wisconsinteacher
Handloader
- Dec 2, 2010
- 1,980
- 295
How do you go about picking a bullet weight? I am thinking about my 06. I would shoot 150-165-180 bullets out of it for deer. How do you pick the correct one to start with?
Picking a bullet weight?
- Thread starter wisconsinteacher
- Start date
- Oct 30, 2004
- 24,505
- 3,715
It is no secret that I have always been a fan of the one gun one load theory. Makes life easier, easier on th pocket due to limited components and let us not forget tha familiarity aspect if you only use that load.
For the 30-306 I always choose the 180 in conventional format and 165-168 in Premiums. A 168 E-tip or TTSX at 3000 fps is all you will ever need for any NA Game.
Or you can load a 180 AB or Partition at 2750 for everything also.
For the 30-306 I always choose the 180 in conventional format and 165-168 in Premiums. A 168 E-tip or TTSX at 3000 fps is all you will ever need for any NA Game.
Or you can load a 180 AB or Partition at 2750 for everything also.
DrMike
Ballistician
- Nov 8, 2006
- 37,612
- 6,817
I agree with Fotis that one gun/one load is a wise policy. It saves a lot of embarrassment in the field. In response to your immediate question, I weigh the purpose of the rifle. Will it be primarily punching paper? Will it be primarily for hunting? What game, if it is primarily for hunting? I would perhaps opt for a different bullet were I hunting grizzly than if I were hunting coyotes. The larger the game, or the more potentially dangerous, the more I'd lean toward a premium bullet. In other words, is penetration or expansion more important at impact velocities. I'd also consider impact velocities. I opt for the most comprehensive bullet after weighing the data. In general, for my personal rifles, I choose a premium bullet primarily because I never know when I will require premium bullet performance. If there is a reasonable possibility that game will be encountered at close range and the rifle shoots at higher velocities, I'll opt for an E-Tip, AccuBond or Partition rather than a Ballistic Tip. This gives me the option of high velocity impact with reasonable prospect of retained weight. For customers, many are opting for a premium cup and core bullet because they are focused on long range shooting. I do caution them against trying to drop a moose or a grizzly at close range with magnum rifles and these particular bullets.
G
Guest
Guest
I'm with Dr. Mike and POP in that I usually like one load per gun, for simplicity. That way, I can keep one drop chart per rifle, too.
As for what bullet, I look at the purpose of the rifle. I am going through this with a 30-06 myself right now, and so far the (hopeful) winner is the 168gr Nosler Ballistic Tip. With the 24" barrel on my gun, I'll be launching it at around 2950fps or so (again, if all goes well in testing...) so the BT's construction is stout enough for what I'm going to be doing. I will have to discipline myself a little bit to shoot ribs instead of shoulder, but again, for what I'm using this gun for, it's the best compromise. This gun is a lightweight rifle (Colt Light Rifle) and will be used primarily for spot and stalk hunting on the top of the mountain at my lease, and for when I decide to drop off the top and climb down to the benches for either treestand hunting or spot and stalk. For stand hunting on top, I've got other rifles in mind. And I'll have my 270Wby for some of the spot and stalk on top, as I want the long, flat trajectory it offers when shots could be 400+.
How did I decide on this bullet? Well, I figured I'd be after white-tails only, with the occasional nuisance coyote when opportunity presents itself, and I knew velocity would not be extreme. That meant a traditional lead core bullet would work. (Higher velocity or tougher game would move me into bonded/Partition/monolith territory.) So, then I look at the "best" bullet weight for what I want, which in my case is the 165/168gr in .308cal. Why? Because I think it offers the best compromise between velocity, trajectory, and energy for the game in question. This is a bit subjective, as 150's or 180's would do, but I like a little more oomph that the 168's can provide versus the 150's, and the extra velocity makes for a better trajectory than the 180's. I will also be testing some 150gr Hornady Spire Points (flat based bullets) and some 125gr BT's over reduced loads that my son may shoot in this rifle. If none of these work, I'll likely go after a 165gr Hornady SST and Nosler Partition, and then on to the AccuBond. If I can't get any of those to shoot, I'll move to either selling the rifle or changing the barrel. I doubt I'll get past the first phase of the process. I have an inclination that the 168gr BT is going to be pretty nice out of this rifle. A gut feeling, but based on a lot of prior experience, both mine and borrowed.
I hope that's been helpful. I will say that if I lived in northern climates where deer are maybe pushing 200lbs (instead of 150lbs as a norm), I'd consider moving to the 180gr bullet. I shoot 180gr BT's out of my 8x57 (just about a ballistic twin to the -06). They run around 2700fps in my rifle, and accuracy is good.
As for what bullet, I look at the purpose of the rifle. I am going through this with a 30-06 myself right now, and so far the (hopeful) winner is the 168gr Nosler Ballistic Tip. With the 24" barrel on my gun, I'll be launching it at around 2950fps or so (again, if all goes well in testing...) so the BT's construction is stout enough for what I'm going to be doing. I will have to discipline myself a little bit to shoot ribs instead of shoulder, but again, for what I'm using this gun for, it's the best compromise. This gun is a lightweight rifle (Colt Light Rifle) and will be used primarily for spot and stalk hunting on the top of the mountain at my lease, and for when I decide to drop off the top and climb down to the benches for either treestand hunting or spot and stalk. For stand hunting on top, I've got other rifles in mind. And I'll have my 270Wby for some of the spot and stalk on top, as I want the long, flat trajectory it offers when shots could be 400+.
How did I decide on this bullet? Well, I figured I'd be after white-tails only, with the occasional nuisance coyote when opportunity presents itself, and I knew velocity would not be extreme. That meant a traditional lead core bullet would work. (Higher velocity or tougher game would move me into bonded/Partition/monolith territory.) So, then I look at the "best" bullet weight for what I want, which in my case is the 165/168gr in .308cal. Why? Because I think it offers the best compromise between velocity, trajectory, and energy for the game in question. This is a bit subjective, as 150's or 180's would do, but I like a little more oomph that the 168's can provide versus the 150's, and the extra velocity makes for a better trajectory than the 180's. I will also be testing some 150gr Hornady Spire Points (flat based bullets) and some 125gr BT's over reduced loads that my son may shoot in this rifle. If none of these work, I'll likely go after a 165gr Hornady SST and Nosler Partition, and then on to the AccuBond. If I can't get any of those to shoot, I'll move to either selling the rifle or changing the barrel. I doubt I'll get past the first phase of the process. I have an inclination that the 168gr BT is going to be pretty nice out of this rifle. A gut feeling, but based on a lot of prior experience, both mine and borrowed.
I hope that's been helpful. I will say that if I lived in northern climates where deer are maybe pushing 200lbs (instead of 150lbs as a norm), I'd consider moving to the 180gr bullet. I shoot 180gr BT's out of my 8x57 (just about a ballistic twin to the -06). They run around 2700fps in my rifle, and accuracy is good.
- Nov 4, 2004
- 25,738
- 10,172
I also suscribe to the 1 load gun idea as it makes everything simple.
As a general rule of thumb, light bullets for light game, mid weight bullets for medium game and heavy bullets for everything.
In your 30-06, the 165 gr is a good weight for deer. I would lean towards the 165 gr AB for this applicaation. The 180 gr AB will do almost anything you would want to hunt with the 30-06. The higher BC of the 180 gr AB will give you more retained speed and energy down range.
IMHO, the magic bullet for the 30-06 is the 180 gr PT, it will cover everything from mice to moose.
JD338
As a general rule of thumb, light bullets for light game, mid weight bullets for medium game and heavy bullets for everything.
In your 30-06, the 165 gr is a good weight for deer. I would lean towards the 165 gr AB for this applicaation. The 180 gr AB will do almost anything you would want to hunt with the 30-06. The higher BC of the 180 gr AB will give you more retained speed and energy down range.
IMHO, the magic bullet for the 30-06 is the 180 gr PT, it will cover everything from mice to moose.
JD338
JD338":1g7rkgp3 said:
I am pretty much a one load/one rifle guy. I do have two loads for the 270WSM and a couple others. One load is a BT type bullet and the other is a PT load. Gives me the ability to hunt deer with one load and up to elk/moose with the other. I am known to try a few different bullets as I want to though. I always try to have one proven load for each rifle though, and most of the time it is a heavier for caliber PT in the cartridge. Scotty
I agree with Jim, it doesn't get any better than a 180gr PT in the 30-06. Just an all time favorite of my old man and works great from deer to moose. I know if I had a 30-35 Whelen, that would probably be my first load worked up.
- Thread starter
- #7
wisconsinteacher
Handloader
- Dec 2, 2010
- 1,980
- 295
Well I guess I should give the 180 AB a try if the 165 AB don't group any better then 1.5" groups.
HeathSexton
Handloader
- May 12, 2006
- 1,209
- 41
If I'm not running it at 3000fps I look at the NBT 1st because of the accuracy and I use the heaviest I can get. I shoot 180 NBT's @ 2737fps from my /06's. Looking at the sectioned bullets and now that the NBT's have thicker jackets the 180 NBT from a 30-06 seems good. I don't need the AccuBond/Premium bullets with these velocities.
I shot a nice 9pt last season some over 100yds through both shoulders with the 180NBT and it blew straight out both shoulders and kept on trucking.
I shot a nice 9pt last season some over 100yds through both shoulders with the 180NBT and it blew straight out both shoulders and kept on trucking.
- Nov 4, 2004
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wisconsinteacher":1o51yrvj said:
You can also use the 180 gr BT in lieu of the 180 gr AB. It is not a bonbed bullet so it will cost less.
JD338
DrMike
Ballistician
- Nov 8, 2006
- 37,612
- 6,817
And, at the velocities generated with the 30-06, you'll get excellent performance with the BT.
I am like the rest; I try for one load per rifle.
Of course I'm a handloading custom rifle crank, so tinkering is irresistible. I have an '06 I've been loading for since I started handloading and I still constantly try new stuff. I have narrowed things down w/ that rifle, however. It prefers 165s & 168s, so I run SSTs & NBTs in those weights, respectively.
If your '06 won't give MOA accuracy from a 165 or 180 gr NBT or SST sell it. Both of those bullets shoot extraordinarily well and the 180 NBT has a thick enough jacket that, short of big bears in Alaska, it'll do nicely for anything in North America.
Good luck; I look forward to hearing your results!
Of course I'm a handloading custom rifle crank, so tinkering is irresistible. I have an '06 I've been loading for since I started handloading and I still constantly try new stuff. I have narrowed things down w/ that rifle, however. It prefers 165s & 168s, so I run SSTs & NBTs in those weights, respectively.
If your '06 won't give MOA accuracy from a 165 or 180 gr NBT or SST sell it. Both of those bullets shoot extraordinarily well and the 180 NBT has a thick enough jacket that, short of big bears in Alaska, it'll do nicely for anything in North America.
Good luck; I look forward to hearing your results!
Well I'm a recent convert to the one load for one gun policy. I like to shoot mid weight for caliber bullets. 140 BT/AB out of the 280 AI, 225 AB out of the 338 WM. I find that they give me a perfect combo of speed and power.
If I was you, and was hunting deer, I would really think about the 150 or 165 AB.
If I was you, and was hunting deer, I would really think about the 150 or 165 AB.
I pick a bullet suitable for the heaviest thing I envision shooting with that particular gun... trophy elk, should I draw a tag; spike/cow elk; deer; 'yotes; or vermin. They usually end up towards the heavier end of the weight range. However, I find myself with quite the assortment of .30 calibers, so I may adjust thing a bit. I used to think loading 180s in the .30-06 was the thing to do, but since I now have a Weatherby, a Winchester, a WSM, an '06, a Savage, and a .30-30, I might drop down to a 165.
I'm also in the 1 load per rifle set up camp. When in doubt,,, (that don't happen often), the Nosler Partition is my go to choice. I have hunted and experimented with others, but I seem to always come back to NP's. I have yet to find a rifle that wouldn't give acceptable to exceptional accuracy with them. And in the 30-06, the 180 gr. is very practical for an "all around" weight.
Greg Nolan
Handloader
- Nov 25, 2004
- 2,144
- 20
As boring as this may sound I simply agree with all the afore-mentioned. BUT, I believe the AccuBond to be the ultimate all around bullet. It you buy Nosler seconds at about $15 a box when they have them you will be able to shoot the good stuff all the time. As a note, in my 300RUM at least the 180gr. 2nds shoot a full half inch better group at 200 yards than the 1sts. I go down one weight if I load TSXs because the end result will weigh the same and penetration is not a worry.
Greg
Greg
filmjunkie4ever
Handloader
- May 4, 2011
- 2,047
- 1,633
I have nothing to say that hasn't already been said here but this, I have done the vast majority of my hunting here in Oregon with a bolt action 30-06. It is truly a utilitarian rifle and thats probably why I keep going back to it. I have taken deer, elk, and other stuff with various 150-200 grain bullet weights and loads though I have to say I always end up coming back to a premium 165 grain bullet such as the AccuBond or Partition.
The 180's kick a bit more and hit a bit harder but I have yet to see an animal that knew whether he was shot with a 165 or 180 because they were too busy being dead, drt. The 180 Sierras at 2680 fps shoot well but the 180 Partitions at 2725 fps shoot just as good and are a better bullet. This would be my all-around load for all of North America but being as there are no bears or moose here in Oregon, I use the 165 grain Noslers and haven't had any reason to look back. Its a great load at 2820 fps or so in my 24" barrel and shoots plenty flat for the kind of hunting I do.
If you need a flatter shooting rifle, don't rod your 30-06 just get a magnum. Find a load that shoots well and stick with it. That old 30-06 will never let you down.
The 180's kick a bit more and hit a bit harder but I have yet to see an animal that knew whether he was shot with a 165 or 180 because they were too busy being dead, drt. The 180 Sierras at 2680 fps shoot well but the 180 Partitions at 2725 fps shoot just as good and are a better bullet. This would be my all-around load for all of North America but being as there are no bears or moose here in Oregon, I use the 165 grain Noslers and haven't had any reason to look back. Its a great load at 2820 fps or so in my 24" barrel and shoots plenty flat for the kind of hunting I do.
If you need a flatter shooting rifle, don't rod your 30-06 just get a magnum. Find a load that shoots well and stick with it. That old 30-06 will never let you down.
Seems that the general concensus of opinion is one load per gun with the 180 gr. bullets being te most popular for use in the 30-06. Well, you might as well add me to the list, even though I haven't loaded for the 30-06 i years. :shock: Nothing wrong with the cartridge. I was just too busy playing around with various rounds, not necessarilly the new wonder guns but with some of the classics like the 7x57, .308 and 280 Remington. Spent quite a bit of time with the .35 Whelen and I do finally my "one and only load" for that rifle. 8)
Lately I've been thinkng of going back to my roots and using the 30-06 once more. My pet load for that round was a stiff load of that now long gone milsurp H4831 that was so cheap to buy and so useful in so many cartridges. My bullet of choice was always the Sierre 180 gr. Pro-hunter although they didn't call them that way back when I started out. I wish I still had all my reloading notes that I started back in 1954 but they were lost in the move from Nevada to Arizona back in 1979.
An interesting book, if you can find a copy is "ONE MAN, ONE RIFLE, ONE LAND by J.Y.Jones. Dr. Jones hunted every species of North American big game with a Remington M700 ADL with a handload using the 180 gr. Nosler Partition. According to what wrote, he didn't even load the ammo himself but had someone do it for him. Other than the bullet used, no other information regarding the load was mentioned. Interesting book although it is more concerned with the zoology of the animals than real hunting storied which while there are short and somewhat lacking in detail. FWIW, Dr. Jones also wrote another book, "IMMPOSSIBLE TO FAIL" about his efforts along with others to get the Canadian Polar Bear off the endangered species list and the CITES list so the trophy could be imported into the U.S.
My "one load" for the .270 uses either the 150 gr. Sierra Game King for most everything and the 50 gr. Nosler Partition forelk and Black Bear. When I run out of the GK's, I'll just be running the Noslers till I'm too old to hunt, shoot or be dead.
Paul B.
Lately I've been thinkng of going back to my roots and using the 30-06 once more. My pet load for that round was a stiff load of that now long gone milsurp H4831 that was so cheap to buy and so useful in so many cartridges. My bullet of choice was always the Sierre 180 gr. Pro-hunter although they didn't call them that way back when I started out. I wish I still had all my reloading notes that I started back in 1954 but they were lost in the move from Nevada to Arizona back in 1979.
An interesting book, if you can find a copy is "ONE MAN, ONE RIFLE, ONE LAND by J.Y.Jones. Dr. Jones hunted every species of North American big game with a Remington M700 ADL with a handload using the 180 gr. Nosler Partition. According to what wrote, he didn't even load the ammo himself but had someone do it for him. Other than the bullet used, no other information regarding the load was mentioned.
Interesting book although it is more concerned with the zoology of the animals than real hunting storied which while there are short and somewhat lacking in detail. FWIW, Dr. Jones also wrote another book, "IMMPOSSIBLE TO FAIL" about his efforts along with others to get the Canadian Polar Bear off the endangered species list and the CITES list so the trophy could be imported into the U.S.My "one load" for the .270 uses either the 150 gr. Sierra Game King for most everything and the 50 gr. Nosler Partition forelk and Black Bear. When I run out of the GK's, I'll just be running the Noslers till I'm too old to hunt, shoot or be dead.
Paul B.
I guess I'm the odd ball. I have different loads for different situations. of course I have 3 different 30-06 rifles, each sighted for a different load. So I guess I have one load for one rifle.I have a BAR for 125gr BT for coyote shooting, a NEF handi rifle with 168BT for my truck rifle, and a savage 116 with 168TTSX that I primarily do all my hunting with. There is nothing on NorthAmerica a 168 TTSX can't kill
