Stupid Newbie question?!?

[m1aggie01]

Howdy,

Well, I am finally going to start reloading...I think. I have some questions as I really don't want to blow myself up. I have been reading the Lyman 48th addition and in the intro section, they recommend a beginning reloader follow the reloading manual like a cookbook and don't substitute brass, bullets or primers from what they have developed the load with.

My question is this...what if you find a load in the manual you want to use but the primer, brass or bullet is NOT the exact same? Do you just forget about that particular load or can you safely substitute other primers, another brass maker or a different bullet as long as the bullet is of the same grains?

I am really stumped here and while I don't want to sound like an idiot, I want to be safe and not blow a rifle apart in my face. I am by nature a stickler for detail, after all as a Pharmacist you have to be or someone might get killed, so I want to start by following a manual 'recipe' until I fully understand what I am doing.

Please advise me as to what type of leeway one might have as to the things that can and can't not be changed for a particular load.

TIA

 

[lrp3006]

There are others on this forum more qualified than I am to answer - but I'll add my $0.02 :wink:

You can substitute a different component (brass, primer, bullet) but you should always start at the low end and work your way up. Stick to the powders shown in your manual(s) for the specific caliber & bullet weight you're loading for though.

Have fun - reloading is a great hobby !

 

[JD338]

m1aggie01

Only dumb question is the one that isn't asked!
We are here to help.

You can interchange components (ie: same weight bullet, brass, or primer) with any given powder for rifle or pistol cartridges.
You CAN NOT do this with shotgun shells, listed loads MUST be assembled EXACTLY AS LISTED!

What caliber are you considering to load for and what bullet and components do you have to work with?
I am asking because you do not want to mix and match components, meaning you load some R-P cases with a few W-W cases. Same with primers.
You always want to start off with the starting loads and carefully look for pressure signs. This is clearly explained in the beginning of any reloading guide. Never start off with MAX loads as you could potentially exceed your guns pressure limit.

Let us know what other questions you have and we will help you get started. Welcome to the world of reloading. :grin:

JD338

 

[Guest]

As usual, JD is spot-on. I'll add that some bullets deserve special attention. Most notably, the Barnes X bullets (in any iteration - X, TSX, TTSX, MRX), because of their all copper construction, are different than anything else on the market, and generally produce higher pressures at lower charge weights. I'd suggest not starting out with these, just generally speaking, but if you really want to use them, familiarize yourself with the Barnes website info on how they suggest you load them. With Nosler, Speer, Hornady, and Sierra bullets, you can substitute components, but if you do, you must, as JD said, start with the start charge, and look for the signs of pressure described in your manual. In fact, it's a good idea to read that section several times just to be sure you understand it.

Keep the questions coming...

 

[dcopp75]

The first thing to remember is if you are using components that are different then the manual, always start with a low powder charge and slowly work up. I would also suggest staying away for the max loads. The big velocity numbers may seem impressive, but most animals can not tell if they were hit by a bullet flying at 2900 fps or 3000 fps. With that said, here are my opinions.

I would say that the brand of brass would be the least thing it to worry about about. However, you should not mix brands of brass. Different brands of brass can have different power compacities. Which can cause different pressures. This can cause consistancy issues and frustration at the range.

The next component would be the bullet. If you are loading with a bullet that is not in your manual, start low. Bullets are made up with a variety of alloys and formulas. Therefore, the friction coefficients of different bullets can vary. Even if you use the same grain bullet with the same power charge, the pressures are going to be different. Starting with a smaller power change when changing bullets is important. If is also a good idea to check that manufacture's website for loading data and suggestions.

The final componet is the primer. I would suggest using the listed primer. To start with, I would never suggest subsituting a magnum primer for a standard primer. Primers from different manufactures can very in temperature quite a bit, and this causes different pressures. My suggestion to a beginner would be to stick with a primer until they feel more comfortable with the art of reloading.

Normally, the higher the quality of component you start with, the better consistancy of your reloads, but performing the each step in the reloading process the same way every time will help the most.

 

[Powerstroke]

All the above are spot on. As JD mentioned / asked if you'd state which caliber(s) your going to load for you'd get a little more specific information.
My $.02 to add would be switching bullet manufactures. If your working out of " one " book and switch manufactures of bullets, make sure and check OAL !
Start a

 

[steve4102]

The first thing to remember is if you are using components that are different then the manual, always start with a low powder charge and slowly work up. .

Not so fast, there GrassHopper! Whether one is using identical components or not, "always start low and work up". After all, it is totally impossible to follow load data to the letter.

 

[rick smith]

If you happen to have some military cases in your stock, they are normally smaller in capacity and can build pressure faster. For simplicity buy yourself 100 rounds of new virgin brass from the same maker. Certain primers can be difficult to find at this time but get all the same make. If you start at the suggested starting loads in your manual it doesn't matter the brand of primer. none will give you a problem at this level same with bullets. As suggested watch those solids. Depending on the case you are loading the amount of increase in powder should change. Normally going up in charge 0.5gr for 308/3006, less for cases like the 223 and less for pistol cases. Until you become more familar with loading use the seating depth suggested in your manual. This is not rocket science band attention to detail will keep you safe. Above all else, come here and ask questions. I go to four different loading sites daily and this is the best without question. There are many years of experience here just waiting to help you in your new adventure. Enjoy your new hobby and be prepared to start shooting a lot more.Rick.

 

[dcopp75]

Please note that I also said to stay away from the Max loads. You should always start low. Every rifle is different. Tight, loose, and weak chambers change the way pressures will affect the rifle.

 

[RMiller]

m1aggie01

Since I dont think it can be said enough I'll say it again too.
Start low and work up. Most "recipes will have a starting point listed. If it is not listed many times it is just 10% under max (do not load with less powder than that. Some powders are dangerous if loaded with too little in the case.)

If you want to try a load but you have a different brand of primer or bullet. You just start low and work up. Same with cases. If you are using one brand then get a different brand of cases you have to work up a new load.

 

[Big Squeeze]

In agreement with everyone else!.............Remember! Your rifle has its own ballistic fingerprint. Treat it as a seperate or individual rifle from all others, even if the rifle, caliber and reloading components are the same...................Whether the components are the same in your manual or different, ALWAYS start low and work up to max. in 1/4 or 1/2 gr. increments! What is maximum in your rifle will not be the same as in other identical rifles..............

 

[RMiller]

Exactly that was what I left out of my first post.

If you want to shoot a load you have made up in a different rifle you need to work up the load again to make sure it will be safe in the other rifle.

And after all this once you get the reloading part down then I would suggest getting a chronograph. To weed out the slow loads.

 

[JD338]

m1aggie01

One other point is being able to cross reference load date. Buy 2-3 loading manuals and compare the load data. Also, any load data you get from friends or the internet should be researched and compared to the load data in your manuals. Its just a good practice to verify load data for your own safety.

As mentioned above, there are many folks with a lot of knowledge and experience that will help you get started. Myself, I have been loading since I was 15 yrs old, and that was 33 yrs ago. :lol:

We are all looking forward to you getting started. Let us know what more we can do to assist you.

JD338

 

[edh]

I agree with getting several manuals. I'd highly suggest A-Square's "Any Shot you Want" as your second manual. This manual goes much more deeply into the science of internal and external ballistics than the other loading manuals. There is a chapter devoted to the effects on pressure due to changing components. They run through a series of tests holding every thing constant except for changing primers, bullets, cases, and even lots of the same components and powder.

The loading data for each caliber is usually limited to a couple bullets and powders, but the detailed pressure measurements are worth the look. For many calibers they show loads that are over pressure, which gives a really great feeling for how much (little) additional powder can take you from an under pressure load to one that is over maximum.

After reading this book I no longer gripe about manuals typically showing maximum loads that are 5%-10% below maximum average pressure. A single change in component or lot can easily burn up that margin.

"Any Shot you Want" on sale here:
http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.e ... mid=524043

Ed

 

[m1aggie01]

My lord...I never expected this much response. I am very grateful to all of you and will be returning often. I have drawn up preliminary plans for my bench and hope to get started on it this weekend!!!

Right now, I want to reload 30.06 and 6mm. I have a M1903 and 03A3 that I want to load for. I will eventually want to reload for my Garands but NOT until I learn more. I also wanted to load for my sporterized 6mm 98 Mauser. I figure loading for a bolt action will be more "forgiving" than a semi-auto. I eventually want to load for an upcoming 6.5x55 hunting rifle although I have a M96 Swede that I might just break out after getting the headspacing checked.

Going with the 30.06 idea I have tons of LC brass that I have been saving and I really wanted to use this to save startup expenses. Is this a bad idea to start??? Would it be better for me to learn the art of reloading with new factory brass? I have been looking at bulk 150gr Hor. bullets loaded in front of IMR 4064 powder IIRC.

As far as loading equipment goes, I am thinking of starting with a SS Lee Anniversary Kit and adding the other necessary tools to the bench. Unless any of you have a better brand for about the same price or a spare SS press you would be will to sell me cheap, I will probably have to start with the Lee as my projected budget to get started is about $500 including bench building supplies, equipment and components. Does this sound reasonable.

I really appreciate all of the info. I received many, many more replies than I expected. I will check back again soon. TIA

 

[Guest]

You're heading in the right direction. I wouldn't sweat what people will tell you about the Lee kits - they are plenty good to start out on. Be sure you get the new version of the kit, which includes the Challenger Breech Lock press. You won't be disappointed. You will find over time that you pick up other tools and gadgets, but you have a great starting point.

You are probably right that it is easier to start loading for a bolt gun than a semi-auto, but if you're loading for a Garand, there are plenty of sources for proper load data and technique. Do remember though, that when loading for older military rifles, as well as sporterized versions thereof, you should keep loads under max. Most manuals will give a percentage to stay under max - you should follow it with the sporterized military guns you have, including the 6mm.

As for the bench, be sure you make it as large as you can. I have one that is 2x5 feet, and frankly, I'd prefer something about 2-3 feet deep, but a full 8-10 feet long if I had room for it. You'll always find ways to fill up the space, I can assure you. I think there's a thread around here somewhere about loading rooms with pictures if you need some ideas.

Good luck with the bench, and remember that you can always get other or more gadgets later on.

 

[C.Smith]

I think starting with your LC brass should be find. I see no reason to start with brand new brass as long as it's all head stamped the same. You can get really anal and weight sort all the brass you have there and use lots of the same weight, but that is not necessary.

The 30-06 is no big deal to reload, just follow the recipe and if you change components for a different one always start back at the lowest powder charge.

I like to load three rounds at starting and then work up in half grain increments until I find my rifles max or get to the max charge in the book. Good luck and by the way you found a great spot for reloading infrormation, lots of respect on this sight, unlike other's I have visited.

Corey

 

[Antelope_Sniper]

I would say LC bass is fine. That what I started with 30 years ago. Of course you may have to knock the crimp out of the primer pocket, so a good commercial brass may be easier. On average, LC brass is some of the thickest brass, and will build pressure quicker then the typical commercial brass. Again, start with the minimum listed load, but don't be surprised if you see high pressure signs before reaching the maximum listed load with military brass. I typically advise new reloaders to start with Winchester Brass. Winchester is one of the thinnest, and consequently doesn't build pressure as fast. Using thinner brass and slower powders is a great way to build and extra safety margin into your loading practices.