Why No Love for The .308 Winchester

[TexasLife]

I'm with you Guy. I cut my teeth on the 30-06.

JD338

i cut my teeth (more like my brow) on a 264wm............................................. optic . yup, optic bite

 

[Redmt]

Paul Hampton is doing the work. Barrel and Jard trigger.

Paul is putting a new barrel on my #1 also.

 

[TexasLife]

Guy, i need to make notes on where you peeps are at/from for when i go traveling. not sure if i'll ever go that far to the upper north-west?

 

[RL338]

got the Bee because I’m a nut for 24 inch barrels on standard calibers. And I will use the Bee more than the Ruger. And I love the Bee products too.

Mine is the first run of the S2 Vanguard with 1:12 twist and my daughter’s is a Vanguard Compact Hunter.

 

[GregoryB.]

Paul is putting a new barrel on my #1 also.

He ordered my barrel about 3 weeks ago. Hope to have it back by early summer so I can work up a load for it.

 

[wvbuckbuster]

To be perfectly honest, I shunned the .308 from the start considering it to be a 30-06 want to be. I remember when a hunting partner in California bought a .308 when they first came who he was singing the praises of what a great cartridge it was. Frankly, it wasn't until 1973 that I even considered a .308 and that was because being a heavy chain smoker at the time, hunting with friend on 9,500 foot high mountains was taking a heavy toll on me and my 30-06 was getting to be too damned heavy. The only .308 I could find was a Remington 660 so I bit the bullet and bought it. I wasn't too thrilled about that short 20" barrel as it was loud. Not sure about accuracy either as the noise and recoil got a serious flinch going. Later on my kids got me a set of shooting muffs for my birthday and WOW! What happened to the recoil? That was when I started getting decent groups running Winchester factory ammo with 150 gr. bullets. I don't remember if they were Silvertips or Power Points but they shot decent groups.
It was later that year when deer season started that I took that rifle out on its first deer hunt. One of my buddies shot at and wounded a nice 4 point Mule Deer and it was running off. I was about 200 or so yards to the left of my buds when I saw that deer and took a shot even though it was way the hell and gone out yonder. The deer dropped and lay still. My friends came over and we paced it of at 426 paces. At that point in time that was the longest shot I'd ever taken on any game animal. That's when I took a long hard look at the .308.

I have never chronographed any load out of that Remington. I have however chronographed loads from several Ruger M77 RSIs, and a Winchester M70. I did one time chronograph loads from that M70 with 22" barrel with 180 gr. Winchester Power Points. At the same time I ran some 30-06 180 gr. Power points from a Remington M700 BDL with 22" barrel. The .308 was all of 20 FPS faster than the 30-06. THe only real difference was the .308 barrel had a 1 in 12" twist while the 30-06 was 1 in 10". Whether that made a differnce or not is something I cannot answer.

I have read those article by John Wooters and his full stocked SAKO and looked for one for a long time. Never did find one in .308. What I did find was the Ruger RSI and while it took me a long time to fid a usable hunting load for that rifle it has become one of my favorite .308 rifles I own. I had to find another one as my late wife tried to appropriate mine. The only thing I was skeptical about the rifle was the 18.5" barrel. About the best they'll do with my handload is 2550 FPS which is exactly the same as the Speer Nitrex ammo that is no longer available. I used the Speer 165 gr. Hot Core and Speer used the 165 gr. Grand Slam bullet. The longest shot I've taken with the RSI was 250 yards. I probably could have taken 95 percent or better of the shots at game with that load and never had to look back.

I took me a while to come around to liking the .308 but when I did it was a solid liking.
Paul B.

Paul I was like you in trying to find a full stock Sako 308 like Wooters. Put a want to buy ad on 24 hr campfire and got a response. Used it last year on a couple of doe hunts. Dan.

 

[PJGunner]

Paul I was like you in trying to find a full stock Sako 308 like Wooters. Put a want to buy ad on 24 hr campfire and got a response. Used it last year on a couple of doe hunts. Dan.

Well, then take a look at the Ruger RSI in .308. The barrel is slightly shorter at 18.5" but based on my usage, a tang safety version, it will still slay deer to at least 250 Yards. That's the longest shot I've taken with my RSI rifle.
Paul B.

 

[HAWKEYESATX]

Anyone recognize these ballistics tables?

 

[HAWKEYESATX]

They are from left to right:
1 - 150 gr .30 cal Ballistic Tip
2 - 165 gr .30 cal Ballistic Tip
3 - 180 gr .30 cal Ballistic Tip

 

[HAWKEYESATX]

As one can see, the 150 gr bullet driven to 2800 fps is good for deer out to 500 yds. The 2900 fps is good for deer out to 550 yds. Either or it has enough steam to take a dear cleanly and humanely.
The 165 gr bullet at 2700 FPS is good for a compromise bullet weight for deer out to 550 yds. For elk 350 yds. But drive it to 2800 FPS and the bullet is good for deer out to 550-575 yds. For elk it’s good out to 450 yds.
The 180 gr bullet driven to 2600 FPS is good for elk out to 350 yds. Let’s drive the same bullet to 2700 FPS and it’s good out to 400 yds. Thats a long ways in elk territory. But the .308 can handle its own with these distances. Not a pipsqueak round in my book!
As Jim and others have demonstrated, the 165 gr bullet is the optimal weight for deer and elk, and also for moose I dare say.

 

[HAWKEYESATX]

i cut my teeth (more like my brow) on a 264wm............................................. optic . yup, optic bite

The first and only time I had scope brow was with a Ruger M 77 in .338 Win Mag. This rifle was actually easier to shoot than my Ruger M 77 in .300 Win Mag.

 

[HAWKEYESATX]

Has anyone here ever watched Mason Leather Outdoors on YouTube?
I have some pretty good data comparing .308 and .30-06 factory loads.

Ruger American 22 inch barrel


.308 150 gr Federal Fusion

Avg 2830 fps

.308 180 gr Federal Fusion

Avg 2616 fps


Tikka T3 super light 22.4 inch bbl


.30-06 150 gr Federal Fusion

Avg 2832 fps

.30-06 180 gr Federal Fusion

Avg 2627 fps

I think this is quite interesting.
Your thoughts?

 

[ReloadKy]

I have fallen in love with the 308. I bought a cheap black Friday edition savage axis 2 in 308 and once I started shooting it it was extremely accurate and appeared to have a super fast barrel. I typically get 75-100 fps faster velocities than book velocities out of this rifle which was a pleasant bonus at the cheap purchase price. I have found a load of 130 gr Barnes TTSX bullets that shoots lights out and it has produced an 8 pt and and 11 pt in consecutive seasons. One deer DRT the other ran 15 yards. No hate on the 308 here!!

 

[xphunter]

Sub 16" 308 Win barrel with the 155 A-Max.
Still has an impact velocity of 1870 fps at 500 yards.
Depending on what you consider a minimum impact velocity for the A-Max and the newer ELD-M, some would stretch out this combo to the 650 yard mark. 550 yards for sure though.
My barrel is a Remington take off barrel for this XP-100.
The Gunsmith, Chris, nicknamed it the "Dirty Thirty."
It shoots very well.


500 yards

 

[Guy Miner]

Ernie's post reminded me that Hodgdon has long published load data for 15" barreled pistols - in rifle cartridges! I've found this very useful when trying to figure out what sort of velocity might be obtained from say, a 16" 308 or whatever. Here's an example from their online Reloading Data Center:

 

[xphunter]

My load is: 155 grain A-Max, 46.5 grains of H-4895, CCI primer, 2.916 OAL case length @ 2734 fps.
Hornady once fired brass from a friend.
This load allows sustained shooting during the summer without a problem.
Engaged steel target up to and beyond 1K with it.
Let a friend use for WY-SHOT a couple of year ago, and he placed in the top 3 with it.
Holland brakes work good!

 

[M1Garand]

The 308 Win is a great cartridge. I think it and others like the 7-08 Rem and 270 Win are pushed aside to promote and market the latest greatest cartridge.

 

[HAWKEYESATX]

The 308 Win is a great cartridge. I think it and others like the 7-08 Rem and 270 Win are pushed aside to promote and market the latest greatest cartridge.

You’re absolutely correct! Some aren’t as good, some can equal, and very few can better either the 7mm-08 and the .308 Win! The reason they’ve stuck around as long as they have is because they perform well. They’re not flashy, or exciting, but they just plain work, and work well.

 

[M1Garand]

You’re absolutely correct! Some aren’t as good, some can equal, and very few can better either the 7mm-08 and the .308 Win! The reason they’ve stuck around as long as they have is because they perform well. They’re not flashy, or exciting, but they just plain work, and work well.

And you can find the 308 Win at any place that sells ammo if you need it.

 

[HAWKEYESATX]

I know this is off the subject, but I have been studying the .270 for a little while now. I know I’m going to ruffle some feathers here, but the .270 does 75% of what the 7mm Rem Mag can do. The advantage to the 7mm Mag, really only about 25 yds extra range, and only in all reality, a 10% to 15% increase in energy. When I figured this out, I was a strong 7mm Rem Mag guy. I was dumbfounded. And , here is something I learned that was dumbfounding to me. If you hand load the .30-06 nowadays, it will equal the 7mm REM Mag. I know what someone is going to say though, the 7mm Mag shoots flatter. Yeah, for practical hunting distances, the 7mm Mag only has a half inch to 1 inch advantage. You have to get past 1000 yds to see an actual advantage.