US Army considers 3 Glock models to replace M9.

[CMBTshooter]

It seems like the US Army might be considering doing a good thing by replacing the M9 with a Glock model 17, 22, or 37. I wouldn't mind the caliber change but it's my personal belief that they should either stick with the 9mm or go big with the 10mm. There is a lot of potential for a good change here folks, but we're also talking about an organization that thought giving black berets to everyone would make the Army magically better. With that said there is a lot of potential for a disaster. I can see this going from having an okay pistol to having a terrible pistol. Here's hoping they don't go with the Beretta 96!

 

[SJB358]

Just bring back the 45's! It is already out there and with the amount of shooting training most soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines are getting, it shouldn't be too hard to make them competent with a proper sidearm. Send those Beretta's back! Scotty

 

[Woodycreek]

It definitely needs to be a caliber change in the direction of 40, 45, or 10mm. Anything is better than the 9mm. A Glock would be a good choice for a new pistol. Accurate, dead nuts reliability, high capacity and not heavy like others. I think the Rangers are currently using Glocks. Sounds like Glock may have a shot at being the new pistol.

 

[CMBTshooter]

Getting a 10mm would be pretty sweet, but the 9mm is still a fantastic combat caliber. Combat is just like hunting, shot placement is everything.

 

[Woodycreek]

The 9mm is ok but also minimum carry caliber not only in my opinion but law enforcement and the NRA. The 9mm is the reason we now practice Double Taps, Hammered Pairs, and failure drills.

 

[FOTIS]

Just bring back the 45's! It is already out there and with the amount of shooting training most soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines are getting, it shouldn't be too hard to make them competent with a proper sidearm. Send those Beretta's back! Scotty

AMEN BROTHER.

Carried one for 18 years. Never had a problem with the Beretta just the caliber in that format.
Thank God I never had to use those crappy little 115 gr FMJ's to protect myself and others.

 

[1Shot]

I have a buddy that was a Major in the USMC and was in on the trials on pistols back when they went to the M9. He said that the Glock beat out every pistol by a mile but Bill Clinton's administration played politics and chose the M9.

 

[Woodycreek]

Had a Marine one class ahead of me lose his right eye to a M9. The locking block cracked and the slide hit him in the eye. That was supposedly more of a problem than just old worn out pistols.

I have heard the story several times that we buy M9s and the Italians gave us an airbase.

 

[CMBTshooter]

Had a Marine one class ahead of me lose his right eye to a M9. The locking block cracked and the slide hit him in he eye. That was supposedly more of a problem than just old worn out pistols.

I have heard the story several times that we buy M9s and the Italians gave us an airbase.

I've broken the locking block on several M9s.

 

[HTDUCK]

Just bring back the 45's! It is already out there and with the amount of shooting training most soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines are getting, it shouldn't be too hard to make them competent with a proper sidearm. Send those Beretta's back! Scotty

AMEN BROTHER.

Carried one for 18 years. Never had a problem with the Beretta just the caliber in that format.
Thank God I never had to use those crappy little 115 gr FMJ's to protect myself and others.

Fotis you at least had a high capacity nine.
All I was issued was a 6 shot 38 revolver loaded with 148 gr wadcutters.
We we not allowed any kind of weapon in a helo that ejected spent casings, unless
it could be outfitted with a bag to catch them.

How far you think I'd have gotten in a defensive situation armed in such a manner?

Howard

 

[Oldtrader3]

Too bad that every decision in Washington is political instead of based on reliability and accuracy. The Glock's have proven themselves with LEO departments all over the world. Why not use them for our Armed Services?

 

[Guest]

You're confusing logic with government. Never do that. It only makes your head hurt.

 

[C.Smith]

I think going to a 40 would be a good move. seen a guy shot several times with Federal 180 grain FMJ which has a flat tip and it did a really good job on him. I also think Glocks would be a good way to go or the 45s. LIke them both.

Corey

 

[ScreaminEagle]

Anything is better than Beretta's sorry excuse for a pistol. With the POS M4's and beretta's as sidearms, sometimes i don't think they want us to win.

Long live M14's and the Colt 45!

 

[300WSM]

It wont happen until atleast 2017. Beretta has a huge contract to complete for atleast another 4 years.

Moreover I can't see the army going to Glock because I just don't see the military having the confidence in the soldier to be carrying a sidearm with no side mounted safety. The trigger safe is plenty safe for a trained person but this is the GOVT we are talking about so I can't see them being all excited about that.

So...should they? YES! Will they? I can't see it happening.

Going back to a 1911 makes the most sense. Possibly this time a double stack version.

 

[Mortis]

Well..... the Corps had ordered 10,000 Colt 1911's.... to be called the M45.

http://www.military.com/daily-news/2012 ... arine-a.nl

 

[DrMike]

Good intel, Mortis. I can't say that I'm surprised.

 

[Oldtrader3]

How about the S&W .40 S&W M&P Shield? It is fairly compact and the FBI already carries the .40 S&W. The 165 grain bullets at 1080 fps is a pretty potent load with not much more recoil than the 9mm.

 

[Oldtrader3]

How about the S&W M&P 40 S&W? Tha would give he troops the thumb safety and a potent round for putting hostiles down.

 

[Mortis]

Let me toss a few considerations into the mix. And I'm not going to try to consider myself part of the evaluation team here.

The Glock is a stable weapons platform. Easy to use, simple to train with, fairly easy to maintain. Now as many Police Departments have learned by going to the Glock as their issue sidearm, not everyone can wrap their mitts around one. Female LEO's are known to have smaller hands, thus making it hard to handle properly. And before Guy smacks me up side of the head with a rammer staff, this is not true of all female LEO's and of all models of Glock. But it is something to be considered.

Never arm an individual with something they cannot properly utilize.

Personal note about the Glock........ I've shot them and do it very well...... Hate them. Wife will not allow them in the house. And I could develope an entire thread about this....BUT.... that is personal bias on my Wife's and my part which is not important here.

Smith & Wesson....... Boy.... this is difficult. I do own a 3904 and enjoy it. Eldest daughter loves it and has laid claim to it. Looking at a 5904 for future purchase. This spring I sold a 1006 to a friend. But I have found the basic ergonomics of S&W autoloaders awkward of late. Triggers to be nasty to say the least. But, this is just my viewpoint of the designs.

1911 platforms. It is not well known that the Marines did not totally remove the 1911A1 from inventory. They opening admit to rebuilding 450 1911A1's for folks like Recon and FAST. One of the nice things was they removed the old wood grips and intalled Pachmeyrs. I suspect they installed National Match Barrels and Bushings in them to aid in performance.

There are several companies out there producing a high quality 1911 platform. Most are overdone, but that's what alot of the buying public thinks they need. Demand relating to supply.

One must remember that for the military, the handgun is a self defense platform only. It has never been considered as the primary weapon for troops.

Basis of issue has been:

Machine gun crews, i.e., the gunner and assistant gunner for self defense use where the crew served weapon is incapable of defending them.

Radio operators were issued sidearms because of the weight of the radios and rifles were too large a burden. This has changed with modern communications equipment.

Officers and select NCO's whose function is leadership in combat. Platoon leaders/commanders, platoon sergeants, etc. Now this changed years ago in VietNam. Everyone carried a rifle, but you would still find those sidearms being carried along with the rifle as backup. I carried a Remington 870 M&P plus a 1911A1 in my assignment as an ALO.

OK.....I've detoured some from my thinking...... sorry.

SigArms..... I own 3 of them. A P220 in .45acp, a P239 in .40 S&W and a P238 in .380acp. Well, the 238 is actually my wife's. The Sig has proven to be a stable weapons platform for decades. The Navy''s SEAL's used them as their back up sidearm for years, even while the 1911 was still in service.

I enjoy mine but my wife has a problem with the 220's size.

Each and every one of us has our preferences and bias towards handguns. Honestly, I am a hard core 1911A1 fan.... but I am in major love with my wheelguns. Eight out of my 1911A1 or 6 out of my Model 57 Smith. Decisions, decisions.

What the military has too consider is the ability of each member to use the chosen sidearm. Granted testing is primarily based of depenability, but I think they have learned over the years about ergonomics.

IF and only if I had imput into the selection, I would consider the .40S&W bullet if the .45acp was not available. Ergonomics of the grip of a .40 is smaller and easier for those petite warriors out there. I'd also go with the 155 grain bullet weight. Higher velocity and greater penetration then the 180's, yet still managable.

Single stack verses stack..... such a consideration is based on alot of variables.

I was once asked by a member of the New Mexico Highway Patrol, who was carrying a Glock 19, what I was going to do after I expended my 7 rounds from my 1911A1. I replied...... look for 7 more targets as I reload. (actual comment edited for family fair). The gentleman laughed and stated I had him.

I have no idea what the Army is going to do, but it has been obvious for way too many years the M9 is a POS and needs to be replaced.

Ok gents......I've rambled on probably way to much..... have at me... I have broad shoulders.