20 cartridges to rule them all

[filmjunkie4ever]

In the same vein of Blkram's thought-provoking posts, I submit the following to the collective for discussion.

If you could, which would be the 20 cartridges that could stay, and the rest were ended in the name of standardizing production and materials for availability? Although this is only a hypothetical, current conditions apply. What I mean by that, for example, is there is no time machine to go back and make the US Armed forces adopt the 6mm Remington to make it more popular and available.

Such a concept would never fly, but if you potentially could, which would make the cut and what is your justification for it?

Ideally for me these would be the 20:

1) .22 Long Rifle: This earliest of self-contained cartridges is still far and away one of if not THE most popular cartridge to ever exist. Of course it is number one.
2) .223 Remington: Accurate and deadly with little recoil, it is a staple in the NATO community and with hunters alike. And you can find guns/ammo everywhere!
3) .22-250 Remington: For when you need more reach than a .223 but not appreciably more recoil, enter the .22-250. Sorry .220 Swift, you just aren't as popular.
4) .243 Winchester: A top ten seller since inception, this combo varmint/deer round is a perfect gun for cheechako and veteran shooters alike. Everyone should have one!
5) .25-06 Remington: Recoils like a .243, hits like a .270 Winchester. Perfect antelope and mule deer cartridge. The .270 could just as easily go here instead.
6) 7mm Rem Mag: If one must have a magnum for hunting, this one is it for me. It checks a lot of boxes; ballistics of the newer 7mm's with easier to find components.
7) .30-30 WCF: Lever gun guys all have a deep love for this wonderful 1895 vintage hunting cartridge. Long live the thutty-thutty.
8) .30-06 Springfield: The ultimate all-around hunting cartridge and World War champ it ought to be standard issue for every citizen when they get their driver's license.
9) .300 WSM: Basically any .30 magnum spitting a 180-grain bullet to 2900+ fps could go here but this one seems to kick the least.
10) .338 Win Mag: Keeping muzzle brake companies in business since 1958, it kills on one end and cripples on the other. Accept no substitutes.
11) .38 Special: The choice of backup, C.C. and purse guns since the 1890's, its a great cartridge even today. AND you can shoot them in a .357 Magnum!
12) 9mm Luger: Ditto the .38 Special attributes but with a higher magazine capacity. +P loads make it better yet.
13) .357 Magnum: Forget +P in your .38, if you need more juice get the original engine block busting, crime spree stopping, polar bear killing, .357 Magnum!!
14) .375 H&H Magnum: Going to Africa? Don't forget to take one of these along. Make sure to load it accordingly, there isn't anything it can't handle on this planet!
15) .44 Rem Mag: If you can't get it done with a .357, you likely won't be able to shoot a .44 worth a darn but the .44 is a darn good handgun/carbine cartridge. Yeet!
16) .45 ACP: Like the .30-06, the .45 ACP has kept the 20th century fascism free worldwide. If you don't want a 9mm, this is your baby.
17) .45-70 Govt: Sorry .444, but the .45-70 does mostly what you can do and is easier to get components for. Be careful how you load it, it can have some mean recoil!
18) 20 gauge shotgun: While not the success that is the 12 gauge, it is a good option for uplands, trap shooters or anyone wanting a bit less punch than the 12 gives.
19) 12 gauge shotgun : An obvious best seller, the 12 gauge can be used for a lot of different stuff with small shot and large, steel, and of course slugs!
20) This one is a three-way tie for me, 6.5x55 Swedish, .270 Winchester and 7mm-08/7x57mm Mauser. All have merits but I just couldn't decide so its a tie!!

Lets have yours!!!!

 

[Horsethief]

That is a good list. Trading out a similar cartridge of the same caliber can always happen such as in general hunting scenarios a 300 Win will mostly do what a 300 Wby achieves.

 

[RL338]

I agree on most of your list , but I would change a couple.
4) 243 Win I would scratch. Having both the 243 and 6mm Creed , I would choose the Creed. Shorter brass allows longer bullets not seated deep into case. The 10 twist barrels on the 243 are a thing of the past.
10) 338 WM would get the boot in favor of a 340 Wby. Again I have both but if you’re a magnum you need the full length case.

 

[salmonchaser]

Great list, I love the 338 wm as well as 340b class cartidges. Really don’t understand how they never became popular. Actually I do, every 338 I’ve owned kicked more than my 375 HH. Regardless, I think 338 is nearly as perfect a round as the 375 HH.

 

[Blkram]

I am going to limit my list to rifle and shotgun as we cannot use handguns here north of the border...

1. 17 HMR - safer as the frangible bullets don't result in ricochets like the 22 does, and I would choose over the 22 Mag for trapping and smaller varmints
2. 22LR - no firearms battery is complete without a 22LR!
3. 204 Ruger - less pelt damage with less recoil
4. 22-250 Rem - as stated above
5. 257 Roberts - just a well balanced cartridge with an edge on the 243 - personal preference here between this cartridge and the 25-06 Rem with an edge in velocity for the longer case (we'll have to wait and see how the 25 Creedmoor fares...)
6. 6.5 Creedmoor - while I am big fan of the 6.5 Swede, there is just no denying that the CM has a larger following and the advantage for the higher BC bullets - honestly one wouldn't be wrong with the older cartridge if that was your choice and you're not ringing steel way out there - and I am enjoying the CM and how it is working on game with the Federal Terminal Ascent ammo!
7. 270 Win - tried and true - performance-wise, not a lot of difference between this and the 6.5 PRC, with the PRC having the edge with higher BC and SD numbers in its 130 gr bullet vs 136 gr .277 bullet
8. 7mm-08 Rem/7x57 aka 275 Rigby - choose your poison - as close as the 6.5 Swede vs CM - great performing cartridges
9. 280 Rem - just a little better than the 270 Win in modern rifles loaded to 65K, and has the ability to shoot the heavier bullets (160/162/165 gr) - again my personal opinion
10. 7mm Rem Mag - tried and true, and should be the first magnum one uses when needing more than a 270/280/30-06 - one could just as easily choose the 7MM PRC here today
11. 30-30 WCF - cause everyone should have a Model 94 or a Marlin!
12. 30-06 Sprgfld - Not a bad suggestion that one should be issued to every responsible man when they achieve the age of adulthood
13. 300 Win Mag - tried and true - another personal choice between the WM, H&H or WSM - but if they were to limit to just one, the WM would pass on popularity alone - I prefer the WSM
14. 338 Win Mag - tried and true - for North America, one could handle even the biggest bears with this one - as much as I like the 338-06 and 338 Federal, the Win Mag will pass due to history and overall effectiveness on the largest game we have in NA
15. 358 Win - very effective on big game - handy brush rifle in the BLR, Model 99 or 88 for moose, elk and grizzly bears
16. 9.3x62 - another tried an true that is gaining in popularity here in North America, but has a proven track record on the Dark Continent
17. 375 H&H - tried and true
18. 416 Rem - if one needs more than the 375 H&H for Africa's DG (and has the PH with his "stopping" rifle for back up) - although I like the 416 Taylor for its ability to fit in a regular long action with a magnum bolt face, as it equals the Remington/Rigby in performance
19. 20 Ga - for upland birds (although I have a soft spot for the 28 ga here, the 20 will win on popularity - although the 28 ga is making a great surge in popularity)
20. 12 Ga - for personal defense and waterfowl

If I could use handguns in the field here:
Revolver:

1. 357 Rem Mag - just because you can use the 38 Spcl in it too
2. 41 Rem Mag - while the 44 Mag is more popular, with the same weight bullets (240 gr) the 41 has better SD for penetration and less felt recoil - but this is just my personal opinion

Pistol:

1. 40 S&W - while the 9mm is more popular, I like the extra power of the 40 and honestly found the recoil more manageable as it is not as "flippy" as the 9 with the lighter bullets
2. 10MM - big, bad medicine for personal protection - if it can cleanly take Black Death at 15 yards with Buffalo Bore's 220 gr Hard Cast bullets, it will handle any nasty critters we have here, whether it be 4 legged or 2

 

[SJB358]

In the same vein of Blkram's thought-provoking posts, I submit the following to the collective for discussion.

If you could, which would be the 20 cartridges that could stay, and the rest were ended in the name of standardizing production and materials for availability? Although this is only a hypothetical, current conditions apply. What I mean by that, for example, is there is no time machine to go back and make the US Armed forces adopt the 6mm Remington to make it more popular and available.

Such a concept would never fly, but if you potentially could, which would make the cut and what is your justification for it?

Ideally for me these would be the 20:

1) .22 Long Rifle: This earliest of self-contained cartridges is still far and away one of if not THE most popular cartridge to ever exist. Of course it is number one.
2) .223 Remington: Accurate and deadly with little recoil, it is a staple in the NATO community and with hunters alike. And you can find guns/ammo everywhere!
3) .22-250 Remington: For when you need more reach than a .223 but not appreciably more recoil, enter the .22-250. Sorry .220 Swift, you just aren't as popular.
4) .243 Winchester: A top ten seller since inception, this combo varmint/deer round is a perfect gun for cheechako and veteran shooters alike. Everyone should have one!
5) .25-06 Remington: Recoils like a .243, hits like a .270 Winchester. Perfect antelope and mule deer cartridge. The .270 could just as easily go here instead.
6) 7mm Rem Mag: If one must have a magnum for hunting, this one is it for me. It checks a lot of boxes; ballistics of the newer 7mm's with easier to find components.
7) .30-30 WCF: Lever gun guys all have a deep love for this wonderful 1895 vintage hunting cartridge. Long live the thutty-thutty.
8) .30-06 Springfield: The ultimate all-around hunting cartridge and World War champ it ought to be standard issue for every citizen when they get their driver's license.
9) .300 WSM: Basically any .30 magnum spitting a 180-grain bullet to 2900+ fps could go here but this one seems to kick the least.
10) .338 Win Mag: Keeping muzzle brake companies in business since 1958, it kills on one end and cripples on the other. Accept no substitutes.
11) .38 Special: The choice of backup, C.C. and purse guns since the 1890's, its a great cartridge even today. AND you can shoot them in a .357 Magnum!
12) 9mm Luger: Ditto the .38 Special attributes but with a higher magazine capacity. +P loads make it better yet.
13) .357 Magnum: Forget +P in your .38, if you need more juice get the original engine block busting, crime spree stopping, polar bear killing, .357 Magnum!!
14) .375 H&H Magnum: Going to Africa? Don't forget to take one of these along. Make sure to load it accordingly, there isn't anything it can't handle on this planet!
15) .44 Rem Mag: If you can't get it done with a .357, you likely won't be able to shoot a .44 worth a darn but the .44 is a darn good handgun/carbine cartridge. Yeet!
16) .45 ACP: Like the .30-06, the .45 ACP has kept the 20th century fascism free worldwide. If you don't want a 9mm, this is your baby.
17) .45-70 Govt: Sorry .444, but the .45-70 does mostly what you can do and is easier to get components for. Be careful how you load it, it can have some mean recoil!
18) 20 gauge shotgun: While not the success that is the 12 gauge, it is a good option for uplands, trap shooters or anyone wanting a bit less punch than the 12 gives.
19) 12 gauge shotgun : An obvious best seller, the 12 gauge can be used for a lot of different stuff with small shot and large, steel, and of course slugs!
20) This one is a three-way tie for me, 6.5x55 Swedish, .270 Winchester and 7mm-08/7x57mm Mauser. All have merits but I just couldn't decide so its a tie!!

Lets have yours!!!!

I could easily attach myself to your list. Any change is purely between my ears. The 223, 270, 7 Mag and 338 cover a lot of ground for me.

 

[Nortah]

Some of these I am still dreaming about and one I’ll be dreaming about for a very long time.

1- 22LR lots of reasons
2- 410 pine chickens
3- 12GA too many to list
4- 10GA my mag 10 will never be far away from me.
5- 22-250 Moon Poodles and Antelope
6- 6mm rem with 1/9 twist (I’m still dreaming)
7- 30-30 because everyone should
8- 30-06 for everything
9- 38-55 my grandpa had Akley re-barrel back in the day and I’m gonna shoot a bear with it.
10- 7mm rem Deer, Elk, Bears
11- 30-338 win it’s my good luck gun
12- 338-06 (I’m still dreaming)
13- .300 WM Deer, Elk, Bears
14- 338 WM (I’m still dreaming)
15- 375H&H in a double rifle (I’ll be dreaming for a long time)
16- 218 BEE (Contender pistol) Moon Poodles and Foxes (still dreaming)
17- 7mm TCU (Contender pistol) Hogs (still dreaming)
18- 44 magnum in a wheel gun (still dreaming)
19- 9mm for city critters
20- .223 REM (gas gun) plinking

 

[Blkram]

Great list, I love the 338 wm as well as 340b class cartidges. Really don’t understand how they never became popular. Actually I do, every 338 I’ve owned kicked more than my 375 HH. Regardless, I think 338 is nearly as perfect a round as the 375 HH.

I think the 338 Win Mag is to North America, what the 375 H&H is to Africa.
Hard to beat that type of performance comparison!

 

[Griffbl]

.22LR. A suppressed .22 is so much fun. Don't waste your money on sub sonic for a pistol. 1300 FPS on the box = subsonic out of a handgun.
.223 military caliber, availability everywhere, as close to a "varminter" as I need.
.270 Win. Jack would roll over if I omitted this one.
7x57mm / .275 Rigby Jack's wife would roll over if I omitted this one. If there is a such a thing as balance in a cartridge, this one is it. Middleweight with heavy weight punch.
.280 Rem. Classic. different. Betwixt and between.
.280 AI
.284 Winchester. The original short magnum. '06 case capacity essentially. a .308-284 just might become my short action '06. Gonna play with this.
.308 Winchester. Keeps getting better.
.30-06 I have never been under gunned with an '06. As has been said, never a bad choice. If I had only one rifle, this would be it.
.30-06 AI. For fun.
.300 H&H. Shades the '06, and not by a lot, but it is just SOOOO elegant. Sure looks perfect going into my single shots. Feeds like almost no other in a bolt gun. Can a cartridge be elegant? If so, this one is it.
.338-06
9.3x62 the best and biggest on the '06 case (so to speak). Reputation is simply superb in Africa.
.375 H &H. Just wow. 270 grain trajectory is very close to a .30-06's 180 grain loads. Controllable in a properly weighted rifle. (I did find it to be no fun in a Ruger No. 1 though!)
9mm is ubiquitous. I see no need for a .38 with today's 9's
.45 Colt. Can be loaded well over a .44 Magnum, with less muzzle blast, and less pressure. a .452 hole is a bit larger than a .429 hole. More difference than you might think.
.45 ACP / .45 Super, and occasionally the .45 Rowland. Hits hard. Manageable. Until they make a .46, This is my go to in a lot of hangups unless I need a very small package. I can't stand the blast and noise of a .357. A .45 ACP might bounce of car tires, but it doesn't bounce off of more serious targets.

Well, that is less than 20. But that will do it for me. Obvious themes of US military cartridges, and the good old '06 case is very hard to beat. components easy for most all of the above, save maybe the .284 Win. Enjoy and be safe.

 

[JD338]

Great list, I love the 338 wm as well as 340b class cartidges. Really don’t understand how they never became popular. Actually I do, every 338 I’ve owned kicked more than my 375 HH. Regardless, I think 338 is nearly as perfect a round as the 375 HH.

I would agree that recoil is what keept the popularity down. Some of the gun writers didn't help when writing about their fierce recoil.

JD338

 

[Blkram]

I would agree that recoil is what keept the popularity down. Some of the gun writers didn't help when writing about their fierce recoil.

JD338

After I replaced the stock Remington recoil pad on my LH BDL 338 Win Mag with a LimbSaver, felt recoil was way more tolerable.
I went from being bruised and sore after 20 rounds off the bench (Federal Premium 210 gr Partition ammo) to no bruising and not sore after a session of 60 rounds off the bench (with the same ammo). (That rifle also liked the Federal blue box 225 gr ammo.)
The rifle became much more enjoyable to shoot!
When I got my LH Sako AV years later, the first thing I did was replace the stock pad with a LimbSaver.

 

[JD338]

After I replaced the stock Remington recoil pad on my LH BDL 338 Win Mag with a LimbSaver, felt recoil was way more tolerable.
I went from being bruised and sore after 20 rounds off the bench (Federal Premium 210 gr Partition ammo) to no bruising and not sore after a session of 60 rounds off the bench (with the same ammo). (That rifle also liked the Federal blue box 225 gr ammo.)
The rifle became much more enjoyable to shoot!
When I got my LH Sako AV years later, the first thing I did was replace the stock pad with a LimbSaver.

Same here Gil. A Pachmayr Decelerator recoil pad turned my 338 RUM into a pussycat.

JD338

 

[6mm Remington]

Rimfire:
.22 LR
.22 Mag

Shotgun:
20 gauge
12 gauge

Revolver:
357 magnum
.41 magnum
.44 magnum

Pistol:
380ACP
9mm
40 S&W
10 mm
45

Rifle:
22-250
6mm Remington
25-06
280 Remington
280 AI
30-06
300 WSM ( I had to add this one. Not sure how I forgot it. What a sweet cartridge.)
338-06
6mm Remington

 

[filmjunkie4ever]

Rimfire:
.22 LR
.22 Mag

Shotgun:
20 gauge
12 gauge

Revolver:
357 magnum
.41 magnum
.44 magnum

Pistol:
380ACP
9mm
40 S&W
10 mm
45

Rifle:
22-250
6mm Remington
25-06
280 Remington
280 AI
30-06
338-06
6mm Remington

I just took a Ruger No.1 B in 6mm Remington in trade. So far it loves the Speer 105 grain SPs on top of IMR 4350!! Great rifle and cartridge!

 

[6mm Remington]

I just took a Ruger No.1 B in 6mm Remington in trade. So far it loves the Speer 105 grain SPs on top of IMR 4350!! Great rifle and cartridge!

Glad you are loving it the way it should be by shooting and hunting with it. They sure are sweet rifles. Oh the caliber is perfect as well!!

 

[wildcatter]

I would base my all rounds on one rf case, 2 centerfire cases, and 3 handgun cases.

I have to start with the 22lr, most basic and practicle hunting cartridge to ever start out with hunting or even just shooting.

Next would be the 223 case, it does so much in 22 cal or 6mm. Hard to beat in the 22 cal. For practical uses in this caliber, 6x45 is bonus choice, excellent deer and smaller game cartridge for smaller youg and other shooters that dont like recoil, but love pin point accuracy.

Sorry, but I have little use for the 6mm caliber for anything but punching paper. But if i had one, it would be based on the 7mm Mauser case, make mine a 6mm Remington. In my opinion more practical than magnums, and bit more than the 243.

Mid bore, 257 Roberts! Again, my choice is based on the 7mm Mauser case, in my opinion, the most efficient case for any 25 caliber, make mine a Bob AI, so close to the magnums to call it a standard mag, and 25 has proven to be superior to the 6mm for taking any deer sized game, sheep antilope, and some although a tad light in my opinion, like it for game up to elk. But very accurate and easy to tune, plus mild recoil, easier on barrels, and perfect with the right bullets for anything from LR Varmint up to the deer and sheep at extended range as spoke above.

I would then step it up to the larger capacity 30/06 case. For anything non dangerous for moose and smaller bug game. In 30 cal, I dont know how you get more efficient than 165 to 180 grain bullets from a 30/06.

For those big toothy, and fast man eating species, to big tough skind Bovine, even Rhinos I stick with that 30/06 case necked up a tad to 338 cal. The 338/06 or the AI version, are quite efficient fo these big dangerous game animals with the right bullets for what ever you choose to tackle from heavy cover to plains game. If I were to choose anything else for this class of animals, I might choose the 35 cal in this same case. But in my opinion the most efficient for the same 3 reasons, great accuracy, capable of extended ranges for many of this type game, with very resonable recoil and very easy to tune loads for, from 180 grains to 300 grains.

Lastly would be my choice for optimum hanguns.

Small game that 22LR still dominates, no explanation needed.

For self defence, my choice is the 45 acp. You can argue 38 special or 9mm, but I'll take the 45acp over those for the fact that it much more reliable to make one shot count, and put me in control of any situation my life is dependent on. You cant hope to have enough time to make more than one shot count, when you have someone shooting to kill you is why I rely on one cartridge for SD, big holes, and more caught energy rule for me, plus any marginal hit, has more ability, to allow for second shot by doing more damage than any 35 caliber can provide. Hole diameter rules.

Finally, big game handgunning, I found decades ago when you have a revolver frame capable of handling the 45 Colt cartridge, the 44 was not all it was praised to be. Again, decades before it, we already had a better cartridge, just no gun capable of taking all it could provide. That is why as soon as Ruger released a 45 Colt option in their most perfect Blackhawk frame, the 44 SB I had was short lived. Fact is, the 45 Colt, even with 340 grain bullets @ over 1270 fps, it has less recoil than the best 44 magnum large bullet load produces, and more energy. That and the fact that bigger holes, with full penetration are how revolvers kill, and stop big game. Yes if I were hunting in Africa I'd take the 480, 475, over the 45 Colt. But from 225 to 340 grain, the 6 shot lightwieght Blackhawk with a shorter 5.5" barrel would be my choice, even as a self defence sidearm against Grizzlies. Make no mistake, this particular frame even over a model 83 Freedom Arms would be my choice, hunting or self defence for big game. Anything else either is to clumsy and heavy, or only carries 5 rounds, and for Self Defence against the most dangerous game, I'll take an extra shot in 340 grain 45Colt of 5 shots in 454 Casual, and have owned several in the past to make that decision. But single shot accuracy and light easily carried, quick and capable with the most reliable action to assure fireing flawlessly 6 rounds on target, with no chance of a fail to feed or fire, make this my best choice of all, for hunting big game and SD against man eaters, I have used. There are bigger, but good luck making every shot as accuratly placed, and as quickly, as possible as the Blackhawk can with this cartridge over those others.

For me my choices are all based on as efficient, as i feel possible in each case. Ya you might get another 100 or 200 fps from some cartridges using the same bullets, but that is mostly with the heaviest in each calliber, but even that requiers 25 to 30 percent more powder, for less than 10 percent more speed, and even less more energy. Plus way more recoil, reducing the ability to make accurate shots at longer range, or quick followup shots without building guns heavier than needed to do the same thing in these calibers. But hey, I'm old, and one time you could have never convinced me, today,,, well, been there done that,, what more can I say.