Got to test my new .243 AI on some rock chucks today

[FLAT BOLT]

Someone needs to keep you 2 in line!

 

[Woodycreek]

Haha. Not me! Our other friend is the one that gets out of hand.

 

[DrMike]

Wow! Performing necropsies on chucks without a blade! That's pretty cool. :mrgreen:

 

[SJB358]

Someone needs to keep you 2 in line!

Not a chance!

 

[Reconnoiter]

Seeing my hits is why one of my first custom guns was a 16lb .308 Baer built by Bruce Baer with a muzzle brake shooting 150gr Ballistic Tips at 3600fps. People couldn't believe I would build a gun like that to shoot chucks. Most of our shots were from the truck so the weight wasn't a issue.

I've shot chucks with .223, .22BR, 22-250, 6BR, 6mm Rem, .243AI, 6-284, 6-270 imp., 25-06, 6.5-284, 264wm, .270-7rm, 7-08, 7saum, 7rm, 7-300wm, 7STW, .308, .300wm, .308 Baer, 30-338, 30-8mm, 30-358STA, 338-378, 338 Baer, 358STA, .375 H&H, and .416RUM. The only thing close to a .30 caliber magnum that I've seen is the 7mm magnums with 130gr Sierra single shot pistol bullets and 180gr JLK's. A friend, the same friend I went with this weekend, and I actually built full 1.25" x 27" barreled guns in .338-378, .358STA, 375 H&H, and .416RUM to shoot chucks with. We shot 180 and 200gr BT's in the .338's, 180gr pistol bullets in the .358's, 200 and 220gr flat nose hollow points in the .375's, and 300gr Barnes X's with huge holes drilled in them for the .416's. All the calibers above .30 blew holes right through the them.

Back when we paid 185.00 for Hart barrels, powder was 10-11.00 a pound, and 150BT's were under 13.00/100 it was much cheaper to shoot the bigger calibers a lot. Now that I'm married with a 10 month old son and another on the way they usually take a back seat to the 6's but I do have a good stash of 150BT's and R-22.

Curiously enough,I shoot more than a fair amount of 30-8mm and much prefer the 243AI.

Given your penchant for 150NBT's at a 3600fps launch,a 23" 243AI spitting the 105A-Max at 3200fps,gives up a "whopping" 170fps of 500yd impact velocity.

PLEASE say something about "energy".

 

[DrMike]

Reconnoiter,

Welcome to the forum. It's good to have you aboard.

 

[wildgene]

...energy???, Well, a pdawg hit w/ a .25 75gr. V-Max started @ 3800fps tends to turn inside-out, but one hit w/ a 87gr. TNT started @ 3600fps tends to become, well, "disrupted"... :mrgreen:

 

[DrMike]

...energy???, Well, a pdawg hit w/ a .25 75gr. V-Max started @ 3800fps tends to turn inside-out, but one hit w/ a 87gr. TNT started @ 3600fps tends to become, well, "disrupted"... :mrgreen:

Very good, Gene. Very good, indeed.

 

[Reconnoiter]

...energy???, Well, a pdawg hit w/ a .25 75gr. V-Max started @ 3800fps tends to turn inside-out, but one hit w/ a 87gr. TNT started @ 3600fps tends to become, well, "disrupted"... :mrgreen:

I shoot a bunch of the .257" 75V-Max and rather like them for numerous things,including Venison.

Can't like the TNT's in any diameter,for any application...even yeoman duties such as case forming.

 

[IdahoCTD]

I don't think energy has much to do with it or the .416's and other bigger calibers would win hands down. Even with bullets drilled out the construction of the bullets in calibers over .30 are too heavy. We even tried single shot pistol bullets in the .358STA's but they were still too tough. Bullet diameter and explosiveness is what matters until you lose the explosiveness. The small chucks can be launched 10 feet or so with a lot of smaller calibers but they won't explode with parts flying 30+ feet like a big .30 caliber and the right bullets.

I just watched some video we did on VHS about 15 years ago of chucks we propped up to see how high we could get them to fly. I forgot even making the video but a friend pulled it out the other day when I was over visiting him. It was pretty cool seeing the chucks flying 30-40ft through the air. My buddy even had a dead chuck he acted like he was feeding a carrot to and had another friend shoot it at about 15yds. He's more brave/crazy then I am. If it was digital I'd put it on youtube.

A .243AI does a good job for a small caliber. I have a couple 6mm's and shot them for years, then built a 6BR and shot if for several years, and this year I'm shooting the .243AI. I had a 6-284 I shot for awhile also. Honestly though a .308 win with the right bullets will do everything a .243/6mm will out to 4-500yds. I remember shooting the top of a chucks head off as it peaked over a rock with my .308 and 130gr Speer hollow points. I hit him in the nose and it sent the top of his head flying through the air like a helmet. We laughed about that one for hours.

 

[Reconnoiter]

Of course energy is moot. Goo Flinging is simplistic in it's mechanics. The key players are impact velocity,rotational velocity and projectile frangibility.

When velocity thresholds are in approximation,rotational velocities in approximation and projectile frangibility in approximation,like results will be found...irregardless of headstamps or barrel shank chambering denotations.

The .308" 150NBT is far from an X in it's integrity,though it's jacket is a bit thicker than a .243" 105A-Max's. I built both on my 3008mm's 1-10" and 9" is routinely my go to .243" twist rate,so despite the initial velocity advantage of the paltry .435BC 30cal at 10",the 9" 105A-Max do like things,at the distance cited.

As distance increases,the 105 gains favor,due to greater residual velocity.

Hint.

 

[IdahoCTD]

I've shot chucks over 800yds with 150BT's and despite it losing velocity rather rapidly with such a low BC the "goo" explosion and flight time with the the 150BT is still better than a 6mm 105gr Berger/Amax etc. even at 500yds. In the days when I shot my big .30's a lot the only bullets with decent BC's were SMK's. Bergers weren't even a twinkle in someone's eye. I've shot my fair share of both and neither one performed like the paltry BC'ed NBT's. I still have several hundred Bergers from the first year they came out. You know the boxes of 50 (.30 cal) without lot numbers or part numbers in little yellow boxes that became what they call a hunting bullet today. Maybe the NBT's of today are tougher then the ones 15+ years ago as I haven't bought any in years. I bought thousands of them back when I was shooting them a lot and still have a few hundred. I know the 180gr BT's were built tougher back then because I dissected all of the .30 cal BT's as well as the .338's and .358's.

One thing your overlooking is the mass of displaced tissue by the bullet diameter with everything else being equal.

Wink

 

[Reconnoiter]

I built my first 30-8mmRemmag(300Super),20yrs ago and it wore a 30" Rock McMillan 1-10" Palma contour. Followed it up shortly with a 26" fluted #5 PN and have hated lonnnggggg spouts ever since. Took the 300H&H plunge too(700 and 70). Had a herd of 300Wby's in both OEM and Custom spouts (700 and Sako based),along with a herd of 300Winny's(mainly 700 based,but Sako,Ruger,Winny,were represented). Slummed a TRG-S in 30-378Wby upon their inception,if only for giggles...though it was the biggest POS I've ever been subjected to.

Few hate Berger terminal affects,more than I...the only thing worse,being a SMK.

I cite the .308" 150NBT's,when they were 100 count boxes. If only for reference,though I've shot them from inception and have current attempts on my shelf.

The .308" .435BC 150NBT with a 3600fps launch,arrives the 800yd line at a "whopping" 1975fps. That speed is akin to the 100yd impact speed of 150's whistled out of a Turdy-Turdy 94 lever gun.

You can bullshit the fans,but you can't bullshit the players.

As an aside as the .308" NBT's of yore go,the 165 was the most zookie and by a large margin.
Just sayin'.

 

[IdahoCTD]

I'm not bullshitting anyone. I've been building my own guns for 20 years. I bought my lathe in 1992. It's a Frejoth made in Taiwan. Before that I had a local gunsmith and Bruce Baer build me a few including a .308 Baer with a 30" 1.25" straight Hart barrel, a sporter with a #5 Hart in .308 Baer, and a .308 with a 28" 1.25" straight Hart. I built a .30-.358STA before Kenny Jarrett adopted it as a .300 Jarrett. So while you may think your the new supreme being on this planet I've been down this road for some time as well. I know ballistics quite well too and the 150BT's are going over 2100 at 800yds and the elevation I shoot chucks a lot at. Still enough velocity to expand and they do. I still own the Zeiss optical range finder I used back then so I knew the distances as well. I have a couple lasers now as well.

Since learning to build my own guns I have rarely shot a factory barrel and still have 15 or so take off factory barrels in my gun room. You need one? I have 9 factory 7mm Remington Mag barrels. I've built over 100 custom barreled rifles for myself and have 12 custom barrel blanks in one of my safe's right now from McGowen, Rock Creek, Obermeyer, Bartlein, Krieger, and Hart plus one on order still from Obermeyer. I still have 30 or so of the 100+ custom rifles too plus 4 or 5 Rem. 700 actions and a couple extra bolts. I also have 2 Stiller TAC338's on order. I've built rifles with the above barrel makers along with Douglas, Schneider, Shilen, Lilja, Pac Nor, Blackstar (K&P), and Lothar Walther but I might have missed 1 or 2.

I could list all the calibers I've built as well but it would probably take me awhile to list them all. There are a lot of them and some weird ones.

The 150's worked better for me then the 125's or 165's.

While we are laying it on the line I'm not fond of Savages either, and won't own one, but I don't tell someone it looks like crap even if I think it does. It's my opinion and I don't necessarily need to piss on their parade because of MY opinion.

 

[FLAT BOLT]

...I am still liking the 58 gr Vmax from the 6mm. If I find better chuck areas where the ranges start to open up, I can see the need for bumping up to a 70, 90 or 105 gr bullets to battle the Idaho winds.

 

[Woodycreek]

That 58gr Vmax leaves a small size exit hole :lol:

 

[DrMike]

That 58 grain VMax does seem to smack those varmints hard.

 

[257 Ackley]

VMax bullets make great explosions, but if you are getting over 3-400 yards the AMax seems to do a better job of battling the winds IMO. I do enjoy the "lift" that the Vmax bullets give a chuck or prairie dog though :lol: .

 

[FLAT BOLT]

I am being strong armed by "others" to go to these Amax rounds - so I am not opposed to loading up a few, just more shooting for me!

 

[SJB358]

I am being strong armed by "others" to go to these Amax rounds - so I am not opposed to loading up a few, just more shooting for me!

i haven't shot alot of AMax's, but what I have shot have been really accurate.. Going to give them some serious range time when I get home..