Brass sizing, and chamber question

[Slimfinn]

Ok I'm trying to figure out what to do. I have 3 260s and my latest is a sako and other 2 are rugers. I was starting to work up a load for the sako using 1 fired sako brass, and when I went to the range i noticed my bolt was a bit tough to close, i figured i had the bullets set too long so set them down about 10tho went back and same, shot them thinking maybe i didn't size right. Now im back at the reloading bench ran a couple cases back thru the sizer and tried to chamber the empty brass, same tough bolt close. Got thinking that all of that batch was shot thru one of the rugers. Tried an empty i knew was thru the sako and sure enough no problem.
So here is the question/issue, I'm using a RCBS full length die set so why is this happening? And am i going to have to basically fire form the brass to the sako chamber, or get a different sizing die(if so which one) ?

 

[NYDAN]

Slim,

One possibility is that the different rifles have different headspace dimensions. You can compare the headspace dimensions by measuring fired brass from each chamber using one of the following tools:

- https://www.hornady.com/reloading/preci ... ase-kit#!/
- https://rcbs.com/Products/Case-Preparat ... n-Mic.aspx

Once you have the comparator measurements for each chamber you can set your resizing die to size the brass to fit the shortest headspace dimension. Then all the ammo would fit each rifle. Or, you can size the cases specifically for each rifle. If you go that route, you may want one of these:

- http://www.pmatool.com/pma-micro-die-ad ... w-upgrade/

Good luck with it.

Dan

 

[Dr. Vette]

I will usually try to keep brass as "belonging to" a certain rifle just to avoid the issue you're having now. It can be worse with belted magnums. If you thought you were going to be able to swap brass between rifles and have zero issues, you can already see that won't work.

Trying to keep the brass straight on several rifles of the same chambering can be a challenge, but it works.

 

[hunter24605]

That's not uncommon. i load for mine and my nephews 270's and brass that fits in my mine will not allow the bolt to close in his Rem. Best thing I've found is to keep the brass separate. Now that I know the measurements, its easy to tell which rifle they came from by measuring the base to datum with a comparator and a headspace/gauge bushing and bump the shoulder as needed. I just start with the FL die set high off the shell plate and keep adjusting the die downward in small increments after sizing the brass and repeating until the shoulder is back .002

 

[jimbires]

Slim I got a couple questions to ask you , before I try to give you advice .
are you setting the full length sizing die up per the instructions packed with the dies ? reading your question over a couple of times I'm guessing you are .
what lube are you using on your brass cases for sizing ?


now I have a couple tips for 3 rifles the same . keep the brass separate , it'll save headaches . I have 3 different 7mm-08's . my remington 7-08 I use Norma brass . my browning 7-08 uses rem brass . my tikka I use anything I had , fed , win , rem , it didn't matter the gun shot well with anything so that's what I used anything my ammo box is a mix and match for this rifle . but that was easy to get mixed up with the other rifles , so when this batch of anything is worn out I bought Nosler for it . if you're sizing the brass specifically for each rifle by only bumping the shoulder back a couple thousandths the easiest way I've found to do this with one die set , is the redding competition shellholder set . you'll need one of the Tools Dan mentioned above, the Hornady tool works just fine and it's universal . you can read up on the redding shellholders . redding did have a short video showing how to use these , I don't see it now .

https://www.redding-reloading.com/onlin ... older-sets

here is my shellholder set with what I need marked in the lid .

 

[ShadeTree]

As others have stated it's not that uncommon. Many rifles of the same cartridge will interchange with resized brass, some most definitely will not. Wouldn't shock me a bit if you took a measurement with calipers just ahead of and right next to the web line, and find that the resized brass shot out of the Sako measures smaller than the resized brass shot out of the Rugers.

Unless something is off, and you don't have the die set to properly bump things back, it's not the shoulders that are keeping it from chambering. It's the stretch ring just ahead of the web on the case body that doesn't get squeezed down hard enough by the die when going from 1 rifle into a more minimal sized chamber.

I have two 30-06's that are completely interchangeable with resized brass. A third 06 wont chamber resized brass fired from either 1 of them with a new RCBS die ran all the way down. Plenty of clearance on the shoulder, it's that small stretch ring or bump up, just ahead of the web that makes things tight in that chamber. New brass or even resized brass from a different 06, chambers just fine.

 

[Elkman]

Full length resize them back to factory spec's, and you will eliminate your problem.

 

[Slimfinn]

Slim I got a couple questions to ask you , before I try to give you advice .
are you setting the full length sizing die up per the instructions packed with the dies ? reading your question over a couple of times I'm guessing you are .
what lube are you using on your brass cases for sizing ? ]

Yes i am going it all per instructions, im running the die down to just touch the shell holder, i will double check when i sit back down at the bench, maybe its not camming over enough? Im using hornady unique case lube, i let it melt on my fingers and just roll the cases between them. I did pick up the hornady head space gauge lastnight so going to check with that this weekend. I can split the brass also i have Sako and Remington.
Will let you know what i find out, thanks guys

 

[Slimfinn]

Well couldn't wait for the weekend so when down and checked some out, the head space for the resized Ruger shot cases were 3 to 3.5thou longer than the sako unsized case. I set the die another 1/8 turn lower, lubed and ran one of the rugers up, no change. Looked closer and realized i thought i was running the ram all the way but actually wasn't, because my handle/ linkage has some flex(state of the art Lee anniversary press from 25 years ago) a couple strokes and I get it there. This may be a good enough reason for an upgraded press, and also a lesson in paying attention to what is going on.

 

[jimbires]

Well couldn't wait for the weekend so when down and checked some out, the head space for the resized Ruger shot cases were 3 to 3.5thou longer than the sako unsized case. I set the die another 1/8 turn lower, lubed and ran one of the rugers up, no change. Looked closer and realized i thought i was running the ram all the way but actually wasn't, because my handle/ linkage has some flex(state of the art Lee anniversary press from 25 years ago) a couple strokes and I get it there. This may be a good enough reason for an upgraded press, and also a lesson in paying attention to what is going on.

very good , you figured it out .

I was going to tell you to run a piece of fired brass up into the die when at the top of the stroke be sure your still touching the die to the shellholder . if you're not you must turn the die down a little more until this happens . and you are correct , it is play and flex in the press , all presses have some . the brass is fighting the resizing process .
your choice of lube should be excellent . a poor lube can cause enough friction during sizing it makes this problem worse .

 

[NYDAN]

Well couldn't wait for the weekend so when down and checked some out, the head space for the resized Ruger shot cases were 3 to 3.5thou longer than the sako unsized case. I set the die another 1/8 turn lower, lubed and ran one of the rugers up, no change. Looked closer and realized i thought i was running the ram all the way but actually wasn't, because my handle/ linkage has some flex(state of the art Lee anniversary press from 25 years ago) a couple strokes and I get it there. This may be a good enough reason for an upgraded press, and also a lesson in paying attention to what is going on.

Congratulations on figuring it out.

Dan

 

[PJGunner]

Full length resize them back to factory spec's, and you will eliminate your problem.

That does not always work. I have three rifles chambered to the 7x57 Mauser cartridge. Brass fired from the M70 FWT and Ruger #1A are for all practical purposes the same. (Got lucky there. ).
Brass that was fired in a custom FN 98 Mauser would have close to a headspace situation if used in the two previous rifles.

I also have three rifles chambered to the .35 Whele. Iwent the route of getting a separate set of sizing dies for each rifle. Head spacing is different for all three rifles. Brass from the Mauser will fit in th Remington 700 Classic but not the other way around. The Ruger M77 is borderline on head spacing and is so far out that even the somewhat underloaded factory ammo produced a couple of case separations. Not fun. The fix was prep up 100 rounds of brass, load with a start load for a 280 gr. cast bullet and have it lightly jammed into the rifling. Shoot to fire form. Set up the resizing die for minimum headspace.

This is how I set up my sizing die for bottleneck cartridges.

1. Take a once fired factory case from your rifle and blacken the neck and shoulders with a Magic Marker or Sharpee pen. Some people like to smoke the neck and shoulder, but I find the Magic Marker/Sharpee pen a bit better.

2. Carefully lubricate the case.

3. Loosen the lock ring on the sizing die and back off about two turns from when the die is set to touch the shell holder.

4. Size the case. Note where the marks are on the case and turn the die down about a half a turn and size again. Turn down some more, and resize again. What you are looking for is the marks on the blackening just touching the shoulder.

5. Clean the lube from the case and try it in the rifle. It may chamber just a bit on the snug side. If so, turn the die down ever so slightly, lube and size again. Wipe off the lube and try in the rifle. If it slides in as easily as a factory round, you should be good to go. If not, usually one more very slight adjustment should fix the problem.

6. Tighten the locking ring for the die and you're done. You have just set your sizing die up for a custom fit to your specific rifle, rather than a generic one size fits all guns.

Paul B.