Need some input, please

rjm158

rjm158

Handloader
Oct 15, 2009
717
680
I have two situations I would appreciate some input on from you guys/girls who have actually been there/done that, Please.

First, I have the potential opportunity to go on an antelope hunt in Wyoming next year. I already own a 270 WSM and this is what I originally was planning to take. However, I'm a big 25-06 fan and have been reading how much the 257 Wby is regarded by it's user's here. I'm wondering if the 257 gives me any real world advantage (thinking long shots here) over the WSM or vice versa? I would have to buy new ammo/brass dies, etc., so is the cost worth it? I also hunt some big pastures here during deer season so it wouldn't be JUST for the antelope hunt.

Second, I have a Browning BLR in 358 Win. I haven't had the chance to kill anything with it but it shoots great. I kinda had it in my mind that it would be my "heavy" woods caliber but a few days ago I saw a nice Marlin 444 at my LGS. Always thought they were cool rifles but just didn't take the plunge. Same situation as above, any advantage over the 358 and worth the set up cost?

Thanks in advance.

Ron
 
If one wants a 257 Bee or a 25-06, one should purchase one. I can't envision that you will have any greater reach than with the 270WSM, but you will have a rifle chambered in a fine cartridge. Ditto with the 444 contra the 358. I love my 358. It (or the neglected cousin, the .356 Winchester) has taken elk, moose, black bear, mule deer and grizzly, and the bullet did so with aplomb. It affords me somewhat more reach than I would have with a 444, though I can't imagine that one kills any deader than the other.
 
I am a died in wool 25-06 fan but in the real world of game killing I would see no advantage with either of the 25s over the 270 WSM as far the ballistics goes. With the 270 WSM, which is really the best caliber in my opinion of all the short mags, I would use a 130 gr ballistic tip and get it going 3200 fps or so and accurate and sight my rifle 3" high at 100 yards. You can hold in the center of a lopes shoulder out to 350 yards and not worry about shooting over or under it. If it is beyond 350 yards out to just shy of 500 I would raise my point of aim up the shoulder but stay in the hair and have a sharp knife.

As for the 358 in the BLR you have a much better rifle accuracy wise as well as quality than any Marlin in 444. With a 225 gr AccuBond or Partition you are set for most anything you will meet in the woods in North America.

For going out west where it is hard to judge your yardage I would take the money that I would spend on a new rifle and all the assortments needed to get it up and running and invest in the best laser range finder I could find. Then spend time shooting my 270 WSM at long range so I would know exactly where to hold at what distance.
 
I am with Mike and 1Shot here. Anything the 257 WBY can do, the the WSM will do it better with sleeker bullets. Not knocking the 257 a bit. Really is the king of the hill with 115's and 120's, but a 270WSM will easily push a 130 BT or AB into the 3300FPS range without hurting a thing, BC being the same (.45 vs .43) between the two of them, the 270 puts quite alot more energy on target. Step up to the sleeker 140's or 150's and the game changes yet again. If you have the 270WSM, you owe it to yourself to try the new 150 ABLR's. Speed seems pretty easy to come by with them, and the accuracy has been excellent so far. I haven't ran the numbers yet on my muzzle velocity, but it carries alot of energy downrange and seems to slip the wind pretty well too..

Well, the 358 vs the 444.... I don't know what to say, I have only shot deer so far with my 358. It's about as awesome a woods rifle as I could want. I have the BLR like yours and it runs the 225 PT at 2450FPS without drama and shoots plenty well enough to kill deer to 300 or even elk!

I have a 444 as well, haven't taken a danged thing with it, but it is very accurate and pretty decently flat shooting to 200 yards, and probably further, but it starts to drop like a rock past 200.. I like them both alot, but the 358 seems more versatile to me. I don't plan on getting rid of either though.

Good luck with your choice. Just wanting something makes it easy enough to justify for me. The hard part is cracking open the wallet to ante up...

Good luck with your choice though... That 25-06 might be plenty good enough with a 115 BT humping along at 3100-3200.... That's still a pretty deadly combo and Guy has seemed to make it his personal drive to kill everything walking in front of him with that combo! :grin:
 
Thanks for the info, fellas. I was kinda thinking along those lines but I wanted to see if I was covering all angles and not missing something, especially since I haven't actually used the 257 or 444.

Ron
 
I like the 25-06 but think the 270 WSM will buck the wind a little better. It also has a little more reach in my opinion.
Either will work. I use a 25-06 and my hunting partner uses a 270 WSM.
 
Vince":1i3lteom said:
I like the 25-06 but think the 270 WSM will buck the wind a little better. It also has a little more reach in my opinion.
Either will work. I use a 25-06 and my hunting partner uses a 270 WSM.
Click to expand...

The 270WSM is never a bad answer!

HA, I had to buck all these danged 30-06 guys around here!
 
Call me contrarian, but I have to go with the 257Roy and 444... only because one I have and the other is on my short list. I bought a 257Roy on a Vanguard a year or two ago specifically for antelope.... has yet to speak in anger though. I did think enough of the RoyToy to send my 25-06 T/C down the road. Put it up against the 270WSM, though, and I simply can't argue against the ballistics.

I have zero experience with the 358, but I have been itching for a big bore lever and was looking at 45-70, 450 and 444. I find the 444 the most intriguing but can't really put finger on the reason why.
 
meatmachineman":1dco4hfw said:
I find the 444 the most intriguing but can't really put finger on the reason why.
Click to expand...

You took the words right outa my mouth. The pawn/gunshop I work at part time has a Marlin 45-70 and another in town has the 444. Not bashing the 45-70 in any way but, like you, there's just some kind of appeal to me for the 444 that I don't have for the 45-70.

Ron
 
Ron, I know exactly how you feel. I am keeping my eyes peeled for a screaming deal on a Marlin. If it happens to be a 45-70, I certainly won't be shedding any tears, but I am sorta crossing my fingers for a 444. I also like the idea of being able to save some space in my bullet drawer and not have to add another caliber... I already load for the 44mag. I've also had the 450 Marlin on the list, but the belted case certainly retains the least appeal to me of the three.
 
The 444's are some great rifles. Nothing a 45-70 isn't already, but it does have a little extra advantage in trajectory with most loads and uses a little less powder, which makes the recoil a touch lighter. I really like mine.

 
I have virtually zero yearning for a 444. A 45-70, though? Now, I could find myself drawn to this cartridge in a big hurry if the platform was attractive. Having said all that, the .358 and/or .356 is more attractive still for me. Each will kill game, though, and that is what matters.
 
I have seen a 444 that will out shoot my .25 at 100 yards. They are definitely spades in the "cool factror" and bang thump in the woods, or so I'm told. Take the 270 antelope hunting. Personally I've shot more antelope under 200 yards than beyond, but Ive been lucky. My first rifle was a 25-06. That is all the medicine you need IMHO. Maybe some day I'll have another. Nothin' wrong with a weatherby but its more recoil and muzzle blast than you need to kill a goat. It is expensive to play with too. It does however, rank WAY up there on the cool factor scale, especially when the liver quivers of the guy standing behind you. :) Shoot your goat with that 444 and that will raise an eyebrow or two. CL
 
The .25-06 or .257 Wby aren't going to do anything to pronghorn or deer that your .270 WSM doesn't already do, and likely better. Did I just say that? :shock:

Now, if you just want a .25 cal rifle, that's a different story, and yes Scotty is right, the .25-06 is my tool of choice for most hunting situations.

Re the bigger bores, I think your .358 Win is just super-cool, but I have a soft spot in my heart for the big bore Marlins too. A good older Marlin always makes a fine addition to a gun collection.

If you care to, look up and read the three-part series on the .444, written some years ago by Marshal Stanton of Beartooth Bullets. He not only makes superb cast bullets, but also make a convincing case for the .444 Marlin as an excellent rifle/cartridge.

Regards, Guy
 
Mr Stanton sorta swayed me to look at a 444. Plus he makes some excellent cast bullets as well.
 
I would never be afraid to use the 277 on any N/A game!
The 270WSM is just a super charged 270win :mrgreen:.

Blessings,
Dan
 
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