Boring 7MM Remington

[SJB358]

I agree Mike. We're I forced one rifle the 7mm Rem Mag is a GREAT one for me as well.

I really enjoy my 7mm Rem Mag Improved (7mm Mashburn Super Magnum) :lol:

Scotty, I read where P.O. Ackely had a hand in the design of both the 7mmRem and the 7mmMSM. :mrgreen:

I think the Mashburn was all all Art Mashburn and Les Bowman may have been a big push for the 7mm Rem after necking the 338 Win down.

Either way, it's a great cartridge no matter how it came to be and still does what it was made to do, recoils like a 30-06 and shoots flat like a 270 Winchester. Hard to argue with the ground it covers.

 

[truck driver]

Yeah it is sweet to shoot off a bench after shooting the 35AI but I don't think it will ever replace it unless it shots like my 257Bob.

 

[SJB358]

Most of them are pretty accurate with a decent combo. They do work well as range increases as well. Hard to beat a good 7 Mag.

 

[BF375]

I agree Mike. We're I forced one rifle the 7mm Rem Mag is a GREAT one for me as well.

I really enjoy my 7mm Rem Mag Improved (7mm Mashburn Super Magnum) :lol:

Scotty, I read where P.O. Ackely had a hand in the design of both the 7mmRem and the 7mmMSM. :mrgreen:

I think the Mashburn was all all Art Mashburn and Les Bowman may have been a big push for the 7mm Rem after necking the 338 Win down.

Either way, it's a great cartridge no matter how it came to be and still does what it was made to do, recoils like a 30-06 and shoots flat like a 270 Winchester. Hard to argue with the ground it covers.

It seems the Mashburn was indeed all Art Mashburn;from some letters I have seen it appears Mashburn and others were not thrilled with the free bore of the 7mm Weatherby. Art Mashburn designed three belted 7mm's but the one we call the "Super' was the most efficient. That's the one used by Warren Page and Bob Hagel, and the one some of us use today. It predated both the 7 Rem Mag and the 300 Win Mag. The case was originally formed by blowing out,necking down,and shortening 300 H&H brass.

When the 338 Win Mag was introduced, Les Bowman (and maybe some others) immediately started necking it down to 7mm,and Bowman had Fred Huntington (RCBS)chamber a rifle for the wildcat. The cartridge got thoroughly tested on Bowman's ranch near Cody and killed many deer, antelope, elk,moose, and grizzly. Bowman had difficult access to above timberline elk country called "Elk Heaven". He wanted a cartridge that would shoot flatter than a 270 or 30/06, yet kick less than the 300 Weatherby, for hunting the open country of elk heaven.

Bowman's load used a 160 Sierra at 3050 fps,and later a 160 Nosler Partition. Mike Walker of Remington came to Bowmans' ranch, loaded for the cartridge, and hunted with it. Remington liked it enough that they introduced it in 1962 with the new Rem 700.

You can read about all this in an older issue of American Rifleman with articles by Finn Aagard and Les Bowman.

I have never seen any reference to PO Ackley having anything to do with the development of either cartridge.

 

[preacher]

I never liked using Federal brass during my 7mm Rem load workups as they were just too soft for me. I liked Winchester the best, but my experience with the Remington is limited. back in the late 70's I used a lot of 4350 with 140-160 and tried H870, Norma MRP and H4831 with the 175. Last year or so, read where I played with a 26" bbl 7mm and I used R26 with the 160 and R33 with the 175. Between the lates 70s until then, I had played with the 7mm STW and the 7mm RUM more. Now I'm back full circle to my 7mm Express (280) 7mm Rem mag is very popular here in Utah!

 

[truck driver]

Lou check out ( http://www.ammoland.com/2011/08/think-d ... artridges/ )
Scroll down and you will read where Bowman approach Ackely about building a 7mm around the 338 Win.

 

[BF375]

As to who built the rifle for les Bowman, Im afraid Zeglin got it wrong; that is if you consider Les Bowman himself as a more reliable source....

Anent the February, 1986 issue of American Rifleman, article entitled "The 7mm Rem Mag" co authored by Finn AAgaard and Les Bowman; page 22.

To quote Bowman from the article: "......It was rumored that they (Winchester)were brining out a new,smaller caliber using the same case,and when I telephoned the factory I was told that it would be the 338 Win Mag and that it was ready for production. Winchester agreed to send me some unloaded cases for experimental work,but these would not be headstamped....."

Bowman then goes on to explain that he had two Rem 721 actions chambered for 280,and that he cannibalized one to get the action to go along with a magnum bolt he had.

To quote further: ".......Sending the action, bolt,and some dummy cases, made by necking down the 338 Winchester brass to 7mm and leaving the shoulder angle unchanged, to Fred Huntington at RCBS in Oroville, California, I asked him to install a 24"-long Pfieffer 7mm barrel with 10" twist that he had in stock. He agreed to chamber the rifle and make up a set of loading dies to fit the cases. We decided to call it the "280 Rem Mag"...."

"When Huntington finished his work he sent the unit to Carl Peterson in Sun Valley, California. Peterson made a stock from a beautiful piece of tortoise shell maple." Les Bowman; The 7 Rem Mag; American Rifleman, February, 1986,pg.24-25.

What Zeglin states about Mike Walker and Wayne Leek is correct per Bowman.

There is no mention in Bowman's article that Ackley played any part in the cartridge's development. Clearly Fred Huntington built the rifle.

Where Zeglin got that information I have no idea but it does not square at all with what Bowman said.

I could take photos of the article and post them but I do to believe we are supposed to do that...... You guys can dig up a copy of the article.

 

[truck driver]

As usual you can believe what you read and should take it with a grain of salt.

 

[BF375]

Truck Driver there is lots of dis-information out there..... :wink:


In any event it appears that Bowman, Leek,and Walker helped develop a winner. If restricted to one open country BG rifle and cartridge,for me the 7 Rem Mag would be the one.

If I didn't have a Mashburn that is......

 

[SJB358]

Same here. I have come full circle, started with a 7mm Rem when I was 14 and now I'm putting together what I think will be about as nice a mountain rifle I can in the 7mm MSM. Those old boys that worked with the fast 7's like Hagel, Keith (280 Dubiel), Page and others hit the nail on the head.

I could have been just as happy with a properly set up 7mm Rem as well. I just feel comfortable with the MSM now that I've worked with it for a few years.

In my eyes there isn't anything boring about what it does. :lol:

 

[jimbires]

I'm using a 160 AccuBond , 66.0 grains RL22 , win brass , Fed 215 primer . I think my rifle is a 9.25 twist . I've got a few rifles I'd get rid of before my 7 rem mag . I've shot whitetail , caribou , elk , and moose . I don't think there is much it won't handle .

 

[gerry]

Years ago we used RL 22 with 162 gr Hornady BTSP and H 1000 with 175 gr Speer G.S. bullets. The one I was playing with in the spring shot well with Hodgdon's max loads of IMR 7977 and IMR 4451 and the Hornady 154 gr Spire Point.

 

[SJB358]

I'm going to have to try some 7977 soon Gerry. It looks like it might be really good in the MSM as well. Maybe even my Swede with the heavier bullets as well.

 

[TXbaldhunter]

67.5grs of Reloader-22,150gr Nosler Ballistic Tip,WLRM primer,COL 3.290.This load works great in my four 7mags.It runs 3000-3100fps depending on which rifle.I've shot a few whitetails with it and they all dropped right there.

 

[preacher]

Many years ago I read an article by Mr Bowman about that. He said his clients didn't shoot/like the recoil of the 300 mags and the 264 winmag was a bit light in the britches for elk ( his opinion). They had a "honey hole" ( actually an above timberline bowl) they liked to hunt but the shots were always long. At the time, he said the Sierra 160 SBT was the best long range bullet in the 7mms and then he related how they ended up necking down the 338 winmag to 7mm. The goal was to try and find the easiest magnum with an elk capable bullet for his clients to shoot. I think that was his reasoning for not going with the Mashburn, etc. It was a long time ago and I forget where I read it so don't fret if I got something wrong, just saying.

 

[sask boy]

I had been loading 160gr. ABs since the AccuBond first came out and have had great success in the 2 rifle I load for my nephew's 7mm mag in the CDL and my hunting partner's Krico both have 26" barrels and shoot .5moa with 60grs. IMR4350 .

Blessings,
Dan

 

[brikwhitt]

Reloader 22 and the 160gn anything did a bang up job in the 7mm magnum I owned in the past. Flirted with H1000 for a while but couldnt get it to shoot quiet as well as R22.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

 

[truck driver]

As great as RL22 works I've read where it can have some sever velocity swings and is temp sensitive and you need to work up two loads, one for warm areas or seasons and one for fall and winter so the loads I work up now I wouldn't be able to use this summer for practice though I might work up two different loads and go for it if it's that accurate.
Wondering if RL23 would work since it is in the same burn range though a little different or RL26 which is said to give higher velocities.

 

[MAinAR]

Using RL26 in 26" tube. 71 grains gives 3,200fps with 140 AB. Accurate and fast, and does not have the big temperature swings witnessed with RL22. Temperature swings velocity on the average of .75 fps per degree for me.

This barrel has always been near a 100fps slow, have worked up to 3,200 fps in other 26" barrels that hit velocity at 68.5 - 69 grains. Work up .5 grain increments and chrony tell you where at.

 

[truck driver]

I'm thinking 3050fps with a 160gr bullet so the slower powders might be the ticket.