CRF attraction?

[Guy Miner]

Out of curiosity, why are some of us here so incredibly hung up on a rifle having controlled round feed?

At an early age I shot only CRF rifles; Mauser, Springfield, Model of 1917 and Winchester Model 70. About 1974 I started shooting a push-feed Remington 700 a lot, and also messing around with a bunch of other rifles, some CRF, some push feed.

Then there were the lever actions, and my favorite, the single shot.

Despite using rifles in harsh environments, I never saw even a tiny smidgen of advantage for the CRF rifles, or the push feed rifles. Our push feed USMC Sniper Rifles were 100% reliable in the desert, the jungles of Central America, the mountains... My personal hunting rifles reflected the same 100% reliability wherever I took them, and whatever I asked of them.

Today, and for decades, I still have a mix of CRF and push-feed rifles, and really, still, cannot see an advantage one way or the other...

So what reasons do some of you have for such a strong preference one way or the other? Is it real, or just personal preference?

Thanks! Guy

 

[truck driver]

Guy, I'm with you on this one I also own both style and the other one that you don't here much of the CRPF Winchester came out with. I have worked a push feed action as fast as I could cycle it and stay on target and have yet had to have it jam or miss feed. Then on the other hand I have had my Ruger M77 CRF fail to pick up a round when I cycled it for a fast second shot.
The only advantage I could see is when you have a wild cat round that doesn't feed properly in a PF action and will in a CRF since it's locked under the extractor.

 

[DrMike]

Out of curiosity, why are some of us here so incredibly hung up on a rifle having controlled round feed?

Nostalgia. I have both styles and have shot both for years. I suppose CRF might confer an advantage if I shot a charging rhino while I was hanging upside down from a tree branch, though even then a push feed will not likely drop the round. Yeah, nostalgia and irrational prejudice will account for my preference. :grin: Oh, and my preference for the Winchester name.

 

[Vince]

For me is about traditions and nostalgia more than sound logic. There is something about the "Rifleman's Rifle" that appeals to the heart more than the mind.

 

[FOTIS]

Nope not at all!
I have never heard of a Sako or a weatherby fail to extract and eject a round. Even in Africa where the weather gets hot.

 

[Bruce Mc]

I was going to make a smart remark about hanging upside down but Mike beat me to it. I too have never had a problem with the push feed actions both Rem 700 and Win 70s. I kinda like the thought of overkill (abundance of precaution).

 

[BK]

Out of curiosity, why are some of us here so incredibly hung up on a rifle having controlled round feed?

Nostalgia. I have both styles and have shot both for years. I suppose CRF might confer an advantage if I shot a charging rhino while I was hanging upside down from a tree branch, though even then a push feed will not likely drop the round. Yeah, nostalgia and irrational prejudice will account for my preference. :grin: Oh, and my preference for the Winchester name.

That's scary, Doc. I was thinking the same thoughts, same words and everything. I must be paying too much attention to your posts... :shock:

 

[DrMike]

I agree, Kurt, that is scary. Course, you couldn't be following a finer example of the art of riflery (said Mike, modestly). :mrgreen:

 

[truck driver]

Scotty he's at it again :lol: Boy the good Dr can lay it on thick. :roll: :lol:

 

[6mm Remington]

Guy I don't know what happened to me. I have had several Remington's that were push feed and never had an issue with one and yet I too have succumbed to the CRF Winchester Model 70. Not only that but I refused to give in and purchase a 280 Remington or 280AI in one of the fine Montana Rifle Company products because they are cast actions, and yet I really like the Model 77 Ruger which is also cast and is known for being double stout and reliable and is a controlled round feed also. I decided I NEEDED an action machined from forged steel and I NEEDED a Model 70. It would have been cheaper for me to get the Montana Rifle Company product but NOOOOOO I have to be set in my ways.

Now I know how nice the Cooper rifles are and how reliable they are and how they have a reputation for shooting itty bitty groups, but as they are not CRF and Mauser all the way I snubbed them as well. Tell me any of this reasoning of mine makes sense.

I do have a very nice Model 70 Winchester being put together that will have the wonderful qualities of the Mauser action to include the CRF which I felt I just needed to have. I have no doubt I am going to be very happy with it and it will shoot very well for me. Will it shoot better than one of those awful PUSH FEED monstrosities, I probably could not tell the difference. I just figures I NEEDED one! :mrgreen: :lol:

 

[JD338]

I have only owned push feed rifles and many thousands of rounds fired, never had a feeding issue.

JD338

 

[RiverRider]

How about looking at it from the opposite angle: is there any reason to regard a push-feed action as being superior to a CRF action??

 

[Ridgerunner665]

David summed it up well for me...

But I also have had problems with push feed rifles...all feeding issues...all recent production Remington 700's...and not the cheap models either.

I was a hardcore 700 guy for most of my life (41 years old)...but after those rifles, I wouldn't take one if you gave it to me...and that's the truth.

CRF....a Win 70 showed me what a rifle is supposed to be...smooth, fast, accurate, and reliable...no push feed I ever owned felt so smooth during feeding as the Win 70...no clunking....just smooth.

 

[DrMike]

CRF....a Win 70 showed me what a rifle is supposed to be...smooth, fast, accurate, and reliable...no push feed I ever owned felt so smooth during feeding as the Win 70...no clunking....just smooth.

There is that. The Model 70, especially the new Florence produced models, are exceptionally smooth.

 

[Ridgerunner665]

I overlooked Vince's reply earlier...what he said about model 70's appealing to the heart is also very true in my case...can't really explain it, but it does.

This ordeal with the hacksaw wizard ruining my 70...It truly feels like my dog or best horse died....not to be melodramatic, but that's exactly how it feels.

 

[Anonymous]

I used to be a dyed in the wool CRF kinda guy. Only shot CRF rifles and promoted their superiority with the zeal of a televangelist.

After a lot of shooting.... and a lot more hunting.... I just came to realize that field reliability has more to do with operator error, user maintenance and ammunition quality than any inherent design. In equal quality rifles with reasonable care- either should be failure free. I've also had broken samples of both due to poor assembly, over pressure ammo, and plain bad luck.

I still have a slight preference for CRF but at the moment my two favorite rifles are both PFs and will likely be that way for some time.

 

[BK]

I agree, Kurt, that is scary. Course, you couldn't be following a finer example of the art of riflery (said Mike, modestly). :mrgreen:

Careful, Mike, I'd hate to see all of your hats become too small...

 

[gerry]

Good thoughts Guy. I have jammed up my push feed Sako one time (a blunt nosed bullet) but have also jammed up a controlled feed action before though too. My Rem 700 264 WM when I first got it didn't always feed well but after some use it became flawless and is by far the smoothest action I own. Must have been a burr in there somewhere. My 35 Whelen from a recent Rem 700 SPS action has been reliable from the beginning when it comes to feeding rounds. In short I have trusted my life to push feeds while grizzly hunting and have done the same with controlled round actions. Either type can be very reliable when done right and either can be a disaster when not.

 

[DrMike]

I agree, Kurt, that is scary. Course, you couldn't be following a finer example of the art of riflery (said Mike, modestly). :mrgreen:

Careful, Mike, I'd hate to see all of your hats become too small...

I quit wearing hats last winter. Funnily enough, none of them fit me anymore! :shock:

 

[SJB358]

I like the looks of them a little more, but I am not trying to kid myself they are really better. I like the Model 70's, both pushers and CRF's, but tend to look for Classic's of SC made rifles if I have my way.