So i have a weatherby vanguard s1 in .270win I've had this gun for 8 years and bought it new. I first shot factory ammo with it until I started reloading. I've been shooting the 140grn accubonds @ 3000 fps for three years now. My best group being .378" 3 shots @ 100 yards. I've glass and pillar bedded the rifle. I've floated the barrel and replaced the trigger with a timney. optics are a leupold vxll 3-9x40. I sent the scope back last year and had the ballistics turret added and had the scope inspected. Sorry for the drag on but I figured I would give particulars first then tell the issues I'm having. I started shooting this year and my groups gave been really inconsistent. 1 shot right 1/2 inch then second shot left 4" then 3rd shot back to within .250" of the first shot?? I've retorqued action and scope to specs and went through my reload process and I can't find anything that's 'out'. I figure I have less than 800 rounds down the barrel. Any thoughts?
help
- Thread starter hhunter23
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DrMike
Ballistician
- Nov 8, 2006
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Without seeing the rifle and examining the loads, any suggestions are mere speculation. Since you checked the action screws and the ring screws, you've addressed the obvious. That means you begin the process of elimination. Try another scope. Despite the best efforts of great scope technicians, scopes do give up the ghost on occasion. Flex in the stock? Though it should not show significant throat erosion, such does happen. When it does, accuracy is degraded. Any time we shoot a load, it provides a pattern of accuracy. A single group, or even a couple of groups, may suggest but cannot demonstrate the accuracy potential of a load. You could be seeing the true accuracy potential of that particular load. Though most of us are content with a three-shot grouping, a ten-shot group will give you a greater degree of confidence in the load. Alternatively, three three-shot groups will tell you more about the accuracy potential of the load. Finally, it is always possible that the one shot that was so far out was a one-off. Such flyers do happen on occasion.
A
Anonymous
Guest
If the shots are shifting on a left/right line, I'd check your scope mount to action screws. Sounds like something shifting on the horizontal. Red field type mounts are typical culprits.
Scope might be suspect too. If you have a spare scope you might just install it and try again.
Scope might be suspect too. If you have a spare scope you might just install it and try again.
Yeah, good advise above. I would look first at loose mounts; or maybe something rattling around in the inletting (unburned powder, dirt, bedding material that may have broken off); nothing binding in the stock... magazine, trigger guard, maybe the barrels not actually floating; then move on to replacing the scope to see if it went wonky. If you have a way to check the concentricity of your loads, do that.
- Thread starter
- #5
I've been through the gun as far as mounts and bedding goes, everything looks good and snug. I've also checked torque on them. The barrel is floated so I can run a dollar bill to the action smoothly. I'm going to check scope on Monday by swapping scopes to see if its that. I'll try and check concentricity when I get to work as I am a machinist by career. My load is 58.7grains of H4831sc which is 3000 fps for my set up. Chronographed over a magnetospeed chrony. Am I pushing to much powder only being .7 over nosler book max??
DrMike
Ballistician
- Nov 8, 2006
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BK":22c7odnm said:
Ooooo! Mean post.
Funny, though. :grin:
Bruce Mc
Handloader
- Oct 26, 2005
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If it had been any caliber other than a .270 it would of shot first to the left and then right and back. After all, anything claimed by someone shooting a .270 is doubted and claimed to be the opposite. :grin:
I agree that its most likely a scope/scope mount issue.
I agree that its most likely a scope/scope mount issue.
- Nov 4, 2004
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The other possibility is a copper fouled barrel.
Maybe a good cleaning with a copper solvent might do the trick.
JD338
Maybe a good cleaning with a copper solvent might do the trick.
JD338
Dr. Vette
Handloader
- Apr 16, 2012
- 1,480
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I own 3 Vanguard S1s in 270 (yeah, really) and they are the most consistent performers I own.
Be sure the scope isn't shifting in the rings. I had this recently with a rifle, and shot it this past week after remounting the scope. Amazing how it is suddenly a sub-moa shooter.
If the rings and mounts check out, and swapping scopes doesn't help, be sure to check the pillars. Crazier things have happened than having a pillar loosen up, or bedding crack or break.
I would not think you've worn out the barrel. My first 270 Vanguard probably has that many rounds through it and continues to shoot very well.
Having said that, my first Weatherby Mark V was very accurate with factory Hornady ammo until a couple of years ago it suddenly started shooting all over. Swapping bases, rings, scopes did nothing. I've taken it apart and can't see any movement in the stock, though it is not bedded. This year it will get a new stock, bedding and a Zeiss scope as it's time for it to get back to work! It probably has under 200 rounds down it, so it's not worn out. However, I know where you're coming from when a known and proven rifle suddenly starts shooting poorly.
Add-on comment - I've had the left/right problem you describe when a scope's parallax was off. If all your hits are on the same horizontal be sure to move your head left to right and see how much the crosshairs are moving. You might find your answer.
Be sure the scope isn't shifting in the rings. I had this recently with a rifle, and shot it this past week after remounting the scope. Amazing how it is suddenly a sub-moa shooter.
If the rings and mounts check out, and swapping scopes doesn't help, be sure to check the pillars. Crazier things have happened than having a pillar loosen up, or bedding crack or break.
I would not think you've worn out the barrel. My first 270 Vanguard probably has that many rounds through it and continues to shoot very well.
Having said that, my first Weatherby Mark V was very accurate with factory Hornady ammo until a couple of years ago it suddenly started shooting all over. Swapping bases, rings, scopes did nothing. I've taken it apart and can't see any movement in the stock, though it is not bedded. This year it will get a new stock, bedding and a Zeiss scope as it's time for it to get back to work! It probably has under 200 rounds down it, so it's not worn out. However, I know where you're coming from when a known and proven rifle suddenly starts shooting poorly.
Add-on comment - I've had the left/right problem you describe when a scope's parallax was off. If all your hits are on the same horizontal be sure to move your head left to right and see how much the crosshairs are moving. You might find your answer.
- Thread starter
- #13
a little update on the rifle. i loaded some more bullets with a reduced load to see if there was a difference, there wasnt. i bought some factory ammo to see if it shot different. it didnt. i cleaned the copper out of the barrel and will shoot again to see if there was too much copper fouling in the barrel. if that doesnt work i have a spare scope ill throw on and see if the scope has been knocked off somehow.... its been a little frustrating but ive learned a lot too... hopefully i can figure something out quick, my bear hunt starts in two weeks! thanks for all the replies and thoughts!
- Nov 4, 2004
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What are you using for a rest? Is it the same as in the past?
JD338
JD338
- Thread starter
- #15
DrMike
Ballistician
- Nov 8, 2006
- 37,402
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Strange things happen when shooting off a Lead Sled. The lack of "give" on the sled frequently distorts and degrades the accuracy on many rifles. I would be inclined to get a good bag (or set of bags) to shoot from. It is highly likely that this will resolve your concerns.
- Oct 30, 2004
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OK You freefloated it? Because weatherbies (sans the Accumark and some Varminters) are pressure bedded!
- Thread starter
- #18
well when i bought the rifle 8 years ago i couldnt get it to shoot very well until i floated the barrel. since than its been half inch groups consistently until this year when i started getting fliers. maybe the vanguards need to be pressure bedded, or have some type of support on the barrel?? if thats the case than i have gotten lucky the whole time ive had it? maybe ill contact weatherby and ask about the pressure bedding?
- Oct 30, 2004
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Ask Scott SJB358 on here about Wbies and up pressure
Ridgerunner665
Handloader
- Oct 28, 2008
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Some rifles do like to be pressure bedded... Even some Remington's.... Especially the ones with long, thin barrels.
