How Much Rifle Do You Need?

[Idahotrophyhunter]

Heres my thoughts.....

Until recently I never had lots of money to spend on equipment so I always had lesser factory rifles and a decent $200.00 type scope and was able to hunt deer, elk, and antelope in Idaho just fine.

After finishing school, getting married, and starting to become finacially better off, never thought twice about going after the highest end stuff - I upgraded, but thats relative as my rifles were still factory rifles like rugers and remingtons, but I did upgrade my optics to VX3, Conquest, Viper levels. All seemed good in my world till last elk season....

...After 5 hard days of hunting I had an opportunity at a 5 point bull in the dark timber bout 15 mins after sundown - it was pretty dark...As I pulled the scope up (VX - 3) I found I could not see the elk well enough to shoot and lost an oppotunity. I will never let that happen again and that is the main reason I am currently looking to switch out the 1.5-5x VX3 on my 375 ruger with a Schmidt Bender Zenith 1.5-6x42....Do I really need a 2k scope??? In this case....yes...especially if it allows me the extra light gathering the leupold didn't.

 

[DrMike]

True words, there Trophyhunter. I had bare basics during the years my children were growing and we were eking out an existence here in Canada. I picked up a good Lee Enfield for $35 and that permitted me to hunt with a bit more rifle than I'd had before. Later, I performed a funeral for an elderly lady. Her grandson was so pleased with my service that he bought me a Model 94. As my finances improved, I was able to acquire a bit more gun. As opportunity presented itself to acquire better scopes, I did so. I'm pleased with what I have, but I don't know that I would be any better hunter without the years of necessity compelling me to get a little closer because I didn't have the reach that others had or because the scope didn't permit me to see as clearly as others did.

 

[alaska100]

Idahotrophyhunter

Thank you, I was beginning to feel like a red headed step child being one of the few that likes and recommends Schmidt and Bender LOL BTW, if you get it you will not regret it and will be able to see the elk 15 minutes after sundown. Obviously there are other brands that could also provide what your looking for, but I had to comment, as I seem to be in the minority when discussing S & B

 

[tjen]

If I could only have one big game rifle and heaven forbit that PLEASE.
It might be a 338federal in a bolt with a 21" barrel with two scopes and QD rings one a VX3 1.5-5 & VX3 2.5-8.

I tend to set requirements then look to see what cartridge, what rifle action, and what sights/scope fits these requirements. I do not like to sell any rifle and have only sold three guns in 39 years. Oh there is that budget thing too. Marketing dosen't effect me much if at all the last guns I bought at a record of one per year was, 336D-35rem, 700-358win, 687-28ga, 527-22hornet, 223rem-700, & 221rem-700.

My minimum battery could look like this and would have servered a life time if it was front loaded.
22 lr kimber (I am not sure if kimber was here in 1973)
222 rem 700
338 federal 700 (the 338fed wasn't)
20ga 686 PII
12ga 870 Camo mag (or 3 inch 870's)

As far as enough gun goes in my opinion deer cartridges start with the 250 savage thur the 45-70. I do not think you can have too much bullet but you can have too much velocity resualting in wasted meat and body parts liquidfied or in the next county which is not required to cleanly take game.

 

[Oldtrader3]

I do not know, maybe I have sticker shock. I remember buying my first new Chevrolet pickup (a 1966 V-8) for a little less than $1700, about what you would pay for a Weatherby Mark V Accumark now.

I just culled the rifles that I want out of the many that I have owned since the 1960's. Three of my rifles are newer than 5 years old, six rifles and two shotguns are more than 20 years in my safe of which a couple of these rifles are more than 40 years in my custody. If I had my way, I would have kept the best of the Pre-64 Winchester rifles that I had and lived with them through the infirmities of my old age but to each their own!

Idahotrophyhunter, I feel exactly the same way for the same reasons. Failures in the field drove many of my subsequent purchases. My serious business, hunting rifles now are all proven calibers which have Kahles, Zeiss or Swarovski scopes on them after having 3 or more mechanical scope failures in about 10 years, all with medium priced American or Japanese scopes.

 

[Tnhunter]

Interesting thread here. I'll say, right off, I disagree with most(?) who have answered thus far. If you want a quality, economical rifle, they DO exist. If you also want a quality piece of glass to top it with at a decent price, they exist also. (but NOT in any package deal out there!) The idea that I might not purchase a lower priced rifle for my needs, does not mean I'm a bad person. And, no matter what you tried to say, I think people who buy $$ guns came off looking like that in your thread.

If I had limited means (which I actually do, now!) I'd buy Marlin XL7 or a Ruger American and top it with a Burris FFII, Leupold VX1, or Nikon and feel pretty damn proud about that set-up, especially at the total cost of about $600. total. If you think that the advertising of nicer(?) rifles and the idea that some buy & use them is a problem, perhaps you should sit back and look at the motives for your post. I make no apologies for what I have. I worked very hard to have what I have. I also know that I wince every time I fill up my 8 yr old truck (just today! @ $3.07) and I do not ever hold any man who has more than me, in a lesser light.

 

[Oldtrader3]

Actually, my 4WD truck is almost 14 years old (end of next month) and I am retired but I have some nice guns and some cheap guns as well as similar scopes which stands to reason, since I have been shooting for over 50 years. Not sure exactly whose "their thread", you are referring to, OP or .....)?

Plus, you can get a pretty good setup for little money, if that is what you want. However, there is no shame in a little pride of ownership in what you hunt with after many years of doing without. Besides my two fully custom stocked rifles cost me less than a Weatherby Deluxe Mark V each and one was less than a grand! The rest are off-the-shelf rifles and some of them cost more than the Mauser Custom.

 

[Idahotrophyhunter]

Interesting thread here. I'll say, right off, I disagree with most(?) who have answered thus far. If you want a quality, economical rifle, they DO exist. If you also want a quality piece of glass to top it with at a decent price, they exist also. (but NOT in any package deal out there!) The idea that I might not purchase a lower priced rifle for my needs, does not mean I'm a bad person. And, no matter what you tried to say, I think people who buy $$ guns came off looking like that in your thread.

If I had limited means (which I actually do, now!) I'd buy Marlin XL7 or a Ruger American and top it with a Burris FFII, Leupold VX1, or Nikon and feel pretty damn proud about that set-up, especially at the total cost of about $600. total. If you think that the advertising of nicer(?) rifles and the idea that some buy & use them is a problem, perhaps you should sit back and look at the motives for your post. I make no apologies for what I have. I worked very hard to have what I have. I also know that I wince every time I fill up my 8 yr old truck (just today! @ $3.07) and I do not ever hold any man who has more than me, in a lesser light.

I drive a 2000 gmc 2500 hd...wish my truck was only 8 years old...lol I completely understand your point, yet the difference between say a $200 burris FFII and a $2k schmidt and bender may not seem worth the money 90 percent of the time, but I hunt public land elk that are wolf, grizzly, cougar chased, in roadless hell tangle black timber wildnerness in central idaho. That other 10% is pretty important to me.

 

[Ridgerunner665]

Speaking in terms of "hunting" rifles...it took me 25 years to get to the point where I thought I knew "exactly" what I wanted in a hunting rifle.

I've taken my fair share of game over the years and 99% of it was taken with a plain jane model 700 (ADL's, BDL's, Classics, model 7's...various calibers from 243 to 350 Rem Mag)

I've had many love affairs with several great calibers...25-06 way before it was well known like it is now, LOTS of 308 Win, a good bit of 350 Rem Mag too (I have a 600, a 660, and a 673)....but after all that, when I decided to build "my" hunting rifle....I did it around the 30-06 and the Model 70 instead of the 700.

Before now...I had never spent more than $600 on a hunting rifle...I have nearly $2,000 invested in my Model 70 and am completely happy with every aspect of it and I'm sure it will serve me well on the expensive hunts that I hope to one day get to experience.

Yeah....it takes a while to know what "YOU" want, regardless of peer pressure or "keeping up with the Jones's"...spending that kind of $$$ should be based on experience (your experience), not the opinions of some people on the internet.

You can see it on most any gun forum...trends starting because "somebody" said something...there is a lot of truth to be found by looking online, but most of it is not found by reading what others say...I think its easier to find by reading between the lines.

Never flat out ask for an opinion on a specific product...all you'll get is 30 posts from fanboys, 25 from haters...and a few that don't have a clue...and 99.9% of the time not a single one of those posts will be an unbiased opinion. (There are certain forums and people who are exceptions to this...but they are few and far between)

I tend to find what I'm looking for better by asking indirect questions, for example ( viewtopic.php?f=4&t=19846 )

When I started that thread I already knew what I wanted based on my own research...but having never owned a mechanical rest, I wanted to hear about them just in case I was missing something....I asked that on 3 different forums and got similar answers on all of them...everybody said get sandbags (which was my plan all along)...if a product doesn't have any fanboys at all...thats a definite "red flag".

The point...I didn't ask about bag rests, barely even mentioned them...but they are actually what I wanted to hear about :mrgreen:

What I didn't anticipate was so many people making their own bags...but thats another story.


All that is to say...many people online will defend their purchase, even if they really don't think its all that great....be careful of this.

And for the record...If I spend money on something that is "crap"...I'll say its crap, loudly and proudly :grin: ...the factory stock on my model 70 for example, or Lee bullet molds (and Ranch Dog is still an AWESOME dude), or new production Marlins and Remingtons...

 

[SJB358]

Heres my thoughts.....

Until recently I never had lots of money to spend on equipment so I always had lesser factory rifles and a decent $200.00 type scope and was able to hunt deer, elk, and antelope in Idaho just fine.

After finishing school, getting married, and starting to become finacially better off, never thought twice about going after the highest end stuff - I upgraded, but thats relative as my rifles were still factory rifles like rugers and remingtons, but I did upgrade my optics to VX3, Conquest, Viper levels. All seemed good in my world till last elk season....

...After 5 hard days of hunting I had an opportunity at a 5 point bull in the dark timber bout 15 mins after sundown - it was pretty dark...As I pulled the scope up (VX - 3) I found I could not see the elk well enough to shoot and lost an oppotunity. I will never let that happen again and that is the main reason I am currently looking to switch out the 1.5-5x VX3 on my 375 ruger with a Schmidt Bender Zenith 1.5-6x42....Do I really need a 2k scope??? In this case....yes...especially if it allows me the extra light gathering the leupold didn't.

IDH, you just described the same area that I love to elk hunt and you make 100% sense in what you said. I drive a long way, spending about that much in fuel, so having a scope that allows me to make that one shot, when it couldn't be made by something else, well, that is money well spent I think.

Ed, same here, I didn't have alot of extra's as a young Marine and got along fine with the 270WSM and 300WM. Matter of fact, they would both still work today. I sold the 300 to one of my best friends and still have the 270, it isn't going anywhere, matter of fact. I have pretty much settled on Model 70's and there are certain ones that really "do it" for me. I won't bad mouth others, at all, I think they all have good points to them. It is the pride I have of having what I consider, my battery. All this talk about hunting with ONE or TWO rifles!! HA! I will leave that alone.

It is too much fun for me to do the load work, build drop cards, see what works, etc. I like to shoot and if I shot ONE rifle that much.. Well, I think I would get bored..

 

[Guy Miner]

It is more about "want" than "need" I think.

Forty years ago I was hunting with a .22 Marlin 39, a .30-06 M1917, and a 20 gauge side by side. I still hunt with those guns, and could have done most of my hunting with them over the years, although a good 12 gauge has been much better for ducks and geese, particularly since the demise of lead shot.

That old .30-06 just keeps working. It's accurate. Reliable. Sufficiently powerful. With various loads, it's been used to hunt everything from ground squirrels to mulies, whitetail, bear and elk. I don't "need" any more rifle than that grand ol' relic from WWI.

Those other rifles in the safe are just "wants" - and that's okay by me.

Regards, Guy

 

[Guy Miner]

Oooops. My wife just read that post over my shoulder! :shock:

Good thing she doesn't have the safe combo or we might be having a rifle sale!!!!

 

[Guest]

All this talk about hunting with ONE or TWO rifles!! HA! I will leave that alone.

It is too much fun for me to do the load work, build drop cards, see what works, etc. I like to shoot and if I shot ONE rifle that much.. Well, I think I would get bored..

Scotty, I believe you and I are cut from the same cloth in this respect. My battery of rifles only lacks something in the "minimum caliber for Africa" category, and I don't really see that as a viable option right now. I've considered a 375 or larger, but every time I find myself thinking, "I'll get more justification and use, as well as cheaper components, from XYZ chambering..." (I know, that's almost heresy!) But up to now, smaller stuff has always prevailed and the urge to get a big bore hasn't caught me fully, yet. I do have an unexplained longing for a 9.3x62, though...

I generally buy rifles with a plan in mind in terms of the bullet weight range and setup I'd like to make from them, and how I'd use them in my own hunting situations. I even have a couple of rifles bought specifically for future hunts out west, so I guess my justification for a big bore just got easier, huh? :lol:

 

[Guy Miner]

A 9.3 or a .375 isn't much bigger than a .35 Whelen... Can almost justify for bear, elk and moose.

Don't pay any attention to those guys who just do it all with a good ol' 7mm or .30 cal... :grin:

 

[Guest]

Don't worry, Guy. I've got the virus, and if I had any cash, I'd be buying right this very minute. Saving up for hunting lease dues right now - priorities!

As for 35cal, I've been quiet about it, but I have an addition to the stable that covers that. Hope to post some results soon. Can't seem to find time to go to the range...

 

[bullet]

dubyam, I am looking forward to your surprise

 

[alaska100]

When my trip to Africa was given to me by my father, I ask A and another gentleman who lives in Argentina but was once a regular on a different forum before he became ill, for assistance. I had always had a keen interest in the 375 and 300 H & h calibers. Anyway during my correspondence with her, I found out her and her husband collect Holland and Holland rifles and that there was two 240s, 300s,375s,and 500s--one for double rifles and one for bolt rifles. plus a 244, 400, 465, 600, and 700. She suggested that I only buy the 300 and/or 375 however in the H & H.
I ask her if they had all of them and she said all but two and they are still looking for those two. I ask her why, and she said they just "want" a complete set of calibers H & H made over the years. I personally dont have a problem with that and I bet Dubyam would like a full set of Weatherbys ( if he dont have them already ) and Tom and Kelly would like a full set of Model 70 s, so to speak. Guns to some of us are like a priceless french painting to others. I also like what Scotty said, I like playing with different guns and loads. To each their own however and I dont judge anybody for their likes or dislikes

 

[Oldtrader3]

Sean, I would relly like having the .300 and .375 Ouch & Ouch's back but I have a .338 Federal and a .340 Bee and that gives me, practically speaking everything that I will ever need for my hunting in North America. Despite the up and down variation of the gun safe population over the past 40 years, I still have at least two calibers each, in three groupings, small, standard and medium bore, to cover any practical needs which I have in the field for any hunting that I may do.

I sold the .375 H&H because I did not use it for hunting. The reality is, that during most of my working life, I usually worked 60hours+travel each week and flew overseas during the weekend and back home on a minimum of two weekends a month.

My hunting was pretty much summed up to a couple weekends and one 5-6 day hunt every day. I regret now that I did not take more time to enjoy life but the expectations of the job came first and there was not much that I could change. Obligations are obligations. By the time that changed, I was over 55 and had severe health issues like many men do.

 

[Tnhunter]

All this talk about hunting with ONE or TWO rifles!! HA! I will leave that alone.

It is too much fun for me to do the load work, build drop cards, see what works, etc. I like to shoot and if I shot ONE rifle that much.. Well, I think I would get bored..

Scotty, I believe you and I are cut from the same cloth in this respect. My battery of rifles only lacks something in the "minimum caliber for Africa" category, and I don't really see that as a viable option right now. I've considered a 375 or larger, but every time I find myself thinking, "I'll get more justification and use, as well as cheaper components, from XYZ chambering..." (I know, that's almost heresy!) But up to now, smaller stuff has always prevailed and the urge to get a big bore hasn't caught me fully, yet. I do have an unexplained longing for a 9.3x62, though...

I generally buy rifles with a plan in mind in terms of the bullet weight range and setup I'd like to make from them, and how I'd use them in my own hunting situations. I even have a couple of rifles bought specifically for future hunts out west, so I guess my justification for a big bore just got easier, huh? :lol:

Although I do not have a lot of experience with the 9.3x62, I found myself having an uncontrollable urge to get one, even already owning two Whelens. They are very close, but still a good bit different. The 9.3x62 was designed (of course) to be a poor man's .375 H&H and it has always had loads pushing heavy bullets of 285gr up to and over 300gr available. I only used my CZ 550 FS so chambered on one deer during it's tenure with me, but I sure grew to enjoy that emphatic push generated when the trigger was pulled pushing one of those 285gr missiles out the muzzle.

Sadly, that CZ/9.3 is now gone, being a casualty caused by my fullfilling my personal goal to own a nice double rifle. The good news is that the 9.3x74R I bought is pretty much a ballistic equal to the slightly newer, shorter 9.3x62 and the rifle mine is housed in is as pleasing to my eye as the pretty CZ FS rifle that moved out.

I am quite sure that should you take the leap to 9.3 land, you will enjoy the ride, even with .35s already inhouse! :mrgreen:

 

[alaska100]

Sean, I would relly like having the .300 and .375 Ouch & Ouch's back but I have a .338 Federal and a .340 Bee and that gives me, practically speaking everything that I will ever need for my hunting in North America. Despite the up and down variation of the gun safe population over the past 40 years, I still have at least two calibers each, in three groupings, small, standard and medium bore, to cover any practical needs which I have in the field for any hunting that I may do.

I sold the .375 H&H because I did not use it for hunting. The reality is, that during most of my working life, I usually worked 60hours+travel each week and flew overseas during the weekend and back home on a minimum of two weekends a month.

My hunting was pretty much summed up to a couple weekends and one 5-6 day hunt every day. I regret now that I did not take more time to enjoy life but the expectations of the job came first and there was not much that I could change. Obligations are obligations. By the time that changed, I was over 55 and had severe health issues like many men do.

Charlie, what you have done with your life, a successful career, and a good provider for your family is what we all strive for. I hope when i look back I can say I had and have the guns you have had and still have and have accomplished what you have in your lifetime charlie. you did well sir, very well and god willing you have many more years ahead of you