Cold bore shot question.

[trays7940]

Here's the question:
After let's say a military or SWAT sniper cleans his weapon after range time, how can he be sure of shot placement on the cold bore shot?
Do duty slotted snipers fire a fouling shot after cleaning or are they guessing at where the first shot is going to land?

Having only hunted at realitively short distances, I have never really thought about fouling shots pretty much knowing that up to 200 yards the bullet will be in the vital with the old 30-06. Now that I am more aware, I ponder which to do; sight the rifle in based on the first shot out of a clean bore instead of the group, or sight in for a dirty bore shot. :?

 

[Powerstroke]

I can't speak for the officers, but from a hunting stand point......
My rifles stay pretty clean through the year and every trip to the range I just accept depending on the rifle there is going to be 1 to 3 fouler shots.

Before hunting season I'll make it out to to the range and put a few down the pipe... 5 to 10 generally just to make sure the confidence level is where it needs to be.
I won't clean it when I get home, but rather wait until after season is complete.

As you did mention however... I have yet to hear of the " excuse " I missed because of a clean barrel..... :lol:
reasonable distances of course....

 

[bullet]

In the service I would clean the bore after range practice then I would fire at least three rounds and left the bore fouled. I do the same now with my range work after I develop a load and after all the range work is done I clean it then fire three fouling rounds. (I have discovered over the years that a clean barrel and shots that follow are not always the best groups but can improve after the barrel is fouled). I then take a patch lightly oil run it down my barrel if I am putting it up until hunting season. Just before hunting season starts put a gun cleaning solvent (not copper solvent) on a patch run in down the barrel to remove the oil, then a dry patch. This is not a copper solvent so that it leaves my barrel burnished then I go and shoot a group of three to make sure my scope is still on then I leave it fouled and burnished for the entire season. That way I know when I fire a cold bore shot that it will hit right where I have practice. This is my practice and it works rather well and I am sure there are many ways guys do it but this works for me.

 

[trays7940]

OK... so, 2 votes for zeroing on the fouled barrel...Interesting. Anyone else have a comment? :?

 

[nodak7mm]

Same here, range running & PD's, rifles get cleaned each time out, lugs lubed and overall wiped down. Hunting season, prior to my hunts, I always insure I have a fouled bore just like Bullet and Powerstroke.. And like P/S said, the confidence is there...

Rod

 

[BillPa]

OK... so, 2 votes for zeroing on the fouled barrel...Interesting. Anyone else have a comment? :?

Exactly what I do. Once its sighted in, it stays dirty till the end of the season .
This is a 270Win, 22" SS Shilen , the first ever 5 shots out of it. My version of the "break in"

The shot marked "CB" is the clean barrel shot. The one left of the "4" was the second, the mess below it, the last three.

About two week later with a scope adjustment.

Again, the high one was the CD shot then three. The only change was to my old horded lot of 27/130 Solid Base instead of the 130 BTs.

That was a total of nine shots out of that barrel. My son used it to take two whitetails that season.

Bill

 

[Guy Miner]

Yup. You've got to figure that for a SWAT sniper the most important shot he's got is his cold bore shot. Group size doesn't matter squat compared to if he can put that first round exactly where it's supposed to go.

Officers will work enough with their rifles, hopefully, to know if their rifle shoots a clean-cold bore shot to the same point of impact as it does with a fouled bore. Then they'll store their rifle accordingly. Some rifles actually will shoot the clean-cold bore shot right with the rest of the shots, others will only shoot to the same point of impact after being fouled.

I find that my Krieger barrel is very good about putting the shot from a clean, cold bore to the same point of impact as the follow on shots. That wasn't the case with my old Remington factory barrel, it placed that first shot better when fouled.

Where I live on the dry side of the Cascade Mountains, there is relatively low humidity most of the time and I can get away with storing my rifle barrels dry. I think that helps too. When I was back in Virginia, I learned that I had to store the barrels with a bit of oil in the bore.

At "tactical" competitions one of the most coveted awards is the winner of the Cold Bore shot, in recognition of its importance.

Regards, Guy

 

[Antelope_Sniper]

Many Sniper schools teach the keeping of a log book, with special attention to the cold bore shot. As the targets above demonstrate, some rifles are very consistant with cold shots.

My match barrel shoots close to the point of impact, after cleaning so long as the last patch was a degreaser, but will put them about an inch out (high and right) if the last patch was gun oil.

Personally I try to fire a fouling shot or two through my bore before I head to the field.

 

[trays7940]

Ok, so most hunters keep their barrels dirty during the season- or atleast fouled?

Anyone else have Krieger, Shillen or other custom barrels that the cold bore shot is close to the fouled shots?

This is interesting stuff.

 

[old #7]

My NCR 280AI is very close. It is about 1/2" away in most cases.
I believe the barrels are Pacnor but I can't remember.

 

[bullet]

Ok, so most hunters keep their barrels dirty during the season- or atleast fouled?

Anyone else have Krieger, Shillen or other custom barrels that the cold bore shot is close to the fouled shots?

This is interesting stuff.

My Douglas, Two Shilen, Krieger Criterion, and one Lilja barrels all like the fouling rounds.

 

[cloverleaf]

Same here, set my Zero. Clean good, put it away for a while if needed, shoot to verify zero (mine takes 4-6= but that is the subject of another post). fire those shots and verify zero and leave her til coyote season is over. CL

 

[OU812]

Just as Powerstroke does right before hunting season I'll hit the range and foul the barrel, 3-4 shots seems to get it done. With my guns fouled barrel accuracy is good for many rounds with out a shift in the POI, not so much with a clean barrel. From then on out the barrel does not get cleaned until season is over. Never missed a shot because of a dirty/fouled barrel.

 

[6ppcar]

Try this, after i clean my barrels i put a patch with Lock Ease (napa) down the bore. My barrels will put the first shot right where its suppose to be from a cold barrel. ( Hart and Shilen Sporter weight hunting Rifles)
Benchrest shooters have been using this method for many years.
Give it a try, it works.

 

[onlybrowning]

Try this, after i clean my barrels i put a patch with Lock Ease (napa) down the bore. My barrels will put the first shot right where its suppose to be from a cold barrel. ( Hart and Shilen Sporter weight hunting Rifles)
Benchrest shooters have been using this method for many years.
Give it a try, it works.

That is really cool. Is the Lock Ease a copper containing solution or something? Why does it work? Very interesting.

 

[6ppcar]

Try this, after i clean my barrels i put a patch with Lock Ease (napa) down the bore. My barrels will put the first shot right where its suppose to be from a cold barrel. ( Hart and Shilen Sporter weight hunting Rifles)
Benchrest shooters have been using this method for many years.
Give it a try, it works.

That is really cool. Is the Lock Ease a copper containing solution or something? Why does it work? Very interesting.

No copper, contains colloidal graphite. It coats the bore and helps to keep copper fouling at a minimum.

 

[Antelope_Sniper]

It makes sense.
Graphite is carbon, and burnt gunpowder is also essentially carbon.

 

[6ppcar]

It makes sense.
Graphite is carbon, and burnt gunpowder is also essentially carbon.

+1 ,you are correct.

 

[GSSP]

Here is a test I ran last fall, 2007.

30-06 Ackley
180 Nos AB
68.5 gr Rel 25
Win brass
Fed 210M primer
Rem 700, 26" ss Lilja barrel
2997 fps @ 6200' elev.

Each morning I would run up the canyon behind my house and shoot a 3-shot group from 100 yds. 1st shot cold but fouled barrel, 2nd and 3rd shots fouled warm barrel. The outer shots are the cold fouled barrel, the inner from the warm barrel. Needless to say, I have work to do on my rifle.

With a warm fouled barrel, this rifle will do this @ 818 yds. Date is incorrect. It was July 2007.

 

[trays7940]

This was very interesting. I guess that is why I like this forum so much. Thanks for the information. :grin: