6.5 CM Nosler 140 CC Bullet

[bowfishn]

Tested out the Nosler 140 Custom Comps today kept temps above 70 degrees so it will be easier when summer comes around.

I loaded to 2.740" COAL (.020" off lands) using Nosler Brass Collet Neck Sized 52.7 gr H2O capacity. Used RL26 powder, BR2 primers and all bullets were HBN coated. 5 shot averages
Rifle 10BA Stealth 6.5 CM 24" Barrel
Grains Average velocity SD
46 2745 fps 17
46.5 2783 fps 6
47 2816 fps 18
47.5 2848 fps 8
48 2894 fps 5
48.5 2926 fps 12
49 2964 fps 8
49.5 3001 fps 11
Everything ran very close with projected QL data, highest load was at Max CIP for 6.5 CM according to QL for my Rifle, I do not recommend loading that high without slowly working up.
The 49.5 gr load looked like it was just moving out of the node, will know after tests without MagnetoSpeed installed. I just don't think from what I see I will be able to use it. Too close on upper pressure as well I think 48 through 49 gr will work for me some where withinn that range. Once I have a better handle on it I will change seating depths.
No visible sign of pressure, easy bolt lift, tight primers, no flattened primers 49.5 was just barely less rounded than the 46 I started with. Definitely way less noticeable pressure than with Hornady Factory 140 ELD-M Loads.
I tested velocity with my MagnetoSpeed, will now do an OCW without it installed. The Stealth is more effected by the MagnetoSpeed than my 26" Heavy Palma Barrel is.
I am also testing out a few (10 each) for effects of Full length Sizing, Bump Die and Collet Neck sizing as well as Body Die and Collet Neck sizing. I am using the 48.5 gr load above for the 3 different sizing methods. Will check Velocity and SD.
I checked for bullet Run Out on each type with the 10 loads each. The results were:
Full Sized with Forster Die was the best with .0005" to .0015" with the majority .001" or below.
Body Size with Redding Die and Lee Collet Neck die ran .0005" to .0015" with the majority between .001" and .0015"
Lee Collet and Forster Shoulder Bump was .005" to .0015" majority were .003" and down.
Not a lot of difference with full length and Body size Collet Neck size, but just Neck sizing does leave a bigger variance.

 

[Cleveland48]

I’m gonna have to find me some RL26. Those speeds are impressive.


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[TackDriver284]

Ran a rough estimate on QL on your data, seems like the node is around 47.7 grains of RL-26
Node #5 is 1.2282 I used the 48 grain data and tweaked the Ba to match your velocity.

Cartridge          : 6.5 Creedmoor Hornady
Bullet             : .264, 140, Nosler CC HPBT 26725
Useable Case Capaci: 46.122 grain H2O = 2.995 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.740 inch = 69.60 mm
Barrel Length      : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm
Powder             : Alliant Reloder-26 ?

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 2.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-20.0   83    38.16   2232    1549   26785   8855     91.2    1.692
-18.0   86    39.11   2296    1638   28715   9161     92.8    1.644
-16.0   88    40.07   2360    1731   30801   9449     94.2    1.597
-14.0   90    41.02   2424    1827   33059   9719     95.5    1.552
-12.0   92    41.98   2488    1925   35505   9967     96.6    1.507
-10.0   94    42.93   2553    2026   38155  10192     97.6    1.460
-08.0   96    43.88   2618    2130   41036  10392     98.4    1.411
-06.0   98    44.84   2682    2236   44168  10564     99.1    1.363
-04.0  100    45.79   2747    2345   47578  10708     99.5    1.316
-02.0  102    46.75   2811    2456   51302  10821     99.9    1.272
+00.0  104    47.70   2874    2568   55372  10901    100.0    1.228  ! Near Maximum !
+02.0  106    48.65   2938    2682   59830  10956    100.0    1.187  ! Near Maximum !
+04.0  109    49.61   3000    2798   64726  11005    100.0    1.147  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+06.0  111    50.56   3063    2916   70114  11048    100.0    1.108  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+08.0  113    51.52   3125    3035   76062  11086    100.0    1.070  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+10.0  115    52.47   3187    3157   82647  11118    100.0    1.034  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba    104    47.70   3017    2830   70497  10335    100.0    1.121  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba    104    47.70   2655    2192   43315  10979     95.5    1.370

 

[bowfishn]

Ran a rough estimate on QL on your data, seems like the node is around 47.7 grains of RL-26
Node #5 is 1.2282 I used the 48 grain data and tweaked the Ba to match your velocity.

Your close on your tweaking, but it looks like you may have left out HBN coating it is around .40 on my rifles, based off testing done before I started using it.
The 3000 fps is right at 64K (63,091 is CIP Max, not worried as rifle is good for cartridges rated for 65K all day and It is above where I will be using it, 49 gr is 61,257)
I am not sure about below 48 although 47.7 could be the start of the node. My point of impact shifted up 2" starting with 48 gr and stayed the same until 49.5 when it jumped another inch up. But again that was with the MagnetoSpeed installed and I will be doing testing at .3 or .2 gr jumps when I do actual OCW tests. Other factors that will change things is what I find with sizing tests, so of coarse It could end up at the point you said.

 

[RL338]

For my 6.5 Creed.(Howa 24"HB) I run the Nosler 140gr. RDFs at .020" off in Hornady brass with 47.6grs of RL26 , this results in an average of 2775fps. I went higher but settled at 47.6. The best part with RL26 is how easy the barrel cleans up.

 

[bowfishn]

For my 6.5 Creed.(Howa 24"HB) I run the Nosler 140gr. RDFs at .020" off in Hornady brass with 47.6grs of RL26 , this results in an average of 2775fps. I went higher but settled at 47.6. The best part with RL26 is how easy the barrel cleans up.

Your lot is pretty close to QL default for RL26, I had experimented with the RDFs in my 26" when I first was using RL26. I gave up on them to soon I think, they never shot as well as the ELD's , I should have tried a greater jump or maybe jamming the lands. I bought a 1000 of the Custom Comps so I will be trying what ever it takes to make them shoot. I am also going to try some H4350 with some loads down to 2600 fps to see what will work for 200 yard Egg Shoots. Maybe I will get a short barrel 20" to 21" for the egg shoots.

 

[TackDriver284]

Ran a rough estimate on QL on your data, seems like the node is around 47.7 grains of RL-26
Node #5 is 1.2282 I used the 48 grain data and tweaked the Ba to match your velocity.

Your close on your tweaking, but it looks like you may have left out HBN coating it is around .40 on my rifles, based off testing done before I started using it.

The weighing factor is .4? Looks like I missed the HBN coating. You can run it faster with the coating and get similar pressures as the lower charges.

 

[bowfishn]

Ran a rough estimate on QL on your data, seems like the node is around 47.7 grains of RL-26
Node #5 is 1.2282 I used the 48 grain data and tweaked the Ba to match your velocity.

Your close on your tweaking, but it looks like you may have left out HBN coating it is around .40 on my rifles, based off testing done before I started using it.

The weighing factor is .4? Looks like I missed the HBN coating. You can run it faster with the coating and get similar pressures as the lower charges.

Yeah it the Friction Reduction Multiplier.
I tested 10 each today using the different sizing methods.
The Body Die and Collet Neck gave best SD with the load I used, I will test another 10 each with Full length sizing and Body & Collet but this time with 48 gr instead of 48.5 gr and see if results are the same. Both FL and Body and Collet had slight increase in speed about 8 fps over the Just Neck sizing and bumping shoulder but I expected that from the smaller starting case capacity before expansion.
I will from this decide what method I will use over the next 100 rounds of testing without MagnetoSpeed installed. I have a feeling I am really going to have to play with seating depths before I get it to shoot Bugholes at a hundred. It does not bother me to do so much testing I find it quite enjoyable and rewarding.

 

[Cleveland48]

I’m keeping an eye on this thread mainly for the nosler cc bullet. I’ve never used them before, but if you get good results I’m gonna pick some up and try them myself. Also this RL26 data intrigued me greatly lol. Unfortunately I can’t find any locally to save my life.


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[bowfishn]

If you have enough stuff to order to warrant hazmat charges there were a couple places still that had it online.

 

[bowfishn]

I checked out things with 47.5 gr of RL26 this time to check on Full Length sizing vs Body size with Lee Collet Neck size.
I got same results again the Full Length had fluke velocities bringing SD up, It must be something to do with uneven neck tension I would guess but I will do more checks. SD with Collet Neck and Body sizing had again single digit SDs
I tried changing Seating depth from .020" off lands to .040" off lands SD went up to 16 and velocity went down about 19 fps I think it had something to do with more jump before hitting lands dropped pressure more than loss of case capacity should have increased pressure.
I then tested with just touching the lands and SD went to 6 the grouping was the tightest even with the Magnetospeed installed, velocity went up about 12 fps for the average to 2881 fps from the 2869 fps that I had tested with the Collet Neck and Body Sizing.
Figured I would throw out what I found for any who might want to compare info to what they find.

 

[andrewctillman]

That is amazing velocity for a Creedmoor. I am just starting to reload for it. (Tikka T3x CTR and Hornady brass).

Has anyone heard if RL26 is a barrel burner in the CM like RL17?

 

[bowfishn]

That is amazing velocity for a Creedmoor. I am just starting to reload for it. (Tikka T3x CTR and Hornady brass).

Has anyone heard if RL26 is a barrel burner in the CM like RL17?

Heat of explosion is higher for RL17 - 3990 vs RL26 - 3905 but that is not the only thing that gets factored in the equation.
So far I have 1000 or so Rounds down my 26" Savage 6.5 CM build and there is no sign of erosion, the throat looks good through scope as well as I can measure no difference in distance to lands from new to now. I have used HBN for most all of the loads, but they have been hot loads for most all of them. The formula for figuring barrel life shows I should get 1800 rounds before accuracy degrades much. I think I will get more because of what it looks like after the first 1000 rounds.

 

[Cleveland48]

That is amazing velocity for a Creedmoor. I am just starting to reload for it. (Tikka T3x CTR and Hornady brass).

Has anyone heard if RL26 is a barrel burner in the CM like RL17?

Heat of explosion is higher for RL17 - 3990 vs RL26 - 3905 but that is not the only thing that gets factored in the equation.
So far I have 1000 or so Rounds down my 26" Savage 6.5 CM build and there is no sign of erosion, the throat looks good through scope as well as I can measure no difference in distance to lands from new to now. I have used HBN for most all of the loads, but they have been hot loads for most all of them. The formula for figuring barrel life shows I should get 1800 rounds before accuracy degrades much. I think I will get more because of what it looks like after the first 1000 rounds.

While I don’t have a bore scope my measurements to the lands are still the same after 826 rounds. Some were pretty warm rounds too, and my accuracy has not degraded yet.


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[andrewctillman]

thanks Bowfishin,

you are a real man of science. thank you for your informative posts! Gives me alot of confidence to try RL26 which is on shelves here in Central Oregon.

What is temperature of URP or IMR 4451?

I will probably not be coating my bullets but will be annealing and maintaining neck thickness.

PS Tackdriver, can you run QL and RL 26 for the 147 grain ELD-M at 2.8 OCL? (24 inch and Hornady brass).

 

[bowfishn]

thanks Bowfishin,

you are a real man of science. thank you for your informative posts! Gives me alot of confidence to try RL26 which is on shelves here in Central Oregon.

What is temperature of URP or IMR 4451?

I will probably not be coating my bullets but will be annealing and maintaining neck thickness.

PS Tackdriver, can you run QL and RL 26 for the 147 grain ELD-M at 2.8 OCL? (24 inch and Hornady brass).

URP is 3920
IMR 4451 is 3990
H4350 is 3760 good barrel life Temp stable
RL16 is 3800 should be good barrel life Temp Stable but a bit faster velocities than H4350.

Cartridge : 6.5 Creedmoor Hornady
Bullet : .264, 147, Hornady ELD-M 26333
Useable Case Capaci: 46.231 grain H2O = 3.002 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.800 inch = 71.12 mm
Barrel Length : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm
Powder : Alliant Reloder-26

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 0.42% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-04.2 100 45.60 2717 2409 49254 10646 99.9 1.327
-03.8 100 45.80 2730 2432 50038 10666 99.9 1.318
-03.4 100 46.00 2742 2455 50836 10684 100.0 1.309
-02.9 101 46.20 2755 2478 51648 10702 100.0 1.299
-02.5 101 46.40 2768 2501 52474 10717 100.0 1.290
-02.1 102 46.60 2781 2524 53318 10732 100.0 1.281
-01.7 102 46.80 2794 2548 54177 10746 100.0 1.271 ! Near Maximum !
-01.3 103 47.00 2807 2571 55050 10759 100.0 1.262 ! Near Maximum !
-00.8 103 47.20 2819 2594 55943 10773 100.0 1.253 ! Near Maximum !
-00.4 103 47.40 2832 2618 56853 10786 100.0 1.244 ! Near Maximum !
+00.0 104 47.60 2845 2641 57778 10799 100.0 1.236 ! Near Maximum !
+00.4 104 47.80 2857 2665 58723 10812 100.0 1.227 ! Near Maximum !
+00.8 105 48.00 2870 2689 59681 10825 100.0 1.218 ! Near Maximum !
+01.3 105 48.20 2883 2712 60665 10837 100.0 1.209 ! Near Maximum !
+01.7 106 48.40 2895 2736 61666 10850 100.0 1.200 ! Near Maximum !
+02.1 106 48.60 2908 2760 62686 10862 100.0 1.192 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 104 47.60 2975 2888 73626 10268 100.0 1.130 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 104 47.60 2643 2279 45007 11092 97.0 1.376

 

[bowfishn]

Sorry double post I deleted it.

 

[SJB358]

Incredible speeds for the little 6.5 CM and 140's..

 

[andrewctillman]

Could you repeat the QL data for RL16 and the 147 at 2.8 ocl?
PS, shot the Tikka today at 1,000 w 140 bthp Hornady gunner ammo in 15 mph cross wind. Three groups, 8x8, 9x12 and 8x8. Good ammo for the money.

 

[bowfishn]

Could you repeat the QL data for RL16 and the 147 at 2.8 ocl?
PS, shot the Tikka today at 1,000 w 140 bthp Hornady gunner ammo in 15 mph cross wind. Three groups, 8x8, 9x12 and 8x8. Good ammo for the money.

Cartridge : 6.5 Creedmoor Hornady
Bullet : .264, 147, Hornady ELD-M 26333
Useable Case Capaci: 46.246 grain H2O = 3.003 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.800 inch = 71.12 mm
Barrel Length : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm
Powder : Alliant Reloder-16

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 0.481% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-04.8 95 39.60 2625 2249 50159 9203 100.0 1.338
-04.3 96 39.80 2637 2270 50936 9224 100.0 1.329
-03.8 96 40.00 2649 2290 51724 9245 100.0 1.319
-03.4 97 40.20 2661 2310 52524 9266 100.0 1.311
-02.9 97 40.40 2672 2331 53337 9287 100.0 1.302
-02.4 98 40.60 2684 2351 54161 9307 100.0 1.293 ! Near Maximum !
-01.9 98 40.80 2696 2372 54998 9328 100.0 1.284 ! Near Maximum !
-01.4 99 41.00 2708 2393 55848 9348 100.0 1.276 ! Near Maximum !
-01.0 99 41.20 2719 2413 56711 9368 100.0 1.267 ! Near Maximum !
-00.5 100 41.40 2731 2434 57587 9388 100.0 1.258 ! Near Maximum !
+00.0 100 41.60 2742 2455 58477 9408 100.0 1.250 ! Near Maximum !
+00.5 101 41.80 2754 2475 59380 9427 100.0 1.242 ! Near Maximum !
+01.0 101 42.00 2765 2496 60297 9447 100.0 1.233 ! Near Maximum !
+01.4 102 42.20 2777 2517 61228 9466 100.0 1.225 ! Near Maximum !
+01.9 102 42.40 2788 2538 62174 9485 100.0 1.217 ! Near Maximum !
+02.4 103 42.60 2800 2559 63134 9504 100.0 1.209 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 100 41.60 2835 2622 70784 9029 100.0 1.162 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 100 41.60 2600 2206 46582 9784 98.8 1.370