- Nov 4, 2004
- 25,342
- 8,903
Nice bull moose and black bear.
Congratulations to both you and the hunter.
JD338
Congratulations to both you and the hunter.
JD338
150gr Accubond LR vs Maine Moose?
- Thread starter 35 Whelen
- Start date
gerry
Ammo Smith
- Mar 1, 2007
- 6,908
- 1,791
35 Whelen":17hdfm3y said:
That's a nice bull your hunter took and that black bear is a beast. Really like the looks of that big bull you have a picture of.............
I really like the 150 gr Ballistic Tip and 160 gr Partition combo I got going right now but that won't stop some 150 gr ABLR's from showing up in the next while
- Thread starter
- #24
35 Whelen
Handloader
- Dec 22, 2011
- 2,237
- 516
Joe,
I had not seen that article of Ross's so was really glad you posted that link. I just read it and can only
say that he has pretty much hit the nail on the head. For what ever it's worth, when you guide for a living
you are going to get exposed to lots of shooting and kills every season. So the fact of the matter is, you are
going to be present and involved in observing many dozens of kills each season. The avg person is simply just
NOT going to have that sort of exposure to that number of kills each season ,on big game animals............... that's the reality of it. So I would inject here that someone like Ross's opinion on choosing a caliber is certainly worth weighing up probably vastly more than the average person or gun writers opinion is, just because he has seen a way more actual kills over the years............
After 45 years of guiding hunters myself,all over the world,I have pretty much come to the exact same conclusion as Ross has. Here are a couple of things that are reality: You can NOT shoot a .460 Weatherby as well as you can a .222 , However if you "think you can"or say "you can"then I am glad for you....................
And if you have a 338 RUM or 340 WM/378WM,and "you believe"you will have a huge advantage over the other fellow in camp, shooting his fathers old boring 30/06, with 180 gr Partitions on a Moose/ Elk hunt;your probably just kidding yourself. More than likely he will flatten his at 150 yds, and you will likely wind up trying one, at 450 yds, same as they do on " Best of the West". Ditto for hunting big bears, the 06 with 220gr bullets will flatten em IF you hit them correctly. IF you don't a magnum caliber won't save you, I have seen brown bears shot with 458 WM slightly too far back run off like you had shot them with a 22 rim fire!
So Ross is 110% right weather you want to believe it or not............
The sad truth is " it ain't the arrow, it's the Indian"
The 6.5 x55 , 7x57 , .270W and the grand old 30/06 have all
Proven this many thousands of times.
Scotty: here is the far shoulder after the ABLR did its damage! I just took care of the meat today!
I had not seen that article of Ross's so was really glad you posted that link. I just read it and can only
say that he has pretty much hit the nail on the head. For what ever it's worth, when you guide for a living
you are going to get exposed to lots of shooting and kills every season. So the fact of the matter is, you are
going to be present and involved in observing many dozens of kills each season. The avg person is simply just
NOT going to have that sort of exposure to that number of kills each season ,on big game animals............... that's the reality of it. So I would inject here that someone like Ross's opinion on choosing a caliber is certainly worth weighing up probably vastly more than the average person or gun writers opinion is, just because he has seen a way more actual kills over the years............
After 45 years of guiding hunters myself,all over the world,I have pretty much come to the exact same conclusion as Ross has. Here are a couple of things that are reality: You can NOT shoot a .460 Weatherby as well as you can a .222 , However if you "think you can"or say "you can"then I am glad for you....................
And if you have a 338 RUM or 340 WM/378WM,and "you believe"you will have a huge advantage over the other fellow in camp, shooting his fathers old boring 30/06, with 180 gr Partitions on a Moose/ Elk hunt;your probably just kidding yourself. More than likely he will flatten his at 150 yds, and you will likely wind up trying one, at 450 yds, same as they do on " Best of the West". Ditto for hunting big bears, the 06 with 220gr bullets will flatten em IF you hit them correctly. IF you don't a magnum caliber won't save you, I have seen brown bears shot with 458 WM slightly too far back run off like you had shot them with a 22 rim fire!
So Ross is 110% right weather you want to believe it or not............
The sad truth is " it ain't the arrow, it's the Indian"
The 6.5 x55 , 7x57 , .270W and the grand old 30/06 have all
Proven this many thousands of times.
Scotty: here is the far shoulder after the ABLR did its damage! I just took care of the meat today!
Guy Miner
Master Loader
- Apr 6, 2006
- 17,789
- 6,036
EOD Diver":r18x2767 said:
Joe - that's a great article and one that I read some time ago. We, as hunters, need to read more of these articles and absorb what some of the more seasoned & sensible gunwriters have to say.
My best advice re hunting rifles is to hunt with the rifle you shoot well.
Regards, Guy
truck driver
Ammo Smith
- Mar 11, 2013
- 7,342
- 924
Yep I started down that Brain road and now I have 3 more rifles. I felt handicapped with the short barreled 30-06 I have to hunt out west since it is set up for close quarter hunting.SJB358":1b75829i said:
If I was 10yrs younger I wouldn't even thought about needing an extra edge.
- Thread starter
- #29
35 Whelen
Handloader
- Dec 22, 2011
- 2,237
- 516
Scotty is saying it best....... it's right between the your ears! Folks needs to realize ,
That with these premium bullets we have today , many of the older caliber deer rifles, 6.5/7mm/270 class, are now;Very cape able to dispatch much larger animals than many folks of the " heavy bullet"
crowd, would expect. Case n Point: Jim Carmichel, after taking O' Conners perch; Once wrote a long article explaining all the merits of a .280 over the .270 and bacially it addressed the fact that nearly identical ballistics, and only .007 different in bullet diameter, the .280 just had a VASTLY greater selection of bullets available for it!(At the time) Simple as that! But of course nowadays, with all the premium bullets like the 150 gr AccuBond LR involved; ( flight path of a Berger VLD) that is simply NOT the case. To say a 280 shooting 150/160 gr bullets would be a better choice for and Elk or Moose than a .270 with the same weight bullets would be like saying Chocolate is better than Vanilla??? Ditto on the arguement about buying into simply wanting a " heavier bullet" ???
Certainly silly to lug a big heavy magnum rifle around, when it's just not nessasary!
A standard Ballistic Tip works perfect out to 300 yds as everyone all ready knows, however it should be noted for bog hunting Moose , or shooting across parks in the west for Elk, the soft nose of this AccuBond at reduced velocitys certainly is going to be advantageous on LONG shots.
400 yds is not 100 yds and the AccuBond was designed for this long range stuff and it works! I got
Lucky and found a load quickly that shoots good in my Tikka with RL 26 though I realize a lot of guns are fussy about shooting them in a 10 twist barrel and I am assuming the 26 velocities are helping me in this case over come the twist issue ? I hate posting pics of targets but this was the results of 58grs of RL 26 at 200 yds. I am aware everyone on here can probably outshoot me but I
Was real happy with this grouping.
That with these premium bullets we have today , many of the older caliber deer rifles, 6.5/7mm/270 class, are now;Very cape able to dispatch much larger animals than many folks of the " heavy bullet"
crowd, would expect. Case n Point: Jim Carmichel, after taking O' Conners perch; Once wrote a long article explaining all the merits of a .280 over the .270 and bacially it addressed the fact that nearly identical ballistics, and only .007 different in bullet diameter, the .280 just had a VASTLY greater selection of bullets available for it!(At the time) Simple as that! But of course nowadays, with all the premium bullets like the 150 gr AccuBond LR involved; ( flight path of a Berger VLD) that is simply NOT the case. To say a 280 shooting 150/160 gr bullets would be a better choice for and Elk or Moose than a .270 with the same weight bullets would be like saying Chocolate is better than Vanilla??? Ditto on the arguement about buying into simply wanting a " heavier bullet" ???
Certainly silly to lug a big heavy magnum rifle around, when it's just not nessasary!
A standard Ballistic Tip works perfect out to 300 yds as everyone all ready knows, however it should be noted for bog hunting Moose , or shooting across parks in the west for Elk, the soft nose of this AccuBond at reduced velocitys certainly is going to be advantageous on LONG shots.
400 yds is not 100 yds and the AccuBond was designed for this long range stuff and it works! I got
Lucky and found a load quickly that shoots good in my Tikka with RL 26 though I realize a lot of guns are fussy about shooting them in a 10 twist barrel and I am assuming the 26 velocities are helping me in this case over come the twist issue ? I hate posting pics of targets but this was the results of 58grs of RL 26 at 200 yds. I am aware everyone on here can probably outshoot me but I
Was real happy with this grouping.
- Thread starter
- #31
35 Whelen
Handloader
- Dec 22, 2011
- 2,237
- 516
I am on it Scotman, my hunter Kris is talking now of buying a 270 Tikka himself! He said same thing couldn't believe it would do what it does! He likes .444 Marlins and 33 Winchesters but couldn't wrap his mind around the fact that the Z600 reticle would put him right on the money at 400 yds! And was blow away what 150 grs does to an 800 lb animal ,When it's put in the right place!
I will work on up over 60 grs ,and see what cracking 3000 fps, does to the group size?
For LR hunting, this combo has great potential! Under 300 yds of course there is lots of combos that will work just as well, for that mater the little 6.5 Swede, with a good bullet would do anything you would need it to do, with less recoil ! And I hear the little 7/08 is getting stellar reports, here on Maine Moose, with premium bullets.
I only broached the subject because ,if you have a "long range application"where a 4/500 yd shot is possible ,This AccuBond bullet has a nitch!
Funny how time changes your thinking I started out in Alaska with a .375H&H and a .300Win Mag as my two go to guns. After 10 years I had swapped both for a .338WM and a 7mmRM. And the last 15 years I simply hunted everything with a lowly 30/06 except When guiding Brown Bear hunters still
Had the .338. Now after all these years of guiding hunters, I am completely comfortable to have left all the Magnum calibers behind:?So when I am up in Alaska now;the 35 Whelen does everything "back up"just fine, However the .270 makes a perfect Caribou/ Sheep / Blacktail/ Black Bear cartridge and for LR ( over 300 yds) Moose shots ( even though I would always prefer to get closer) this AccuBond bullet has advantages bucking the wind, retained velocity, and expand much better at reduced velocitys.
So I say " pass the Accubonds please" .......... I would certainly not be opposed to trying a 190gr AccuBond LR out of my 30/06 either! Or that new 168gr LR for that matter. These gun manufactures
Are going to need to address this twist issue, in the near future. And offer us all factory rifles,that will stabilize these long skinny projectiles correctly! So that everyone can take advantage of them, not just the guys with custom rebarrels and tuned handloads.
To quote Gerrys post below: I can personally see NO difference in how the .270 kills stuff in anyway
To my old 7mm RM with these modern powders/ bullets.........none what so ever; except I sure as hell, can see a HUGE difference,between sacking around a "9 plus pound gun"all day vs a 7 lb one!! :shock:
I will work on up over 60 grs ,and see what cracking 3000 fps, does to the group size?
For LR hunting, this combo has great potential! Under 300 yds of course there is lots of combos that will work just as well, for that mater the little 6.5 Swede, with a good bullet would do anything you would need it to do, with less recoil ! And I hear the little 7/08 is getting stellar reports, here on Maine Moose, with premium bullets.
I only broached the subject because ,if you have a "long range application"where a 4/500 yd shot is possible ,This AccuBond bullet has a nitch!
Funny how time changes your thinking I started out in Alaska with a .375H&H and a .300Win Mag as my two go to guns. After 10 years I had swapped both for a .338WM and a 7mmRM. And the last 15 years I simply hunted everything with a lowly 30/06 except When guiding Brown Bear hunters still
Had the .338. Now after all these years of guiding hunters, I am completely comfortable to have left all the Magnum calibers behind:?So when I am up in Alaska now;the 35 Whelen does everything "back up"just fine, However the .270 makes a perfect Caribou/ Sheep / Blacktail/ Black Bear cartridge and for LR ( over 300 yds) Moose shots ( even though I would always prefer to get closer) this AccuBond bullet has advantages bucking the wind, retained velocity, and expand much better at reduced velocitys.
So I say " pass the Accubonds please" .......... I would certainly not be opposed to trying a 190gr AccuBond LR out of my 30/06 either! Or that new 168gr LR for that matter. These gun manufactures
Are going to need to address this twist issue, in the near future. And offer us all factory rifles,that will stabilize these long skinny projectiles correctly! So that everyone can take advantage of them, not just the guys with custom rebarrels and tuned handloads.
To quote Gerrys post below: I can personally see NO difference in how the .270 kills stuff in anyway
To my old 7mm RM with these modern powders/ bullets.........none what so ever; except I sure as hell, can see a HUGE difference,between sacking around a "9 plus pound gun"all day vs a 7 lb one!! :shock:
gerry
Ammo Smith
- Mar 1, 2007
- 6,908
- 1,791
SJB358":2faovhqk said:
Had a reply earlier that disappeared into space somewhere.
Anyway, since getting my 270 Win it has kind of made my 264 WM and 7 mm RM obsolete and that is just with IMR 7977. Add the extra speed that RL 26 gets it even further cuts into the territory of both of the magnum cartridges. RL 26 should help out the 7 mm RM too but a 145 gr ELD-X and 150 gr ABLR at over 3000 fps out of a 270 Win makes it quite a formidable round. Don't get me wrong I still like the 264 in particular but the 270 and modern powders is really good.
6mm Remington
Ammo Smith
- Feb 27, 2006
- 5,255
- 626
Great story and nothing wrong with the 270 at all! Great cartridge.
- Thread starter
- #37
35 Whelen
Handloader
- Dec 22, 2011
- 2,237
- 516
Pretty interesting a 6.5x55 has shot more moose in Sweeden than all other calibers combined.........but someone that has never even hunted moose will tell
you in a NY minute " I prefer atleast a 338WM as a minimum......omg.
Ditto on Elk, hunted a ranch out of Norwood, Co back the
Early 80's the old fella that owned the place had his Dads
Model 54 Winchester in .270W . He told me that gun had
Accounted for many dozens of Bull Elk and they never
Had a problem.............but 90% of the folks that have never
Even fired at an Elk will have the opinion.......300/338 Mag
As basic minimum. Go figure.
you in a NY minute " I prefer atleast a 338WM as a minimum......omg.
Ditto on Elk, hunted a ranch out of Norwood, Co back the
Early 80's the old fella that owned the place had his Dads
Model 54 Winchester in .270W . He told me that gun had
Accounted for many dozens of Bull Elk and they never
Had a problem.............but 90% of the folks that have never
Even fired at an Elk will have the opinion.......300/338 Mag
As basic minimum. Go figure.
