I took my new build out today and it didn't group for shat. Its a savage 116 timed and trued action, machined recoil lug, shilen heavy sporter in 7mag 1:9, Stockade fiberglass stock bedded and assembled by Stockade. I loaded up 40 shells all using 150 NBT all touching the lands 20 of them were loaded with 61 grains of 4831 and the other 20 were loaded with 61 grains of 4350. I claened every other for the first 15-20 then every three after that. Average group size was about 2inches with the ocasional flyer making it worse. I did notice that the 4350 was abit better but not much. I don't have any pics I had to leave when the range was still hot. There was no pattern to the group just all over. Any suggestions on where to go from here would help Ialso have some RL-19 and 22 if you think it may help.
7mm help
- Thread starter ofdscooby
- Start date
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Guest
Guest
I'm going to suggest you shift to H1000, IMR7828, or RL19/22, and that you back the bullet off the lands. Start with the powders deemed most accurate in the Nosler manual, and use their COL. From there, find a consistent velocity/SD/ES and then tweak seating depth to achieve the group. It should work that way.
Of course, should work doesn't always work. Check the basics - stock screws, ring and base screws, crown, barrel channel, and maybe get a different (known good) scope and try that.
Good luck with it.
Of course, should work doesn't always work. Check the basics - stock screws, ring and base screws, crown, barrel channel, and maybe get a different (known good) scope and try that.
Good luck with it.
ofdscooby,
I have built three Savage rifles with Stockade stocks, and it sounds like you have a bedding issue. I am not sure if you mean Stockade built the gun for you or if you bought a Stockade built stock and installed it yourself. Either way, Savage rifles are very finicky about the bedding under the tang. Once you have your barreled action screwed down to your specs, you need to be able to slide a piece of paper under the tang. All other actions that I know of do well with solid contact under the tang, but Savage ain't one of them. All three Stockade stocks i bought required work in this area. Don't get me wrong, they are great stocks and shoot very consistently even without glass bedding. But I had to use a dremel and remove material under the tang. One rifle I built, a .338 Fed. with mag contour barrel, went from shooting 2.5" groups to 0.25" groups at 100 yards after the tang was fully floated. If it is indeed floating already, then you do have an ammo/load issue.
Hope this helps.
I have built three Savage rifles with Stockade stocks, and it sounds like you have a bedding issue. I am not sure if you mean Stockade built the gun for you or if you bought a Stockade built stock and installed it yourself. Either way, Savage rifles are very finicky about the bedding under the tang. Once you have your barreled action screwed down to your specs, you need to be able to slide a piece of paper under the tang. All other actions that I know of do well with solid contact under the tang, but Savage ain't one of them. All three Stockade stocks i bought required work in this area. Don't get me wrong, they are great stocks and shoot very consistently even without glass bedding. But I had to use a dremel and remove material under the tang. One rifle I built, a .338 Fed. with mag contour barrel, went from shooting 2.5" groups to 0.25" groups at 100 yards after the tang was fully floated. If it is indeed floating already, then you do have an ammo/load issue.
Hope this helps.
- Nov 4, 2004
- 24,539
- 7,016
Try RL 22 and work up to the MAX load. I would also suggest you seat the bullets .020" off the lands. Once you find a good chagre weight, adjust the seating depth in .005" increments to fine tune the load.
JD338
JD338
- Thread starter
- #5
Antelope_Sniper
Handloader
- Jan 25, 2008
- 2,618
- 0
One load with a give powder does not always tell the tale.
I've had good luck with H4831 and the 7mm, but worked up in 1/2 grain increments.
But as someone else already mentioned, check the freefloat first.
I've had good luck with H4831 and the 7mm, but worked up in 1/2 grain increments.
But as someone else already mentioned, check the freefloat first.
cloverleaf
Handloader
- Sep 10, 2006
- 4,344
- 949
Floating the tang...? Never even heard of that. Does that mean space under the tang some how, or around its edges? CL
ofdscooby
I wouldn't change powders as yet my 7mm Mag shoots the best with the 162 gr Hornady BT SP, tiny little groups with 4350, 4831 is also very good for the 7mm. If you change powders you have changed to many variables at once. Like already has been suggested back the bullet off of the lands a bit and check to insure that the barrel is not touching anywhere. Wait at least 10 mins between shots. Also if you consider the barrel to be broken in, extend your cleaning frequency, my sevens do not like cleaning.
I wouldn't change powders as yet my 7mm Mag shoots the best with the 162 gr Hornady BT SP, tiny little groups with 4350, 4831 is also very good for the 7mm. If you change powders you have changed to many variables at once. Like already has been suggested back the bullet off of the lands a bit and check to insure that the barrel is not touching anywhere. Wait at least 10 mins between shots. Also if you consider the barrel to be broken in, extend your cleaning frequency, my sevens do not like cleaning.
TXbaldhunter
Handloader
- May 12, 2007
- 395
- 310
You may have some bedding issues if it's shooting all over the place.Is the barrel floated?Are the screws holding the stock on tight?Bad crown?I don't like to load my bullets into the lands.There can be to many variables to deal with and must be done with great precision.So first off,I'd back off the lands.Next,chronograph that load your shooting.I think you will find you are trying to turn your 7mag into a 7mm Mauser!!! If you don't have one,borrow one or buy one,they really are a helpful tool when working up your loads and lets you know where you're at. A 7mag can get better than 3100fps with 150 gr. bullets and seem to tighten up when you start getting closer to a max load.My loads that shoot great in my two 7mags are 65.0grs of IMR-4350 and 69.0grs of Reloader-22.Both are just below max in my rifles and as always,never start with these loads,always work up to them and watch for pressure signs.7mag is a great one.Good Luck,I hope you get her shooting tight.
rick smith
Handloader
- Apr 6, 2005
- 1,249
- 0
Best groups I have shot in several 7mmRemMags; Fed215M, Nosler 150gr Ballistic tip, 68.0grs IMR-7828 with the bullet 10-15 off the lands.Rick.
- Thread starter
- #11
G
Guest
Guest
I was looking at your original post again, and you're about 4gr over Hodgdon's current max on H4350. If you're working with IMR4350, you're right at max (actually, .2gr over) but it should be alright if you're not seeing pressure signs. I'm assuming this is a 7mmRemMag.
I'd still suggest moving to RL19/22 or IMR7828 or H1000. It's up to you, but I think you may be barking up the wrong tree here. I had good results with H4350 under 175gr Hornady Spire Points, but velocity was lower than with other powders, and at max charge, I got pressure signs (ejector marks). So I think the 4350's may be a tad fast for this cartridge, but that's my opinion.
I don't know what your normal load development goes like, but I'd start with the start charge and then at least one mid-charge and then max, and load three of each to test pressure, at least .020" off the lands. Once you find a pressure-safe load, then start fooling with seating depth to tweak it. If the max charge is giving you minute of barn door accuracy at .020" off the lands, and the mid-charge is giving you 2" or less, go with the lower charge and work seating depth. Velocity is great for bragging, but accuracy is what kills things. Once you find the right charge weight that's safe, you can play with seating depth to find the most accurate COL. That's my process and it's been a good one for almost 20yrs.
I'd still suggest moving to RL19/22 or IMR7828 or H1000. It's up to you, but I think you may be barking up the wrong tree here. I had good results with H4350 under 175gr Hornady Spire Points, but velocity was lower than with other powders, and at max charge, I got pressure signs (ejector marks). So I think the 4350's may be a tad fast for this cartridge, but that's my opinion.
I don't know what your normal load development goes like, but I'd start with the start charge and then at least one mid-charge and then max, and load three of each to test pressure, at least .020" off the lands. Once you find a pressure-safe load, then start fooling with seating depth to tweak it. If the max charge is giving you minute of barn door accuracy at .020" off the lands, and the mid-charge is giving you 2" or less, go with the lower charge and work seating depth. Velocity is great for bragging, but accuracy is what kills things. Once you find the right charge weight that's safe, you can play with seating depth to find the most accurate COL. That's my process and it's been a good one for almost 20yrs.
Antelope_Sniper
Handloader
- Jan 25, 2008
- 2,618
- 0
ODF, Here is the typical progression.
Pick a powder and bullet, load to magazine length.
Start at the min recommended powder charge, and work up to Max in 1/2 grain increments, loading 3-4 rounds per charge weight.
If it shoots for crap, change powders, and repeat.
After 3 or 4 powders, change bullets and repeat.
Once you get something respectable, say 1.5 inches or less, then you can start messing with OAL.
Work throught the variables one by one, until you find the combination your gun likes.
Pick a powder and bullet, load to magazine length.
Start at the min recommended powder charge, and work up to Max in 1/2 grain increments, loading 3-4 rounds per charge weight.
If it shoots for crap, change powders, and repeat.
After 3 or 4 powders, change bullets and repeat.
Once you get something respectable, say 1.5 inches or less, then you can start messing with OAL.
Work throught the variables one by one, until you find the combination your gun likes.
61 grains of imr 4831 with a 150 grainer doesn't sound like enough. I would add more powder to the cases in .5 grain increments just to see if it gets more accurate as the charges go up. I would then pick the most accurate charges and adjust the seating depth in.
drew
drew
Oldtrader3
Ammo Smith
- Nov 6, 2009
- 8,406
- 5
-Loading for a 7mm Mag.............(WSM, Rem Mag, SAUM, Sharpe & Hart, STW, Weatherby, RUM, Lazzaroni Firebird, Dakota)?
-Floating the tang (of what)?
Too many loose ends for me to go there on any load data!
-Floating the tang (of what)?
Too many loose ends for me to go there on any load data!
