O.T.I.S. - OverThinking It Syndrome

C

CanuckBen

Beginner
Nov 27, 2011
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Am I the only one who will spend absolute rediculous amount of time researching, looking, thinking over details as to, in this case, which caliber rifle you'll be getting next?

Of course the choice should be based on its intended application. In my case, it'll be a range rifle 80% of the time as the vast majority of my hunts are done during the archery seasons. I am saving and planning a trip to our beautiful British Columbia for a trophy sheep hunt. Until then, it'll be a range rifle.

So that laid out, I've been looking at 7mm08, .308, .270win...but then the .280AI comes to mind (though as I don't reload at home yet, that would be an issue - availability and cost of quality ammo)...

For whatever reason I seem to want something different. The .280AI would do the trick, but I don't believe it would be the wisest choice for now. Would a .257roberts P+ do the trick? Sure would be different, but then again, ammo availability may be an issue for now.

Should I step it up and opt for the 7rem mag and have a rifle that I'll also be able to take on much larger game? Thinking about it, but in a light rifle such as a Nosler TGR or a Cooper, 50rounds down range in a day would be putting some strain on a shoulder that is used in pulling a string back or feeling the light mosquetto tap of a crossbow. So, a very good pad and perhaps a slip-on pad under my shooting shirt would be necessary for the first while - and I don't mind handing in my man-card at the range.

So yeah, O.T.I.S it is.
 
I actually tend to be a bit of an impulse buyer... I know I'm going to buy something, but what it might be is something of a mystery (could be how I ended up with four rifles chambered for a cartridge I really don't like).

In your situation as described, unless you are going to be starting to handload fairly soon, I would hold off on the .280 Ackley. Regular .280 ammo (which you could shoot in an AI) is hard enough to find, and AFIK Nosler is the only company loading the Improved stuff.

If I could swing it, I'd be looking at a Kimber Select in .257 Roberts (assuming ammo availability locally). That would be a sweet rig, and shouldn't beat you up too badly from the bench.
 
I can say that I don't believe that I have ever found the need to put 50 rounds down range from the same rifle on a single day. I may have while hunting rabbits or ground squirrels but those were with smaller calibers. If it were my decision I would go with the 7mm Mag.. That would cover you for your listed species and others that may come along in the future. The 7mm mag is the standard that most other 7mm are measured by. Recoil is not significant, ammo is available most anywhere, and it beats the others in performance. Just my .02
 
Elkman":2kql30i5 said:
I can say that I don't believe that I have ever found the need to put 50 rounds down range from the same rifle on a single day. I may have while hunting rabbits or ground squirrels but those were with smaller calibers. If it were my decision I would go with the 7mm Mag.. That would cover you for your listed species and others that may come along in the future. The 7mm mag is the standard that most other 7mm are measured by. Recoil is not significant, ammo is available most anywhere, and it beats the others in performance. Just my .02
Click to expand...

Yeah 50 rounds is alot of rounds - it could only be 20 as well, or 30 or 40. I also shoot skeet at the same range; lighter 1oz, 2 3/4" shells don't have much kick to them, but it can add up after a few hours.

I agree that the performace of the 7mm mag is very good, no doubt there. I've used it on a few moose hunts and was quite happy with it. If I was going to go with a 7mm mag, I'd be looking for a wood stock instead of a composite one, unless it has more weight than the typical super light rifle.
 
I just sold my .280 Remington to my wife's grandson this fall for his use, deer hunting. The 140 grain Partitions and 160 grain Accubonds performed flawlessly for me with this rifle when shooting mule deer for several years of hunting in both Wyoming and Utah.

Last year, handloading with IMR 7828 SSC powder and a BR-2 primer, I was able to maintain a chrono'ed muzzle velocity of 3010 fps (at 15 feet) with the 160 Partition bullet in the .280 Rem. I realise that the .280 AI will exceed this number but this standard .280 Rem velocity is within about 50 fps of what I normally yield with 160 gr bullets from my 7mm Mag. I honestly cannot tell any difference for practical hunting purposes between the choices.
 
Over thinking it? I'm guilty as charged. Absolutely.

That said, there's something about the 7mm (.280 or 7mm Rem mag) that screams PERFECTION for sheep. At least in my mind.

I never thought of the 7mm Rem mag as a hard kicking cartridge, about the same as the good old .30-06 (another good candidate) but I'm a little touched in the head about recoil according to some...

B.C. sheep hunt. Bah. Humbug. Seriously jealous here... :grin:
 
I am also guilty of the same thing.

Can not make up my mind..... so I buy a wby. :mrgreen:
 
Huh... I wouldn't have thought that indecision was a problem for you... :)
 
Guy Miner":1tbjg94i said:
Over thinking it? I'm guilty as charged. Absolutely.

That said, there's something about the 7mm (.280 or 7mm Rem mag) that screams PERFECTION for sheep. At least in my mind.

I never thought of the 7mm Rem mag as a hard kicking cartridge, about the same as the good old .30-06 (another good candidate) but I'm a little touched in the head about recoil according to some...

B.C. sheep hunt. Bah. Humbug. Seriously jealous here... :grin:
Click to expand...

What I liked about the .280AI was its very comparable performances to the 7mm Rem mag, but with less recoil. Its a very subjective matter I know. I wouldn't want to drop $2k on the rifle and another $1.5k on a scope and be with a rifle that simple isn't enjoyable at the range.

Should I just "stick" with the proven .308 instead? Based on recoil alone, probably. Perhaps take a longer look at the 7mm-08 as well. I learned the ropes as a kid with my dad's .30-06 and though it is a proven round, I simply don't have much interest in it.
 
Ben,

I really like the 7mm calibre. You won't go wrong with any of the cartridges you name. The .308 has stood the test of time, delivering accuracy and a good punch; it will work very well for sheep, as well as working well for moose, elk, deer and black bear. No one needs to defend the 7mm RM for these purposes. I don't find the recoil objectionable with this cartridge. Stock design goes a long way toward making the cartridge comfortable to shoot. The 280 AI is so close to the 7RM as to be a ballistic twin, and that is quite a compliment. The 7mm-08 will work very well on sheep, and more than a few people have used it successfully on moose, elk and black bear. Obviously, it will work very well on deer. I don't believe you will go wrong on any of those cartridges. Given those parameters, I'd likely choose my rifle on the basis of personal taste and comfort shouldering the rifle. Consequently, do you have an area in mind for hunting sheep?
 
I know, everybody on this forum makes fun of it, but the .270 Winchester has killed many, many sheep, is accurate, low recoil, fast MV and easy to shoot well. Personally, I have personally killed somewhere north of 50 deer with it and have utter confidence in it for medium game.

I also have had a 7mm Rem Mag since 1963 and do not even bother to use it on deer, unless I am sure to be shooting cross canyon, beyond 250 yards. Either of these or any of the other 7mm cartridges will probably work just fine, including the .270 WSM.
 
DrMike":3lad7cfu said:
Ben,

I really like the 7mm calibre. You won't go wrong with any of the cartridges you name. The .308 has stood the test of time, delivering accuracy and a good punch; it will work very well for sheep, as well as working well for moose, elk, deer and black bear. No one needs to defend the 7mm RM for these purposes. I don't find the recoil objectionable with this cartridge. Stock design goes a long way toward making the cartridge comfortable to shoot. The 280 AI is so close to the 7RM as to be a ballistic twin, and that is quite a compliment. The 7mm-08 will work very well on sheep, and more than a few people have used it successfully on moose, elk and black bear. Obviously, it will work very well on deer. I don't believe you will go wrong on any of those cartridges. Given those parameters, I'd likely choose my rifle on the basis of personal taste and comfort shouldering the rifle. Consequently, do you have an area in mind for hunting sheep?
Click to expand...

I know for a fact that the hunting opportunities/outings for large games (moose / elk) will be quite limited as I do most of hunting during the archery season, but it's always good to know ahead of time that a caliber such as the 7mm-08 would do the trick should an opportunity present itself. It’s all about bullet choice & shot placement.

As for where exactly I plan on going for a sheep hunt in BC I am not sure of it yet. Ideally I would go with a friend and not through an outfitter, so to keep cost down and enjoy it with a friend is always important to me. One thing that I have not confirmed yet is if, as a province non-resident, I can go by myself or if I am obligated to go with a guide.

Would you have any recommendations?
 
Lots of good cartridges mentioned and odds are any of them will do the job if the shooter does his part. Lately I've been on a bit of a 7x57 mauser kick so would add that cartridge to the list. It just could be slightly better than the 7mm-08 when handloaded and usually handles the heavier bullets a bit better. I'm thinking that if I could swing a sheep hunt, I'd take my Winchester M70 Featherweight in 7x57 loaded with a top load using the Nosler 150 gr. Partition and never look back. 8) Other possible choices in bullets would be the 140 gr. Barnes TSX and possibly the 160 gr. Speer Grand Slams. Whichever one my rifle shot best. Another possible choice would be this commercial FN Mauser in .270 that I picked up back in 1973 for the exhorbitant price of $75. :shock: Guy that sold it to me said it was too ugly to be seen with in public. :roll: :lol: :lol: He's right. The late Jack O'Connor once said of a rifle that offended his senses, "That stock was so ugly it would abort a lady crocodile." He must have been looking at my .270. :roll: :lol:
So why haven't I restocked that ugly rifle? That rifle with it's ugly stock, 24" soda straw barrel will put three 150 gr. Nosler Partitions into .75" all day long and sometimes groups are a little smaller. With a top load of H4831 it pushes those 150 gr. bullet to 2999 FPS, hell call it 3000 FPS. :wink: With scope, sling and a full magazine that rifle weighs exactly 7 pounds on the button. At least it doesn't break my arches down at high elevations. 8)
I'm thinking that the cartridge may not be as important as rifle weight. If a heavy rifle wears you out, you may not be able to shoot as well as you should.
I guess if I were in your place, I'd be talking either that 7x57 or that .270, whichever one weighed the least.
Paul B.
 
DrMike":1wmfl5mf said:
Ben,

It is my understanding that all non-residents must be accompanied by a guide or by a family member with an Accompany to Hunt permit. Here is a place to start looking to verify this information: http://www.env.gov.bc.ca/fw/wildlife/hunting/non_resident/#GuideOutfitters. I don't know if you might have better luck looking in the Yukon or NWT for Dall Sheep.
Click to expand...

That was my understanding as well Mike. Unfortunately I cannot access the Accompany to Hunt specific page (darn 408/409 Server Busy Error), but this main page refers to only being accompanied by a resident of 19years or older with the said permit, nor can I say if the said resident must be a family member or not. Will try again later this pm.

Dall Sheep in the Yukon/NWT would be great as well. Seriously got my eyes on a Mountain Goat in BC. Definately two memorable trophy hunts, but I'd go to BC 1st.

Thank you for the link - its been saved in my bookmarks.

Ben
 
I am kinda in Kurt's boat, once I get a certain cartridge in my head, I scour the ads to find a M70 so chambered. For goat's and sheep, I can't see much better out there than a 270 Win, 270WSM, 280 Rem, 7WSM, 7RM.. Those would all do about the same thing with good bullets that would collect sheep a long way away. Add a good recoil pad to any of them and I don't think you would find them hard on you at all. Since you don't handload, the 7RM, is about the best of the lot. Ton's of great ammo for it and it really shines with the heavier bullets in moose land. Good luck overthinking it, I can't fall asleep at night thinking about rifles/loads, or hunting trips I am ready to tackle!
 
SJB358":kb7z0mwe said:
I am kinda in Kurt's boat, once I get a certain cartridge in my head, I scour the ads to find a M70 so chambered. For goat's and sheep, I can't see much better out there than a 270 Win, 270WSM, 280 Rem, 7WSM, 7RM.. Those would all do about the same thing with good bullets that would collect sheep a long way away. Add a good recoil pad to any of them and I don't think you would find them hard on you at all. Since you don't handload, the 7RM, is about the best of the lot. Ton's of great ammo for it and it really shines with the heavier bullets in moose land. Good luck overthinking it, I can't fall asleep at night thinking about rifles/loads, or hunting trips I am ready to tackle!
Click to expand...

Yeah for some reason the wife may not welcome the good luck words :mrgreen:

I would LOVE to reload and eventhough I am pretty handy and manually inclined, I do have some hesitation in doing it by myself for the first few (dozen) times. I've seen it done, both in person and online, but never in a situation where I was the student of it. Unfortunately, not a lot of folks around here that I know reload. Lots of folks at the range yes - it's a military range only - but availability can be an issue, not to mention the distance from my house to the range and where most of the guys live. Hopefully this year I'll be able to find someone close to me and not an hr+ drive away. I surely wouldn't mind paying someone's gas cost either. In the mean time I'll be breaking some more clays. It goes boom and is just as fun :mrgreen:
 
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