NA Big Game Caliber

[remingtonman_25_06]

Tough to beat the 338's. They are a very versatile caliber.

After owning and shooting both regular magnums, short magnums, and Ultra magnums, I have come to the conclusion that for anything inside 600 yards, you dont need the RUMs, after that is nice to have them, but you really dont need them for close up stuff. They deliver the goods at LR where the others simply cant and dont have enough to do the job.

If one only wants to hunt and shoot out to 500 yards on elk, which is a long ways for some people, and or terrain, I would pick a 270 or 280 with a good 150/160 and be totally satisfied. Out to 800 yards, your basic 7mm and 300 mags will do the job. Out to 1200 or so is when you need a RUM or some other type round that delivers the numbers downrange you need to kill.

For the average guy, I dont see a 338 RJM being the best choice. For one, the average guy can only shoot a 30-06/7mm decent over time. The 338 RUM recoils more then 2x as hard. People who cant shoot the gun accurately aren't gonna gain a thing with all that power. It takes a lot of trigger time behind them bigger guns to get use to them and just roll with the flow. For two, the average guy dont shoot past 300 yards, why does anyone need a RUM to kill animals at less then 300 yards???

I think the best choice is one that the guy feels comfortable with. Depends on lots of factors, but id say a good 270-280-30-06,7mm/300/338 WM with the right bullets, is all the gun anyone really needs to kill things further then most can hit them at.

 

[Greg Nolan]

The basic premis wasn't wether there was a better caliber for a deer under x number of yards. I believe it was ONE caliber that you could dust a deer or stand your ground against a polar or grizzly bear and not wonder if compromise in favor of the deer was realy the best decision.
Thankfully all us gun nuts would rather have to decide which of the 6 or 8 rifles we have that are all suitable we're going to use on today's hunt.
I like it like that 8)
Greg

 

[Richracer1]

The basic premis wasn't wether there was a better caliber for a deer under x number of yards. I believe it was ONE caliber that you could dust a deer or stand your ground against a polar or grizzly bear and not wonder if compromise in favor of the deer was realy the best decision.
Thankfully all us gun nuts would rather have to decide which of the 6 or 8 rifles we have that are all suitable we're going to use on today's hunt.
I like it like that 8)
Greg

Exactly Greg. If you have no intention on hunting the big bears or the big Yukon/Alaskan moose, then a 270, 7mm something, or the 308 and 30-06 are more than adequate even for elk. I keep reading about the recoil of the RUMs, and I have to say it again, I have yet to feel the recoil of any of my RUMs, to include shooting a yote last Saturday with my 375RUM at about 80 - 100yds. Oh, I also need to add that none of them have muzzle brakes and never will.

 

[Guy Miner]

Okay - I'd take ANY North American big game with a .30-06 and good bullets. Grizz & moose included. I don't see a problem. :grin: It's been done before and it will be done again. Without problem. Even grizz aren't bullet proof. Not that I'll ever be able to afford the 10 or 20 grand to hunt one...

It's nice that you guys like your big boomer .338's, but they're really not necessary.

That said, I sure do enjoy the big boomers too... Boys do like their toys...

Guy

 

[Richracer1]

Isn't great we have all these choices of caliber to sit around and debate about. Lots of good stuff here. :grin:

Happy Thanksgiving everyone

 

[SJB358]

Same to you Rich. Glad we have something worthy of debating about. Scotty

 

[cloverleaf]

I will limit what I hunt in NA. I cant handle the recoil and pronghorn are just as dead w/ my 250. That said, Lots a folks w/ more knowledge than me like the 338- and if a bear wants me for lunch I hope JD is standin' close buy, muzzle break or no. Happy Thanksgiving Guys!!

 

[JD338]

I will limit what I hunt in NA. I cant handle the recoil and pronghorn are just as dead w/ my 250. That said, Lots a folks w/ more knowledge than me like the 338- and if a bear wants me for lunch I hope JD is standin' close buy, muzzle break or no. Happy Thanksgiving Guys!!

CL,

I'll be your wing man. No brakes for me. :wink:

JD338

 

[remingtonman_25_06]

Maybe the blast from my braked EDGE would at least scare him the other way if I missed, lol!! Which I probly would considering the circumstances. Wouldn't ever really wanna find out, could be a bad situation ha ha.

I'm not saying you dont notice the recoil while shooting at animals. Of course you dont. What am getting at here is that you still have to practice with the gun to become proficient with it. I think anyone who says RUMS dont kick are simply trying to pull someones leg...45-50lbs of recoil is noticable...

Try shooting 30-40 rounds at LR with an unbraked 300 or 338 RUM and see how many hits you get, if you last that long..

Now shoot a braked 338 RUM and you can shoot it literally all day and not worry about it.

Theres a big difference between practicing at targets and shooting at game. Its called adrenaline.

Guy is right tho, boys do like there toys, and a big 338 is something I think everyone should have or at least get to shoot. They are about as much fun as a guy can have with his pants on!!

 

[huntin nv]

I have always thought that the 300 winchester magnum was the most perfect caliber ever invented. Wrap a remington 700 around that bullet in stainless and synthetic and you can never go wrong. I own 4 300 wm and still thinking of buying another one. I used to have a load for each animal now shoot nothing but 180 grain AB. While I dont carry it for everything I will say that if I could only have one firearm for everything it would be a 300 win. The only animals that have walked this planet that I may not be able to kill with a 300 are all dead and fossils now anyway.

 

[roysclockgun]

Nothing against 338RUM or anyone else's choice for that matter. That said; I believe that too many so called journalists write and/or report, anything that may get attention, cause controversy or even punch up sales for advertisers who support them! Anecdotal evidence from a journalists is, many times, worthless.
Jack O'Connor's reports, regarding the 270Win., years ago, probably did more for that cartridge than did all the Winchester ads. But, Old Jack hunted all over the world and shot countless game animals USING rifles chambered in 270Win. Therefore, Jack had credibility. Without showing extensive, real live trigger time, what good is anyone's opinion of a cartridge?
Steven A.

 

[OldMan]

I became a "magnum maniac" years ago and killed everything with a magnum of some sort for many years. I killed a bull elk several years ago that won the big bull contest at my workplace and a rifle was the prize. Since I had a bunch of different magnums that all weighed a bunch, I chose a model 70 featherweight in 30-06. Since I just have to kill something with every rifle I own, I used this puny little ought six for deer that next season. Well, Guess What?? To my amazement every deer I shot went straight down just like my trusty 300 magnums. I just didn't get the crap beat out of me doing the job! That being said, I still grab a magnum for elk, piece of mind I guess!

 

[6mm Remington]

I would choose a 30-06 or a 300 WSM, but in reality there is not much difference between those two cartridges. They are both excellent for just about anything. I'm a real fan of the 30-06 and it's offspring, and I really like the 25-06, 270, "280", 35 Whelan, and I think a 338-06 would be the cats meow. I don't have a 338-06 and cannot afford a custom rifle, but it sure would be nice for everything!!

 

[roysclockgun]

6mm Remington wrote : "and I think a 338-06 would be the cats meow"

I am not convinced that the limited case capacity of the 30-06 can deliver much more effective results when larger diameter bullets are used in the '06 case.
My only real experience with the mouth of an '06 case being opened up, was with a rifle chambered for 8mm-06 Ackley improved. Not much difference twixt a .323 bullet and a .336 bullet, save for maybe getting a little flatter trajectory from a .323 that, perhaps could be launched at a higher MV, and that maybe the .336 creates a tad wider wound channel. But when restricted to what the '06 case can hold, I saw no improvement, by any yardstick, between using the .308 bullet of the 30-06, as opposed to the .323 bullet of the 8mm-06 Ackley Improved. In fact, I wager that the original '06 was a better, all around cartridge.
What it comes down to is, "how high is up?"
My guess is that once a man who can shoot, gets what he can from a 6.5mm cartridge, going up in size is a matter of what he likes and not what he needs to cleanly kill any game animal in N. America.
Steven A.

 

[Guest]

Owned a 338 Win mag once, a short barrelled Savage with a muzzle brake. Had wanted a 338 for years, but traded it away for a 30-06 after a while. The blast and the noise was to much for me. Nothing wrong with the cartridge/caliber, it was the rifle`s fault, handloadings with Nosler 250 grain bullets shot accurate enough.
Have shot a 375 HH for about 10 years, a Ruger #1. Beautiful gun, and accurate. I even shot it from the bench with 270 gr bullets.
The 375 HH along with my 270 Win was stolen from me by my gunsmith !!! That`s a police matter at the time, hope it works out well.

I`ll buy me a couple of new rifles to replace the loss, but wont buy a new 375. I would have to practice a lot to build up to the recoil tollerance again. So I think I`ll get me a 270 Win and a 30-06 AI. That should cower the most. I hunt critters from the small european Roe Deer up to european moose (American elk-zise) and wild bore (3-400 lb ?).

Attacking bears were mentioned; I have spent a lot of time at Spitsbergen (Svalbard) during the years. At Spitsbergen You`re obliged to carry a gun whenever outdoor, in case of polar bear attacs. In fact You could get fined for not carrying a gun !!!!!!
Whenever I go up there again I think I will bring my Remington 870 pump gun and some Federal slugs. That will be sufficient.

 

[3006savage]

FWIW, I took this 88lbs (dressed) blacktail with my 338RUM loaded with a 200ET. I assure you this deer wasn't "overkilled" by any means. It sure is nice though when they drop in their tracks. I don't recall feeling any recoil either.
quote]

The point I was making with "overkill" was not meat damage. It was that the deer would have been just as dead with the WM, with alot less recoil, powder used, and longer barrel life.

As far as not even feeling the recoil from a 338 RUM I would say you are in a very small minority of shooters.

I would concede however that the 338 UM with min charges of faster burning powders can match full power 338WM loads in both felt recoil and performance. Hogdon has loads as low as 70 grains which would be pretty tolerable in the recoil department.

 

[JD338]

I subscribe to the school of no such thing as over kill. The larger surface area of the 338 cal at high velocity makes it a fast killer on game. I agree that the 338 RUM is more than required but it works very well. If you have one and can shoot it with confidence, why not?
I bought mine for elk, moose and Africa but use it on smaller game because the 338 RUM is very impressive on game.

JD338

 

[FOTIS]

Me too JIm! But then again I shoot antelope with 416's....... :shock:

 

[Richracer1]

FWIW, I took this 88lbs (dressed) blacktail with my 338RUM loaded with a 200ET. I assure you this deer wasn't "overkilled" by any means. It sure is nice though when they drop in their tracks. I don't recall feeling any recoil either.
quote]

The point I was making with "overkill" was not meat damage. It was that the deer would have been just as dead with the WM, with alot less recoil, powder used, and longer barrel life.

As far as not even feeling the recoil from a 338 RUM I would say you are in a very small minority of shooters.

I would concede however that the 338 UM with min charges of faster burning powders can match full power 338WM loads in both felt recoil and performance. Hogdon has loads as low as 70 grains which would be pretty tolerable in the recoil department.

I'm also a firm believer that recoil is perceived differently by people. What you may think as heavy recoil, I may not think the same. I think next year I'll pack my 375RUM out for deer, why, because I can.

 

[roysclockgun]

Richracer1 wrote : "I'm also a firm believer that recoil is perceived differently by people. "

THAT is a big 10-4! I have seen men, big men, at the range, with muzzle brakes on 270Win. chambered rifles! When I have spoken to a few of them, the responses are usually something like : "Yeah, the brake really does tame the recoil for me!" I have fired 270Win. and 30-06 off the bench all day without getting a bruise and I am no tough guy. Must be that the ones who mount brakes on those calibers are perceiving more recoil than am I, which could be caused by improper mounting of the butt plate to the shoulder.
First day on TrainFire Range at Ft. Jackson, SC, in 1961, an old Sgt. held an M1 Rifle to his crotch and fired 8 30-06 rounds down range, to prove to new recruits that the rifles "kick" would not knock one down. After that demo, no one was allowed to whine about the recoil from an M1 Rifle! <;^))
Steven A.