Pet loads: 45-70 modern

[roysclockgun]

I am shooting a recently made Win. Mod. 1885 falling block rifle, in 45-70. Looking for better loads. However, I would like to stick with propellent that I have on hand, given the recent rise in prices.
Primers: Large Rifle; Win. FC or CCI
Cases Win. and FC
Bullet: Berry 350gr. RS.
Don't need high MV, as I only am killing paper targets at 100 yds.
The 1885 has a tang mounted peep sight.
Propellents on hand: IMR4064,4198, 4350 and H380.
Where to begin?
Thank you,
Steven

 

[jmad_81]

I'm by no means a 45-70 expert, but I think that all of the listed powders might be a bit slow for the 45-70. I'm using Ramshot exterminator. I know a bunch of guys use RL-7 as well. I think the 45-70 needs the faster powders.

Somebody with a bit more knowledge will be along here shortly to help you out a bit more. There are a few 45-70 shooters here.

 

[wayno945]

I use H4198 for my 45-70. I would try your batch of 4198 first.

 

[Guy Miner]

I used H4198 with good accuracy and velocity over 2000 fps with the 350 gr Hornady & Swift bullets.

It's not a mild-kicking load.

H4198 can be loaded down quite a bit too, to trapdoor level loads, if desired.

 

[PJGunner]

I'll go wth the H4198 as well. A good source of information on the three load levels for the 45-70 is Ken Waters book Pet Loads. If your rifle has the old syle curved butt plate, you might not want to shoot the Ruger #1 level loads even if you gun can take the pressures. They smart just a touch even in the Ruger.
My favorite load that I used in the Ruger #1 and an 1895 Marlin was 17.0 gr. of SR4759 nd the Lyman #457122 bullet a 330 gr. hollow point that was quite accurate in both rifles. Never bothered to Chrony the load but it made decent groups from both rifles, 1.5" in the Marlin with receiver sight and 1.0" in the Ruger with a 2.5X old El Paso Weaver scope. Not bad for a fun gun load.
Paul B.

 

[bobnob]

Try about 42-45g of 4198 with your 350g bullet for a target load.

 

[wayno945]

Try about 42-45g of 4198 with your 350g bullet for a target load.

+1.. I started experiencing unpleasant recoil around the 47-48 gr range with 350 lazercast bullets in my 1895 guide gun. 42-45 should be fairly light in terms of recoil.

 

[JD338]

Try about 42-45g of 4198 with your 350g bullet for a target load.

For target shooting, this load is about as good as it gets.

JD338

 

[SJB358]

4198 has been a good powder for me from 300-425 grain bullets in my Guide Rifle. Stay on the load end and it'll be much more fun to shoot.

 

[Oldtrader3]

I used both 4198 and IMR 3031 in the .45-70.

 

[onesonek]

Try about 42-45g of 4198 with your 350g bullet for a target load.

For target shooting, this load is about as good as it gets.

JD338

+1

 

[roysclockgun]

I range tested a number of loads in the falling block 45-70 new model Win. 1885. This 125th Comm. rifle comes with a good recoil pad. It seemed that all I got from loads heavier than 42gr. of IMR4198, using the Berry 350gr. bullet, was a harder thump from recoil. 42gr. to 44gr. was very manageable, but accuracy was very close to being the same when I began with 42gr. and worked through 43gr., 44gr. and 45gr.
Question: Am I entering dangerous waters by reducing the IMR4198 load below 42gr., going at 2 tenths of grain increments? The county range only goes out to 100 yards, so punching paper at that range does not take much in the way of propellant. Shooting standing was very pleasant and of course, felt recoil was reduced from what I felt sitting at the bench.
Most pigs in FL are shot well within 100 yards, so if I am able to hit consistently at 100 yds. I may take the 45-70 to slay pigs. Only drawback I see is that many larger pigs move at or after dusk, so the peep sight will not light up the target as a scope would do.
Least pig I shot with my 280Rem. was walking at 95 yards. Light was rapidly failing but the scope lit him up!
Steve in DeLand, FL

 

[DrMike]

I range tested a number of loads in the falling block 45-70 new model Win. 1885. This 125th Comm. rifle comes with a good recoil pad. It seemed that all I got from loads heavier than 42gr. of IMR4198, using the Berry 350gr. bullet, was a harder thump from recoil. 42gr. to 44gr. was very manageable, but accuracy was very close to being the same when I began with 42gr. and worked through 43gr., 44gr. and 45gr.
Question: Am I entering dangerous waters by reducing the IMR4198 load below 42gr., going at 2 tenths of grain increments? The county range only goes out to 100 yards, so punching paper at that range does not take much in the way of propellant. Shooting standing was very pleasant and of course, felt recoil was reduced from what I felt sitting at the bench.
Most pigs in FL are shot well within 100 yards, so if I am able to hit consistently at 100 yds. I may take the 45-70 to slay pigs. Only drawback I see is that many larger pigs move at or after dusk, so the peep sight will not light up the target as a scope would do.
Least pig I shot with my 280Rem. was walking at 95 yards. Light was rapidly failing but the scope lit him up!
Steve in DeLand, FL

I hear you on the need for glass, Steve. For me, this is especially true as the light fades anymore. Your suggestion to reduce the charge is interesting. At 41 grains, you still have a 79% fill ratio with IMR4198. Even at a charge of 39.5 grains, your fill ratio is 76%. I would be willing to try it, watching, of course, for indications of problems as I worked down. I wonder if another powder might not serve you better, however.

 

[roysclockgun]

Dr. Mike, thanks for that response. I will work down with the IMR4198 that I have on hand (2 lbs.). I really wanted to use IMR4350, as a friend who no longer hand loads gave me a 20 lb. can, unopened! However 4350 does not appear to be good with 45-70 and at this point, with prices so high, I would prefer to work with what I have on hand. Maybe after shooting up the 4198, I will have to spring for 8lb. of another propellant.
The IMR4350 however, is working well in a number of other calibers and I am rapidly going through it during my range work.
I put the tang sight on the 45-70, but 71 year old eyes do not do well when using iron sights. I am blessed to still be able to hold 2" groups with the 45-70, using the peep sight.
Same goes for the two military 30-40 Krags that I am playing with. I have no idea of ever using them on game, but I enjoy punching paper with them too.
At our Volusia County, FL range, except right before hunting season, the AR type rifles outnumber everything else, probably 4 to 1. Many of the AR youngsters walk over to my bench and ask something like: "What the heck is that!" Many of them do even recognize and M1 Rifle these days. I am a dinosaur!! <8^))
Best,
Steven

 

[DrMike]

I understand. It is wise to use what we have if we can. You are correct that IMR 4350 is pretty slow for the 45-70.

 

[bobnob]

Roysclockgun,

FWIW Hodgdon lists as low as 28g of H4198 under a 385g lead bullet, and 31g of the IMR4198 version. I would not have a problem going a little lower on the charge weights with your 350g bullets.

Your rifle has a real "swoon factor" for me. Would love to see some pictures of it.

- Bob