Loading on the lands...

[bobnob]

A couple of posts on another thread got me thinking a bit more about this issue. I quite often begin load development with the OAL such that the bullet is actually kissing the rifling, providing mag length allows it.

I then reduce OAL in increments if I find accuracy is not where I want it with a kiss on the lands. Usually I find good accuracy with the kiss unless something else is amiss but not always.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Am I going about this the wrong way?

Opinions or experience would be appreciated.

Bob

 

[Divernhunter]

Depends on the bullet and use.
Swift, Barnes and Nosler like a lot of jump so starting at the lads is a waste of time and expensive bullets. Also you cannot push them as fast and fast is better for hunting.
If you are loading other TARGET(match type) bullets at lower power levels then I do not know as I am not a "target shooter".

 

[desertcj]

Yes, this is how I find the max load for any given powder/bullet combo. I actually seat .005" off so I don't have to worry about sticking a bullet in the lands if I extract an unfired shell.

 

[pharmseller]

I do it the same way. I color a bullet with a black Sharpie and seat the bullet on an empty unprimed case. I seat gradually shorter until the marks left by the lands are square. That's my max OAL.



P

 

[ElmerThud]

Depends on the bullet and use.
Swift, Barnes and Nosler like a lot of jump so starting at the lads is a waste of time and expensive bullets.

Finding max oal to the lands is a good piece of info to have, but as above, the Nosler AB does indeed like a good jump and in my rifle this is .040”
However, there are often more than one accuracy nodes to be found with a cartridge/barrel, so having determined max oal, it may well be best to start shorter & work toward lands.
Each to their own depending on experience.

 

[ShadeTree]

Depends what you're trying to accomplish. If shooting target or competition you might very well find it's easiest to find the spot on winning combination with a variety of bullets touching the lands.

For hunting, there is of course those that are set up for long range and can single load. But for normal hunting with a variety of situations, no way no how do I want a bullet anywhere close to being in against the lands. Desertcj's post is just one case in point. ONE piece of standard office paper is .004 thick. Think about how thin that is. A small burr on a case head, walking through the woods with buddies heading to a spot and your bolt is open and a small piece of brush or debris gets on the bolt face, and suddenly your reliable bench load has a bullet jammed into the lands. The scenarios for problems out in the field are numerous when running tolerances that close. When it comes to hunting I view everything as function, function, function, and so does dead game in the freezer. I wont go closer than .015 for hunting. If a rifle can't find sub MOA accuracy somewhere from .015 and farther back, it's got problems other than seating depth. My opinion, but of course everybody is free to do as they choose.

 

[SJB358]

A bullet just touching but not jammed will not stick, even if it was .005 in the lands it’s pretty unlikely to stick unless you’re running uber light neck tension. I don’t typically jam but I will start up close with cup and core Bullets if possible. With Bonded or monos I don’t start any closer than .050”.

I think you’re just fine with how your working it Bob.

 

[diverdown]

I actually stay away from this procedure as some powders like to "spike" pressures when the bullet has no jump. A little clearance is a good thing.

 

[Charlie-NY]

I've yet to see a factory rifle that would allow you to load out to the rifling and still fit in the magazine.

For a hunting rifle, I typically start at magazine length and work from there.

If you measure the distance from the cartridge base to the bullet ojive of your reloads you will notice that they typically vary a few thousandths. So if you load to "kiss the lands", than one cartridge will be "into" the rifling and the next may be "off" the rifling. That is a BIG difference IMO. On the rare occasion that I'm inclined to load into the rifling, I will usually load .010" or so in.

Interestingly enough, I've found that several of my rifles shoot as good, or better, when bullets are loaded quite a distance from the rifling. Some as far as .200".

 

[ShadeTree]

I've yet to see a factory rifle that would allow you to load out to the rifling and still fit in the magazine.

For a hunting rifle, I typically start at magazine length and work from there.

If you measure the distance from the cartridge base to the bullet ojive of your reloads you will notice that they typically vary a few thousandths. So if you load to "kiss the lands", than one cartridge will be "into" the rifling and the next may be "off" the rifling. That is a BIG difference IMO. On the rare occasion that I'm inclined to load into the rifling, I will usually load .010" or so in.

Interestingly enough, I've found that several of my rifles shoot as good, or better, when bullets are loaded quite away from the rifling. Some as far as .200".

Yep. And from lot to lot ogive location can vary more than that. As far as magazine length you are correct, most factory guns at magazine length will have you well off the lands. Remington seems notorious for a long throat......loading to magazine length will often have you no where remotely close to the lands. BUT, I have a Winchester model 70 on the other hand that would have you in big trouble if you loaded to magazine length. Saami max O.A.L on an 06 is 3.340 to fit in any magazine. My gun with 150 hornady FB and 150 speer hot core's for example are hitting the lands at 3.225. I load them .040 off at 3.185. Same thing with 180's, WAY short of magazine length when they're into the lands. Must of been a factory glitch with an extremely short chamber but the gun is a shooter so it doesn't bother me.