Custom rifle questions

[Guest]

Just for the sake of argument, who here owns a truly custom gun, purpose built for you, by a smith, who did more than talk to you on the phone before he screwed everything together.

I am asking because it seems that there are a number of semi-custom, or production-custom gunmakers out there, and they are truly proud of what they sell, especially when it comes to writing the check. Now, I understand that a custom gun isn't going to come in under $1000, but if I am going to spend a couple grand on a rifle, what do I get for my money? How about if I spend three? Is there much to gain going higher, or is it pure cosmetics at that point?

I own some nice guns, for the record, but I am considering a custom in an obscure medium or big game caliber just for fun. All thoughts appreciated.

 

[remingtonman_25_06]

For the record, I dont own a custom rifle, but the benefits are great. Consistency is the number 1 thing I see with a custom rifle. They will usually shoot .5 MOA or better regularly. Not every now and then, but all the time. It helps to talk to a smith who is interested in the same type hunting/shooting you do. This way he has somewhat understanding of whats needed/wanted in situations. You can true up a 700 action, screw a barrel on and with the gunsmithing work, will probly be in the $1000 range. You will have a great shooter. To go a full blown custom route, like custom action, barrel, stock, trigger, etc.. you will have a top of the line shooter. Theres also endless oppurtunities that you can do with a custom. You can make it any caliber you want, any barrel length, countour, twist, different stocks. As for sending rifles away and paying that money. Well its all up to you. As for me, I feel like I've spent enough time on a couple forums to trust a few well known gunsmiths with my rifles. I wouldn't let just any joe blow work on my rifles, no way, no how. Hes got to have a good reputation for building accurate rifles, and be interested in what your interested in. You can easily have $3-5K in a top quality rifle. That dont mean its going to shoot any better then a $2000 rifle though. Its still the nut behind the trigger...

 

[madman]

I've had two scout rifles built for me by Ted Yost. One was a 458 Lott that has been nicknamed ScoutZilla.

It was built "just for fun" as you might say. It's not your typical big bore rifle. It started life as a "Classic Sporter" Winchester in .338 Win Mag. I like .338, but this particular rifle just didn't ring any bells for me. Ted and I discussed it in great length, and the result is fantastic. There was a lot of time put into the finer details. And some of the really incredible work is hidden under the wood.

--Mark

 

[7mmfan]

Custom rifles are beauty in the eye of the beholder. Yes, custom rifles are expensive, but if you want something special that is built to your exact specifications then true custom is the way to go. I have two complete custom rifles built by RW Hart of Pennsylvania. First, why custom for me. I was tired of buying high end off the shelf hunting rifles that had attrocious accuracy. The list included a Kimber 8400 Montana, a top-end Weatherby, a Remington Custom shop KS to name a few. My first custom, and my new baby, is a 30 Hart built on a Remington 700 action with a McMillan stock. By going custom, I was able to have my exact length of pull, design my custom barrel taper, select my style of stock and the color pattern of the stock and a few other details. The main reason for building this particular custom rifle though was accuracy and by accuracy I mean consistent, verifiable accuracy that must be experienced to be believed. I bought this rifle to replace my Remington Sendero that I had been using since 1994. I wanted a rifle that cut my accuracy in half, but weighed 1 1/2 pounds less than my fluted Sendero and with a catridge a step up from the 7mm Remington magnum. The result.......my 30 Hart weighs 9 pounds ready to go w/ scope and shoots 180 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips @ 3220 fps and three shots go into the same hole and I mean the same hole.....averages .150 - .190 depending on me.....defintely worth the price of five regular hunting rifles.

Brad

 

[Savage99]

I would like to see a specification sheet made up by all of us for a custom rifle. For some reason just word of mouth may not do it with some smiths.

You might want to check in with Allen Day on this or Forrest B.

For myself I have a few customs but these days I have more fun tweaking factory guns. The latest is a JC Higgins M 50 and a Savage or Stevens switch barrel may be next.

To each his own.

 

[Guy Miner]

dubyam - I sprang for two customs. Both have met expectations:

1) Win 70, built for NRA match shooting, by Jim Cloward. The walnut stock was selected for straight grain and light weight, to meet existing Palma weight restrictions. He took it from a chunk of wood, to a wonderful match stock in the good old Dunlap pattern. Adjustable length of pull and a handstop. Large barrel channel to take a wide variety of different custom barrels.

Action was trued. Medesha two-stage match trigger fitted. Setup with both match sights and scope mounts. Also has a stripper clip for quick reloads in the rapid fire stages of an across the course match.

I've got several barrels for it by Hart, Krieger and Obermeyer. It's always been a .308, which lets it meet Palma regs, and also serve for other matches. Generally I run a 30" tight-bore Krieger with a 1:13 twist, and load 155 grain ammo to 2980 fps. Very accurate and dependable rifle. There are newer, better match rifles available, but this one shoots far better than I can, so it will stay around.

2) Rem 700 with metal work mostly by Jim Cloward, and stocked by Rick Freudenberg. This rifle has been used for 10+ years of SWAT duty, some match shooting, as well as varmint and deer hunting. It too is a .308, designed for rough use in tough conditions. It has always proven up to the task. Stock is McMillan's fairly new M40A1-3. I had it made with a longer Length of pull to fit me better, and also had a forend rail and handstop fitted. Barrel is a Krieger 24", 1:12 twist. The chamber was cut to accept Federal Gold Medal 168 grain match ammo, and it shoots that stuff very well. It has produced 2.5" groups at 600 yards, from the bipod with that factory match ammo.

Me, in the red shirt, picking it up after being stocked by Rick Freudenberg of http://www.freudscustomrifles.com

Rick builds rifles for world class match shooters as well as hunters. He knows exactly what he's doing. That's his 24x scope on it in this photo - used for checking accuracy after a build... It's accurate!

The standard Remington trigger was used, but set crisp, at 3#. The scope is mounted in Badger rings on a Badger base. Good stuff, but spendy. I gulped when I wrote the check for $300 worth of base and rings. Solid though, mighty solid...

This rifle has been through really tough conditions, including being dropped six feet onto rocks, and has never lost it's zero... Good piece of gear. If I re-make it, I'll likely try to shave a little more weight from it, but I've hiked and hunted with it all day long, no problem.

Regards, Guy

 

[fredj338]

I think every rifle "crank" should have at least one custom rifle made. Now custom means diff. things to diff. people. Personally, I wouldn't pay $2K+ for a syn. stocked rig. I know they can be incredibely accurate but so can a stock M700 w/ a proper bbl. No, for me custom means wood & blue steel.
I have always wanted a old time mountain rifle, like the ones built back in the day before anyone hunted w/ a rifle weighing less than 9.5#. I bought used M70 for the donar action then had my gunsmith put together a walnut stocked, 23"bbl., 7.25# mountain rifle. The stock is done in the Win, ft.wt. style w/ a small Euro cheek piece, skeleton grip cap & Niedner steel but plate. The wood is pretty plain, very straight thru the forend & looks good in an oil finish w/ borderless ribbon checkering. It was just over $2K & looks like a custom rifle & even shoots like one too. A bad day is when it breaks 1moa. Sorry the pics aren't better.

 

[JD338]

fredj338,

Very nice looking rifle. What caliber is she chambered for?

I have a semi custom 700 with a Hart #5 flutted 24" barrel in 280 AI.
Its at the gunsmith getting fitted into a LSS stock. I should have it back
in 3-4 weeks and will post some pics.

JD338

 

[Guest]

Nice rifle, fredj338. That is actually pretty close to what I have in mind as a custom gun, so that gives me some ideas to play around with. Cost is really a question, for the most part, of what I am willing to spend, and what I get for my money. I don't think I will ever get into a $10000 rifle, but there sure are a lot of them out there. I also agree with you about spending money on a custom synthetic, because I have the feeling I can come very close in fit, function, and utility with a significant savings, doing the work myself, as far as getting the right stock, bedding the action, and such. I already do my own trigger work, and am starting to contemplate getting the equipment to do my own barrel crowning. It would offer some utility for me, as I am starting to amass a few rifles, and with the waiting period with the local smiths, if I could re-cut and re-lap my own crowns, I would be ahead of the curve, as well as sure of the quality. What really blows me away is stuff like the Ed Brown rifles, where they are production guns, albeit very accurate ones, in synthetic stocks, and cost upwards of $3500 to get. And you don't get unlimited choices of caliber/cartridge, either. Not for me, I believe. Not that there's anything wrong if you have an Ed Brown, but I don't find them valuable to me. There are many others the same way, from other shops.

And I like blue steel and wood, too. Even if it isn't as durable or unwavering as synthetic.

 

[Guy Miner]

fredj338 - that is one great looking rifle, and I'll bet it feels good in hand, or firing it too. Nice, really nice!

I've got a couple of factory sporters, Rem 700 CDL's that I think mighty highly of - they're what I would have had custom built, except they're about an inch short in the LOP. For a while I can live with that.

Walnut and blue steel is my favorite - but with my customs I needed something different. One has a walnut stock which I love, the other a McMillan because it's what I needed.

Really wish I had something like that outstanding rifle you posted!

Regards, Guy

 

[Jeff Olsen]

I have two rifles that I guess would be semi-custom. For both, I sent the barreled action to PacNor for an action truing and a rebarrel of my choice. One is a M700 30-06 and one a Model 7 in .358 Win. I used the existing stock for both rifles with modification as needed to clear the new barrels. Both have laminate stocks.

I "built" the 30-06 because I'd worn out the factory barrel. I absolutely love the rifle now- it is fast, accurate, and a great hunting rifle. I went from a factory Mountain profile to a standard 22" sporter profile. This rifle has a Jewell trigger too. Love it!

I built the Model 7 because I wanted something that didn't exist- a bolt-action, stainless, compact rifle in .358 Win for whackin' blacktail at moderate hunting ranges. .358 is about as good as it gets for that! I went with a 20" barrel.

It would be fun to have a truly custom rifle built. I think, though, that what I'd want wouldn't be that far from what already exists, mainly because what really rocks my world is hunting rifles that get used in the field. So, for instance, one of those new Model 7 XCR's in 325 WSM would be awesome- but they don't exist. So it would be fun to make one exist. I personally don't have a whole lot of interest in the truly wacky calibers or inventing my own wildcat- maybe later in life I will, but not yet!

You can, IMHO, get about 95% of the functionality of a $5000 custom rifle with a $1000 "custom" rifle like I've had built. Have one of the barrel makers screw a tube on your action, lap the lugs, true things up a bit and have your local smith fit your stock to the result- it will work great! It's like anything else; you hit that point of diminishing returns. That said, you want a truly custom gun and can afford it without shorting your kids or cheating on your taxes, go get it! It's a free country, more or less!

-jeff

 

[HunterJim]

Fred,

Did our friend at Duncan's build that rifle?

jim

 

[358WINMAN]

Dubyam--

I have one custom and one redo on a factory remington.

I have found Kevin Weaver of Weaver Rifles Inc., in Peyton Colorado to be an excellent communicator, takes the time to ask and evaluate the questions, answers and needs of the shooter/hunter. His work is outstanding and his prices are very fair in todays gun guru market.

The phone calls aren't rushed and his personality is not cocky at all, but more sincere than my pastor's!

You can contact him at kevin@weaverrifles.com or 719-683-3024. Tell him Stew from NJ referred you.
Wood or synthetic, blued or stainless wildcat or factory you want it, he'll make it as sweet as can be!
Good luck.

 

[Jaywalker]

Customs have several advantages. First - consistency is likely to be good. This isn't necessarily just fantastic accuracy, though it's likely to be pretty good. Some of them will put multiple loads - powder and bullets - into the same place, over and over, year after year, even if ignored for months at a time. Pick it up in November and any load shoots to the same point of aim. Second, good bedding gives more than just accuracy. I want to travel with mine in a "shotgun"-type case and am now in the middle of a test to see that it reassembles and shoots - again - to the same point of aim. Finally, things can go wrong, and when they do, you can call the "maker" - not a customer service department - and get an answer. These are all some valuable benefits.

Jaywalker

 

[coyotetrapper]

Surgeon actions are as good as they get! I don't own oen but knowing others that do and the mill work they do it is a good action. Action cost about 1800.00 a full gun 4,000. They will shoot and shoot well. All things are measured to your needs. I would like to own one some day.

The other great option is HS Precision rifles, they are great as well a buddy of mine has the varmint in .243 and all come with 1/2" accuracy gurantee. You can pick stock color, shape and sizes to fit you and they make high quailty stuff. Cost 2435.00 complete. These guys have contracts for weapons and ammo with many government agencys and make top of the line items. Your gun takes about 14 weeks to get built. My buddys is topped with a leupold vari x III varmint reticle, it sure is a coyote killin machine. You can get some good nosler or norma brass in the .243 and make it a true tack driver. This would be my first option and they can make yours in any standard caliber short or long action.

Until then I'll shoot my rem 700's and both of the above metioned have used the 700 action as the copy for there rifles.

 

[roysclockgun]

I have had a number of custom rifles built over the past 45 years. All of them were built simply because I had the action from military rifles, mostly Third Reich K98k actions. Usually I ran into a new barrel at an action and that would get the ball rolling.
I did not use any of htem for anything but my own pleasure, hunting and casual competition. I had a lot of fun with all of them, because people are always drawn to things unique and will approach at the range to find out "What the heck is that?"[/img][/url]

 

[ps300wm]

I will second Kevin Weaver in Peyton Colorado. He barrelled a DWM mauser action for me with a #2 Shilen barrel in 25-06 Rem. (I did the stock work myself). I could not be more pleased. It shoots sub 0.5" @ 100yds and 0.9-1.2" @ 200yds. He does wood or synthetic, basically what ever you want. The best thing was how easy he is to work with. Also, turnaround time and price are very reasonable. My experience on two custom/semi-custom rifles has been that it is worth the effort(at least performance wise). The main thing is to do your home work and choose a gunsmith with the same care you would a doctor. It is cheaper to do it right the first time.