Impact Energy

[Guy Miner]

All this talk of 4,000 ft lbs of energy with .35 cal 225 grain Partitions and unmatched "Impact Energy" on deer... Does bring a wry smile of amusement to my face...

Now my deer hunting has been mostly mule deer. I rarely seek out the white tail. So perhaps the white tail is vastly more tenacious of life... I do think they're pretty tough critters.

But... No matter what ya hit 'em with... 3,000, 4,000, 5,000 ft lbs of energy and a .35, 37, or .45 cal bullet of 200, 300 or 400 grains... :mrgreen:

Ya just can't beat INSTANT - which is exactly what I've seen for drops of most deer, mule deer or whitetail, and mostly with .24 or .25 cal rifle cartridges and bullets from 95 to 115 grains.

And not much meat damage either. Bullet construction and shot placement being the key there I'd suspect.

Not downplaying the wonderous .35 Whelen, 225 grain, 4,000 ft lb of energy load - it's a GREAT load! But for deer? Nothing wrong with it, but no, you can't beat INSTANT drop & death. Not even with an 8" howitzer.

TD, this is why I was chuckling a little when you were wondering if your 225 gr Partition with 4,000 ft lbs of energy was enough for elk... OH MY GOODNESS YES! It's more than enough for any elk that ever walked the earth! Let alone a poor shell-shocked deer... :wink:

You've got a flippin' cannon there, much like my .375 H&H with the 260 gr AccuBond... It's a LOT of rifle for most game.

Grinning here, wryly.

Guy

 

[truck driver]

Guy, I had planned on using the 200gr AB Nosler load I had worked but when the 225gr PT load developed so quickly I didn't want to change anything with the rifle and didn't have any 200gr loads worked up to compare the POI with.
And yes it is hilarious for me to think the 225gr PT load wasn't enough for Elk since I have read how hard they are to keep down and was wondering if I need to go to the 250gr PT. :grin:
Yep I've killed White Tail Deer with a lot less gun with the proper bullet placement. My 257 Roberts would have killed the deer very easily as would my 30-06 but wouldn't have taken that particular shot and even second guessed it with the 35/AI not knowing what to expect. So when I saw what it was capable of doing after the fact I was just astonished with what I saw, probably how you must have felt the first time you killed something with your 375 H&H. :wink: You just have to love it.
Too much gun heck yeah but I'll use it again because I can. :lol:
And it will go with me to Montana next fall with that same load unless something should happen between now and then. :mrgreen:

 

[Guy Miner]

Enjoy!

 

[Dwh7271]

I've seen for drops of most deer, mule deer or whitetail, and mostly with .24 or .25 cal rifle cartridges and bullets from 95 to 115 grains.

I have to agree completely with Guy.
I used a 6mm Rem exclusively on deer for 5-6 years (I was a starving student for 4 of them :grin: )and never had to track a wounded deer. It was like they were electrocuted. 90 and 100 gr bullets. Bang flop.

 

[fwood]

Well this year we have done some shooting at my house, we killed two elk and 1 deer. We used 3 different rifles and 3 different calibers. The first elk succumbed to a 338 rum 250g NPT at 500+ yards I shot him he stayed up and took 3 more before falling over. the second elk my wife shot at 375 ish yards with a 270 win two times threw the heart and lungs with a 130g NPT. The last was a great mule deer that the kid shot at about 100 yards with a 260 rem and a 100g NBT and it was a bang flop, one and done. SO I will admit that my marksmanship in the 20mph wind was a little lacking and the elk at 500 was giving me fits when the rum barks things usually die instantly. the other two animals were shot perfectly and died quickly. Now the holes from the rum were impressive but ruined a bit of meat. The bottom line is hit them in the right spot the first time and all you need is a any rifle you shoot well, but I love the 338 rum.

 

[tjen]

Three DRT's not an inch! BUT down!

Two tight to the leg broad side shots, no bone on one with exit. One hit the shoulder blade at exit and bullet was just under the skin. Third hit back bone broad side took out three or four vertebra with it on exit. These were just 200gr PSP-CL's. The 35 Whelen is awesome. A .358 bullet at +2600 fps is devastating heck the 200 gr CLRN in the 35 REM loaded to 2200 fps is too. Heart shot game that DRT or moved 30 yards and down.

You do not need 3000 MV to DRT game, that's what is nice about medium bore cartridges on game energy transfer and you can eat right to the bullet hole. And you have found that a 225gr bullet likes to keep its velocity. They may not start out fast but they do not slow down as fast either. But it sounds like yours is moving out at a great clip! An actual impact velocity of 2400 fps of a .358 is awesome and it has momentum too, they like to penetrate. Imagine what a 250gr PT will do to an elk/moose? A quote " the 35 whelen takes over where the 30-06 leaves off on large game like elk/moose". Read that a reloading manual.

 

[c. schutte]

It's threads like this that made me want a 35 Whelen! Had an old rifle that some backyard-idiot smith screwed up that landed in the family years ago. For the longest time I thought I would make it a 35 Whelen but, decided on a slightly different direction; 9.3x64. I can't brag that I am in the whelen club. However, the effects are the same.

That Brenneke likes a 250 grain AB at 2750 fps and will absolutely turn the lights out on deer before they hit the ground. Making plans to introduce it to a bull elk in two years.

Something about having a big foot print bullet wise that really hits hard.

 

[Europe]

charles, you certainly dont lose anything with the 9.3 x 64. As you know the 9.3 x 62 is comparable to the Whelen, but the 9.3 x 64 is comparable to the 375 H & H,and that is not all bad. You can hunt grizzly, moose, elk, and both plains game in Africa as well as that Cape Buffalo you want when you get there with that old girl. The old 9.3 x 64 is a classic on the dark continent.

But you can still get a Whelen someday, it would not be a bad thing to have both lol

Rodger, what enticed you to AI yours ?

 

[DrMike]

Well, now, April, I just so happen to have both a 35 Whelen and a 9.3X64. The only thing I've shot with the 9.3X64 is a whitetail buck. He disappeared so fast at the shot that I thought he had managed some sort of leap into hyperspace as I came out of battery. The Whelen isn't bad either. If the Whelen is just something better than a 30-06, then the Brenneke is just more of a better thing when compared to the Whelen. However, as has been pointed out, for most NA game, all these cartridges work wonderfully well. It is just so much fun to use different cartridges for the hunt. I believe it is Fotis who commented that some people own a rifle in order to hunt, and others hunt in order to own rifles--lots of rifles. Yeah, I fall into the latter category.

 

[truck driver]

charles, you certainly dont lose anything with the 9.3 x 64. As you know the 9.3 x 62 is comparable to the Whelen, but the 9.3 x 64 is comparable to the 375 H & H,and that is not all bad. You can hunt grizzly, moose, elk, and both plains game in Africa as well as that Cape Buffalo you want when you get there with that old girl. The old 9.3 x 64 is a classic on the dark continent.

But you can still get a Whelen someday, it would not be a bad thing to have both lol

Rodger, what enticed you to AI yours ?

April, I had bought a donor M70 in 30-06 with the intention of rebarreling it to 35Whelen when a member here made a M700 Classic available in 35Whelen and I bought it. Fotis sold me my first Chronograph I wasn't happy with the velocities the M700 22" barrel was giving. People here were having JES rebore rifles and were having good success with his work. So I sent the M70 off to be rebored and chambered and figured why not go for the AI chamber since I had read a lot about Ackley and what he achieved by improving the original cartridge. I wasn't looking for magnum velocities over the original but I saw where I could get more velocity with less pressure signs and longer life from my brass.
My 35/AI does have a 24" barrel and naturally there would have been an increase in velocity even with the standard chamber but what I got was a more efficient cartridge that uses the extra case capacity more efficiently IMO.
There will be those who say the extra velocity comes from higher pressure and I do run it at 60kpsi compared to 58kpsi and all of my load data is based off of 62kpsi max so even though I could run it hotter and faster I don't since I really don't need or want it, I'm very happy with what it will do with what I have worked up for it. :grin:

I take Guy's remarks earlier as a compliment for the 35Whelen/AI
To be honest I really didn't know what I had with this cartridge.