Day with M70 Alaskan

[SJB358]

Spent some time with the M70 338 today. That front screw is pretty particular. After realizing the screw was pretty loose, I decided to experiment with it using my FAT wrench shooting the 200 AB's. I am 98% sure that is what I am going to roll with for this Fall. They run about 3000 out of my rifle and seem to be accurate enough to hunt with.

Here is the group I got with the screw set at 15 inch lb's.

30 inch lbs

45 inch lbs

So, with that, any of you all with Pre 64's with the front screw, mess with the TQ a little. Matter of fact, it was a good exercise, as I noticed the screw WILL back out during firing. I kept the TQ wrench set on 45 inch lbs and it required TQ after every third shot.

Once I got home, I used some Blue Loctite and Tq'ed all of the screws down. This really worries me, I hate thinking about screws backing out. Probably how the stock split in the first place.

I also shot another load that shows great promise. I used RL15, CCI250's, 210 PT's and WW cases.

I am going to shoot long tomorrow, trying both loads. Whichever shoots best, will get the nod for Idaho.. Getting down to the time crunch, but really, I am ready, the 7WSM is shooting spot on, so, if needed, the 338WM will play back up.

Anyway, Pat was right, play with that front screw. I think you'll be surprised. I couldn't go any tighter on it with the bits I had. I actually could see them flexing and popped out of the screw and marred them.. Really made me cranky. Gotta look for some stronger bits for the Fat Wrench.

 

[Guest]

Scott,
That 210 Partition load looks good to me. Great group. What's the velocity?

Don

 

[SJB358]

No idea Don. Didn't have the chrono. I will check it tomorrow.

 

[DrMike]

Perhaps the screws aren't as tight as you might like, but the group is certainly tight. Fine shooting or a good load, Scotty. The 7WSM is always there.

 

[JD338]

Scotty,

The 210 gr PT is your load, regardless of velocity.
Even at 2900 fps, its an elk killing machine.

JD338

 

[RiverRider]

That's some danged good shooting there, Scotty. I'd be shickled titless with a .338 that shoots like that (even though I do not need one...but what does "need" have to do with it?).

 

[Guest]

Scott,
I'm with JD on this one, that's where I was going. I'd be looking closer at that Partition if it were me. I would bet it's 2900 or so.

Don

 

[Oldtrader3]

You got that 210 gr Partition to shoot pretty well and that bullet will lay elk low! Front screw tension on Model 70's is an entire topic of accuracy with those rifles. Actually, the rear action screw tension plays into it as well.

I took the screw out of my .270 Win and had the Stockmaker bed the entire barrel with forend tip pressure. That may not work for you, Scotty.

We can talk more when you get back, if you need any help, I am always here as well to help. Vermont American makes some good bits (US Made).

 

[gerry]

Like the others said the 210 PT load looks really good, have read before that fast burning powders like RL 15 and Big Game do well with the lighter bullets in the 338 (and 358 Norma too ) Looks like you are pretty much there with that load.

 

[onesonek]

Looks very good Scotty!!! Funny what alil torque will do in some situations.

 

[Hegland]

Look like elk-killers to me!

Fascinating to observe the effect of a few pounds on a screw, thanks for sharing man.

 

[FOTIS]

No idea Don. Didn't have the chrono. I will check it tomorrow.

Cool
might want to try that in my Ruger 1s`

 

[SJB358]

You got that 210 gr Partition to shoot pretty well and that bullet will lay elk low! Front screw tension on Model 70's is an entire topic of accuracy with those rifles. Actually, the rear action screw tension plays into it as well.

I took the screw out of my .270 Win and had the Stockmaker bed the entire barrel with forend tip pressure. That may not work for you, Scotty.

We can talk more when you get back, if you need any help, I am always here as well to help. Vermont American makes some good bits (US Made).

Charlie, that is sort of the problem, with the flimsy bits, I could see them deflecting under 45 inch lb's. The one time they slipped out of the slot and marred the screw. I was a little torqued at that point. :twisted:

I will check out the Vermont American bits. I would really like a set of bits that are much stronger for this. As of right now, the screws are all torqued to 45 in lbs, except the forward trigger guard screw.

I also really like the RL15 load with the 210. It just went into where it was supposed to go. My only worry is a grain above and below, didn't shoot nearly as well. I will reshoot 66 grains. Nosler states it should be in the 2900 range, as does QL

Cartridge : .338 Win Mag.
Bullet : .338, 210, Nosler PART SP 16337
Useable Case Capaci: 77.827 grain H2O = 5.053 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.340 inch = 84.84 mm
Barrel Length : 25.0 inch = 635.0 mm
Powder : Alliant Reloder-15

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-10.0 83 59.40 2652 3278 44769 8587 99.1 1.350
-09.0 84 60.06 2677 3342 46101 8659 99.3 1.332
-08.0 85 60.72 2703 3406 47469 8728 99.5 1.314
-07.0 86 61.38 2728 3470 48875 8794 99.6 1.296
-06.0 86 62.04 2753 3535 50319 8857 99.7 1.279
-05.0 87 62.70 2778 3600 51803 8917 99.8 1.262
-04.0 88 63.36 2803 3665 53328 8974 99.9 1.246 ! Near Maximum !
-03.0 89 64.02 2828 3730 54895 9027 99.9 1.229 ! Near Maximum !
-02.0 90 64.68 2853 3796 56506 9077 100.0 1.213 ! Near Maximum !
-01.0 91 65.34 2878 3861 58161 9124 100.0 1.198 ! Near Maximum !
+00.0 92 66.00 2902 3927 59862 9168 100.0 1.182 ! Near Maximum !
+01.0 93 66.66 2926 3993 61611 9211 100.0 1.167 ! Near Maximum !
+02.0 94 67.32 2951 4060 63409 9254 100.0 1.153 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.0 95 67.98 2975 4126 65257 9296 100.0 1.138 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 96 68.64 2999 4193 67158 9338 100.0 1.124 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+05.0 97 69.30 3022 4260 69114 9380 100.0 1.110 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 92 66.00 2994 4180 70168 8834 100.0 1.107 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 92 66.00 2764 3562 49612 9354 97.9 1.283


Not really too worried about the speed, I know it is there, just wanna reshoot for accuracy.

Thanks for all the help on all of this. The 7WSM is always there if needed and the 338 won't get with the program. It has been touch and go, I got the rifle so late in the game, that doing a truly good load work up for it hasn't been done. RL15 was really the first powder that I did a little bit of work with. But, looking back, I think the screws were backing out when I was using IMR4350 and RL19, so those may warrant a retest as well.

Right now, I am doing exactly what I didn't wanna be doing, shooting right up till I leave, but it should work out. Hoping to get out to the 300 yard range shortly, so I can verify the zero and see what it does at distance.

 

[SJB358]

No idea Don. Didn't have the chrono. I will check it tomorrow.

Cool
might want to try that in my Ruger 1s`

Fotis, what is your load that has worked in a bunch of your #1's? I thought it was 4350 and the 210, but I can't remember.

 

[FOTIS]

73-74 gr IMR 4350. Usually under MOA and 3050 in a 26" #1 Tube.

 

[SJB358]

73-74 gr IMR 4350. Usually under MOA and 3050 in a 26" #1 Tube.

Wow, yeah, that load showed a ton of promise in my rifle, but I thought it was slightly hot. I think it was actually just the brass was a little long and incurred some drag, as there were no marks on the case head. It was also right in the 3100 range.

This was 72.5 grains of IMR4350, WW case, CCI250 primer..

I had the one get thrown WAY out to left field, but I am thinking if I reshot that now, it would probably be much better. I will back it down again, later on in the year and reshoot it. I am thinking that might be another good option.

 

[FOTIS]

no 4th shell for a verifier?

Come on Scottie!

 

[SJB358]

Yeah, I know, I do 4 whenever I am truly trying to get a solid load, but I was trying to cheat with three. You know what happens when you try to shortcut it! Just costs more fuel to go and load more!

 

[Oldtrader3]

Scotty, we are all mentally pulling for you to get it done with your wife's wonderful gift this year. That is the important thing. The 210 Partitions always worked well for me in the .338 WM at about 2900 fps or a litle more. You are correct, when you get to this level of power and bullet weight, 50-75 fps is unimportant. Accuracy is where it is at.

I have never used the RL series powders and IMR 4350 gets it done in the .338 Win as well as anything. does and the 210 PT has worked for all for ever! I hope that you kill a bruiser with it.

 

[SJB358]

I hope that you kill a bruiser with it.

Me too Charlie!

I use alot of the Alliant powders, for just about everything, but I have IMR4350 on the bench as you all gave it alot of thumbs up. I will retry it later on. Right now, I am kinda against the wall. If the 200 AB's shoot well at the longer range, I will probably go that way.

I have the same exact load, with RL15 loaded up right now to reshoot at 200 and 300, so if they work, and provide good accuracy with the 210's, I will load up 20-25 of them and go hunting. I really think the 210 has shot better overall, but the danged forend screw played heck with my results. I thought it was the loads and the barrel heat, but it is more of the forend screw tension. Everything is loctited down now (semi permanent) so that should be in the past.