Antelope_Sniper
Handloader
- Jan 25, 2008
- 2,618
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Sounds to me like he's more then a little over 70K psi....
It Will Be A 6.5-300Wby After First Of Year
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That's what I'm guessing. I always come back to Scotty when I hear other peoples' ridiculous velocities.
That about sums it up.
For the record, RL25 is a very slow powder, and of the near perfect burn rate for the 300Wby. There is published data in the Lyman guide showing a 180gr Barnes X (the original X) running in the high 3200fps range (something like 3275fps or so) and so I believe velocity is available with this powder. I just don't think you can get 3700fps out of a 150gr bullet without exceeding all safe limits. I'd bet he's pushing 80kpsi or so, which may or may not show up on the brass, depending on what he's using. Also, remember that some people believe you're not over pressure until you need a mallet to open the bolt and you can't reprime the case. I'm a good bit more conservative than that.
That about sums it up.
For the record, RL25 is a very slow powder, and of the near perfect burn rate for the 300Wby. There is published data in the Lyman guide showing a 180gr Barnes X (the original X) running in the high 3200fps range (something like 3275fps or so) and so I believe velocity is available with this powder. I just don't think you can get 3700fps out of a 150gr bullet without exceeding all safe limits. I'd bet he's pushing 80kpsi or so, which may or may not show up on the brass, depending on what he's using. Also, remember that some people believe you're not over pressure until you need a mallet to open the bolt and you can't reprime the case. I'm a good bit more conservative than that.
remingtonman_25_06
Handloader
- Nov 17, 2005
- 2,806
- 403
Heres what I come up with on QL.
300 WBY, 150g NBT, 3.560", 26" bbl, and RL-25 powder
To get 3700fps, you'll be trying to stuff 95g of powder, which is a 116.5% load density. Your also at 79,330 psi, which is WAAAAAAY HOT!
According to QL, max is 89.8g for a velocity of 3493fps at 63,695psi.
300 WBY, 150g NBT, 3.560", 26" bbl, and RL-25 powder
To get 3700fps, you'll be trying to stuff 95g of powder, which is a 116.5% load density. Your also at 79,330 psi, which is WAAAAAAY HOT!
According to QL, max is 89.8g for a velocity of 3493fps at 63,695psi.
- Oct 30, 2004
- 24,458
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They are toying with destruction and I do not care if they are not getting any visible pressure signs.
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bullet
Handloader
- Dec 26, 2007
- 4,975
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POP":rgcv2bwc said:
I have for 28yrs done load development for the 300Wby and have no problem pushing a certain bullet and load to at least max. But POP is dead on, these guys are toying with destruction or tragedy. You have to understand that a Mark V and Weatherby brass will hide the degree of pressure just by their design. As much as I like speed I would not be doing what these guys are doing.
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- #46
bullet
Handloader
- Dec 26, 2007
- 4,975
- 18
Look guys, I am not stopping the 6.5/300Wby effort for no reason.
The trouble I have discovered talking to Smith's who build F-Class rifles with big case 6.5's is high pressure in long barrels.
One smith who does know his stuff said,
"The most common chambers I do for these F-Class rifles are the 6.5x.284Norma and .308win. The 6.5x.284 will shoot faster in a 27" barrel than in a 30"......??????........I am no engineer but I think in our testing is that the super long VLD's in 6.5mm....worse than any other caliber.....have a ton of bore drag and the longer they are in the barrel (longer barrel) the more pressure they build up. We are using 3grs more powder with lower pressure and higher velocity in the shorter barrel. I tested this with a customers gun. Started at 31" at shortened to 26 1/2" a inch or so at a time. Using the strain gauge it all played out.
One shooter had a similar, but lesser extent, experience with his 31" 338edge.
Back to the big cases. A 6.5x300 will not out run a .264wm by enough to matter. I don't think a 300wby case will get near 3400fps with a 140. A .264 will just do 3000 and a 284 will do 2900. 10grains more powder probably won't get 400fps.As for pressure, all the 6.5's when loaded to the top have spooky pressure curves. I think it goes back to the bullet bearing surface."
These are just a few of the comments that I are consistent with other shooters and smith's who have experience with the 6.5mm in large cases.
I will be happy as a rat alone in a corn bin with a 300Wby with at #4 or #5 contour 27" or 28" stainless barrel pushing a 208gr Amax or 210gr Berger
The trouble I have discovered talking to Smith's who build F-Class rifles with big case 6.5's is high pressure in long barrels.
One smith who does know his stuff said,
"The most common chambers I do for these F-Class rifles are the 6.5x.284Norma and .308win. The 6.5x.284 will shoot faster in a 27" barrel than in a 30"......??????........I am no engineer but I think in our testing is that the super long VLD's in 6.5mm....worse than any other caliber.....have a ton of bore drag and the longer they are in the barrel (longer barrel) the more pressure they build up. We are using 3grs more powder with lower pressure and higher velocity in the shorter barrel. I tested this with a customers gun. Started at 31" at shortened to 26 1/2" a inch or so at a time. Using the strain gauge it all played out.
One shooter had a similar, but lesser extent, experience with his 31" 338edge.
Back to the big cases. A 6.5x300 will not out run a .264wm by enough to matter. I don't think a 300wby case will get near 3400fps with a 140. A .264 will just do 3000 and a 284 will do 2900. 10grains more powder probably won't get 400fps.As for pressure, all the 6.5's when loaded to the top have spooky pressure curves. I think it goes back to the bullet bearing surface."
These are just a few of the comments that I are consistent with other shooters and smith's who have experience with the 6.5mm in large cases.
I will be happy as a rat alone in a corn bin with a 300Wby with at #4 or #5 contour 27" or 28" stainless barrel pushing a 208gr Amax or 210gr Berger
The guys from Alberta Tactical Rifle out of Calgary were saying the same thing in regard to barrel length with a 338 Lapua AI, they started long and did pressure testing, they found a 29" barrel to be the best in .338.
I have a 31" barrel in 264 and it gives pressure a bit faster than normal. This is due in part to having 0.3" less throat than SAAMI spec, I think the rate of twist helps this out a little bit as well. I never thought to seat any deeper since I already had alot of bullet inside the case, but a bit of jump may help bring the pressure down too. I wouldn't mind getting rid of a couple inches of barrel, but want to take it off the chamber end after setting the chamber back a bit.
I'll let you guys know how this works out, I am going to paint it this winter, but am not sure if I want to use dura coat or what yet.
JT.
I have a 31" barrel in 264 and it gives pressure a bit faster than normal. This is due in part to having 0.3" less throat than SAAMI spec, I think the rate of twist helps this out a little bit as well. I never thought to seat any deeper since I already had alot of bullet inside the case, but a bit of jump may help bring the pressure down too. I wouldn't mind getting rid of a couple inches of barrel, but want to take it off the chamber end after setting the chamber back a bit.
I'll let you guys know how this works out, I am going to paint it this winter, but am not sure if I want to use dura coat or what yet.
JT.
Richracer1
Handloader
- May 12, 2005
- 2,142
- 122
All this talk about barrel length has me wondering what the 7mm, 300, and 338RUMs would be capable of with a 28" instead of the 26" and the 90 - 100+ grains of Retumbo we put in them.
Imagine humping a 28-30 inch barrel up the side of a wash in Idaho trying to chase elk down! Now that would make a man of all of us. It is pretty cool to think about having that much long range power though. I would really like to have a 264WM when I come across one. I like to hear about the 338 Edge though. Read some stuff the other day about a guy keeping MOA groups out to 2K yards with his Edge. That is pretty awesome shooting. Cool discussion though. Good luck with them. Scotty
Antelope_Sniper
Handloader
- Jan 25, 2008
- 2,618
- 0
I hump a 12 pound rifle with a 30" #5 coutour barrel when I'm in broken to open country. But a try to keep something with a shorter barrel handy incase I have to some thick dark timber.
remingtonman_25_06
Handloader
- Nov 17, 2005
- 2,806
- 403
My 338 EDGE is around 13 lbs. Thats the whole package, with 8 shells on the rifle, sling, base/rings/scope, bipod. Its got a 28" HART stainless/fluted sendero contour, with DE muzzle brake, so 30" of steel hanging off my action. Its about the heaviest that I can pack comfortably in the elk/bear country I hunt in.
Its not my brush gun however. When were on top hunting in the trees I'll take my 7 mag w/24" sporter bbl w/brake. It weighs in around 10 all ready to go w/bipod, but still feels a helluva lot lighter then my 338.
Its not my brush gun however. When were on top hunting in the trees I'll take my 7 mag w/24" sporter bbl w/brake. It weighs in around 10 all ready to go w/bipod, but still feels a helluva lot lighter then my 338.
RM2506, I realize they are purpose built rifles for long range shooting. I think they are awesome rifles, I have humped enough .50 barrels for the M2 to know they aren't light. I am sure with the right sling system they are great to pack. I was just talking about climbing in and out of a drainage with a 13lb'er on my back with other stuff. I like to read about you all with the LR stuff. For me, I am happy to pack my 9lb 300 Win Mag, and not worry too much about it. Plus, knowing you all hump that kind of weight around makes me feel like I need to add some more weight to my ruck!. Scotty
