, Maine, Oklahoma, Quebec and Ontario. Even have hunted the slightly different specie whitetail on Anticosti Island. However, all whitetail share traits and the method of hunting (still hunting) has always been the same for my whitetail hunts.

I have killed them with everything from a .32 Winchester to a .300 Mag. Most were shot either by a lever gun or by my .270 Win. I do not do neck shots except for one deer that I only could see the neck and he was 40 yards away. I try to shoot deer high in the lungs and hit the shoulder blades which seems to paralyse them and stop them pretty much in their tracks.

 

[FOTIS]

onesonek:

In my Tikka T-3 Lite 30-06 I use the 165 PT at 2800 fps for everything also!

 

[SJB358]

It never bothered me to see a deer run off 20-100 yds after a double lung shot.

Same here, that is why it has never bothered me to use PT's on deer. They open just fine and leave blood all over the deck. Pretty easy blood trail. Pretty much all of my rifles are loaded to hunt elk but I wouldn't ever worry about smoking a deer with one either.

The one exception is hunting in Brian's club area, it is WET and it is alot nicer to have deer laying where you shoot them, but I know that isn't going to happen everytime with anything short of a MK19.