Weighing Brass

[hardpan]

Hi there,
Just wondering how many of you weigh your brass? I just did a batch of 50 .257 brass, the heaviest was about 10 gr heavier than the lightest. Had about 20 grouped into the 215 or so Grs, another around 212 grs, but the lightest 3 or so were around 205.

Not sure why, as I usually keep lots together, but I will certainly be a lot more careful in the future and incorporate weighing brass into my routine.,
Hardpan

 

[YoteSmoker]

I weigh my primed brass then set them up in my loading tray in like weights just before charging. It is really easy to do and doesn't take much extra time using the RCBS chargemaster.

 

[JD338]

I have used the Nosler weight sortedbrass but I have never weighed my brass.

JD338

 

[Elkman]

I am not sure what it accomplishes? I have done it and tested it to determine the most accurate load, and came up inconculsive. I am sure that there may be some value, and I am sure that someone here knows what it is and maybe they will share it with us. I also don't ream my case necks either inside or out. I have yet to run into a big game animal that noticed the difference. :grin: :grin:

 

[SJB358]

Same here, never weight sorted brass. It probably helps some, just not sure if my rifles would be able to tell the difference, they are mostly all sporter type hunting rifles. Sounds like a good plan though, can't hurt anything. Scotty

 

[onesonek]

For general purpose shooting/hunting rounds, weighing brass just isn't that critical. Although, the more consistant you keeo all aspects reloading the better accuracy potential. For normal hunting/shooting, it just isn't necessary. But then again, if you want the upmost potential, there is nothing wrong with weighing brass. (it's your time and wants) Then too, if your at that point, the next step is to sort bullets by both weight and diameter.
I only did it for comp shooting. I may start again for the 6mm AI in the XP-100, only because that rig is for shooting targets and PD's at 1000 yds and beyond,,,,,there I want all the consistancy possible. For brass lots, I kept my weight +/- .5 grs. , and bullet sort lot's,+/- .10 gr. and +/- .0001"
Depending how much shooting is being done, you can end up buying 100's of brass and 1000's of bullets to get the shootable numbers needed within the lots. Then each lot may have to be tweaked.
Just all depends what the needs and wants are.

dave

 

[hardpan]

Same here, never weight sorted brass. It probably helps some, just not sure if my rifles would be able to tell the difference, they are mostly all sporter type hunting rifles. Sounds like a good plan though, can't hurt anything. Scotty

Hi Scotty, exactly why I asked the question. I have a couple of fickle rifles, and noticed the differences on one of them.
Hardpan

 

[hardpan]

For general purpose shooting/hunting rounds, weighing brass just isn't that critical. Although, the more consistant you keeo all aspects reloading the better accuracy potential. For normal hunting/shooting, it just isn't necessary. But then again, if you want the upmost potential, there is nothing wrong with weighing brass. (it's your time and wants) Then too, if your at that point, the next step is to sort bullets by both weight and diameter.
I only did it for comp shooting. I may start again for the 6mm AI in the XP-100, only because that rig is for shooting targets and PD's at 1000 yds and beyond,,,,,there I want all the consistancy possible. For brass lots, I kept my weight +/- .5 grs. , and bullet sort lot's,+/- .10 gr. and +/- .0001"
Depending how much shooting is being done, you can end up buying 100's of brass and 1000's of bullets to get the shootable numbers needed within the lots. Then each lot may have to be tweaked.
Just all depends what the needs and wants are.

dave

HI Dave, I agree with what you said, but the engineer in me wants to understand the measureable differences in weighing brass. I have weighed bullets for years, but then bullet weight affects a lot of different variables like pressure, ballistic coef, wind shear. But, I cannot think of what effect different brass weights would have on the actual flight of the bullet. I am seeing brass differ as much as 12 Grs! But, I am not sure what that means on the range. would heavier brass affect pressure? After all, the overall volume for the gas to expand would be less because of the "larger" brass, But what if the brass is not quite the same density from shell to shell.... Anyway, thanks for the data so far... I am going to conduct some tests at the range....
Hardpan.

 

[bullet]

I am not sure it helps that much but I weigh and sort bullets, primed brass and believe that the most important aspect of my loading is the powder charge. I weigh it to the point that I will at times take out or add one flak or piece of powder so that the scale is exact. Trimming of brass, bullet seating and how that is done. When I reload it is having a personal experience with my components and rifle. Now that is obsessiveness and I know a few on this forum that go much future than I do. I think it pays off because it is less to doubt yourself about when comparing loads.

 

[DannoBoone]

I look at it this way.....

Being anal about brass prep, especially for a Montana Rifle Co. Model 1999
in 7mmWSM, is done for the same reason I buy mechanics manuals for
my automobiles. It isn't that the Mod 1999 is a competition rifle, or that
I am a mechanic. It is done simply because we both need all the help we
can get! :lol:

 

[SJB358]

Good point! Nothing wrong with it. I may give it a try the next time I start load work for a new cartridge. Scotty

 

[irocbarry]

for my hunting only rifles I just keep brass lots together. If I am trying to get everything I can out of the rifle I weigh it to +/- .5gr, it seems to make a difference even if small.
I understand it to change pressure because of the different internal volume of the case, assuming the external of the brass is the same.

 

[FOTIS]

I am not sure what it accomplishes? I have done it and tested it to determine the most accurate load, and came up inconculsive. I am sure that there may be some value, and I am sure that someone ..............:

It the brass is full length resized, using the same die then you must agree that the external dimensions are exact between all the brass. If you have one weighing 10 grains more than the other that means that internal capacity of the heavier brass is less than the lighter one dur to brass wall thickness. That extra weight has got to be brass. I never seen loads made with brass with such variation shoot consistantly. Extra brass, thicker walls, less capacity, more pressure, more velocity, less uniformity etc.

 

[onesonek]

For general purpose shooting/hunting rounds, weighing brass just isn't that critical. Although, the more consistant you keep all aspects reloading the better accuracy potential. For normal hunting/shooting, it just isn't necessary. But then again, if you want the upmost potential, there is nothing wrong with weighing brass. (it's your time and wants) Then too, if your at that point, the next step is to sort bullets by both weight and diameter.
I only did it for comp shooting. I may start again for the 6mm AI in the XP-100, only because that rig is for shooting targets and PD's at 1000 yds and beyond,,,,,there I want all the consistancy possible. For brass lots, I kept my weight +/- .5 grs. , and bullet sort lot's,+/- .10 gr. and +/- .0001"
Depending how much shooting is being done, you can end up buying 100's of brass and 1000's of bullets to get the shootable numbers needed within the lots. Then each lot may have to be tweaked.
Just all depends what the needs and wants are.

dave

HI Dave, I agree with what you said, but the engineer in me wants to understand the measureable differences in weighing brass. I have weighed bullets for years, but then bullet weight affects a lot of different variables like pressure, ballistic coef, wind shear. But, I cannot think of what effect different brass weights would have on the actual flight of the bullet. I am seeing brass differ as much as 12 Grs! But, I am not sure what that means on the range. would heavier brass affect pressure? After all, the overall volume for the gas to expand would be less because of the "larger" brass, But what if the brass is not quite the same density from shell to shell.... Anyway, thanks for the data so far... I am going to conduct some tests at the range....
Hardpan.

I know what you are saying about density, and one could go the extreme and run test for that was well. But as long as you buy large enough quanities ( hopefully same prodction lot) so you come out with the number of shootable lots from a purchase lot, then you are doing about all you can do to obtain that consistancy. And as POP said as well,,,,it's all about consistancy. The goal is even pressure's resulting in low extreme spread of velocity. I strive for ES's in the single digits. If you got all the consistancy possible through out the reloading process, and the rifle won't group,,,,chances are the muzzle crown isn't the best or and off center chamber. Then too there is the chance, that particular rifle don't like that particular bullet.

Dave

 

[bullet]

Just last night I had to cull three out of ever eight new brass in a bag of Winchester brass for my 300Win Mag. That is the worst it has ever been when using Winchester brass. Now what I mean is once I have full sized the new brass, trimmed, taken burrs off and put the new primer in, then I weigh them. I like the Win brass for the 300Win Mag to be at or just at 244.6grs of weight.

Now anything that does not have this basic weight I put in a bag and when I have enough of the culled brass that all weigh about he the same then I use them. What I am looking for is consistency. I am convinced that the last group I shot could have all been in the same exaggerated hole but I got in a hurry and put them together out of his lot of brass that need 3 of ever 8 culled without weighing them. I know I pulled the trigger right on those six rounds I shot and the brass was the more than likely my problem.

If I did not have so many Winchester brass, I would buy Nosler.

 

[Oldtrader3]

dave

HI Dave, I agree with what you said, but the engineer in me wants to understand the measureable differences in weighing brass. I have weighed bullets for years, but then bullet weight affects a lot of different variables like pressure, ballistic coef, wind shear. But, I cannot think of what effect different brass weights would have on the actual flight of the bullet. I am seeing brass differ as much as 12 Grs! But, I am not sure what that means on the range. would heavier brass affect pressure? After all, the overall volume for the gas to expand would be less because of the "larger" brass, But what if the brass is not quite the same density from shell to shell.... Anyway, thanks for the data so far... I am going to conduct some tests at the range....
Hardpan.[/quote]

Hardpan: I have always gone by the Standard Deviation and some ANOVA analysis of the data sets instead. If the statistical numbers are there and indicate with coordination with consistancy and low Standard Deviation numbers on a chronograph, I do not worry about brass sorting unless there are great disparties within a representative sampling of case weight.

 

[R Flowers]

I guess I have been lucky, I just have not seen too much variation in weights in brass. Sure, I know it it there, but I usually do not fret too much about it. If I were shooting bench rest I would worry about it, but for hunting, who can shoot that well in the field?

Case in point: I loaded 20 rounds for a .416 Rigby this morning. New Hornady cases, Fed 215 primers, 99 grains of RL 22, 400 grain Barnes TSX bullets. Even though I had visually inspected each case to be sure they had powder in them, I weighed each and every case after I was done. The loaded ammo averaged 821 grains and I do not think any of it varied by more than 4 or 5 grains, great, in my opinion.

 

[JD338]

RF,

My thoughts exactly.

JD338

 

[hardpan]

Normally, I did not weigh cases. I have fired these 3 times, and they are from different batches, but all from the same manufacturer. I was a bit surprised to find out that the case variation was about 20 grs across 50 pieces. Not sure about the differences in shooting, and i have never even cared before, but, the engineer in me decided to group them, and I will measure the results... Let you know if it improves the overall performance...
Hardpan

 

[Oldtrader3]

I don't buy "once fired" range brass because I would have to sort it and I haven't a clue where it came from or its history. I try to buy Starline or better brass and let the chips fall where they may. If I was shooting for competition, I would be much more fussy. After 50 years of reloading, I can not see a high correlation of casual accuracy and normal brass weight distribution anyhow, although the Engineer in me tells me that it is there. This is because of chamber constraints to brass expansion and the gas pressure relationship.