Accubonds and Ballistic Tips

[Vince]

Didn't get to the range today like I'd planned.

It seems this monsoon weather is playing fits with my knee. Ol' Arthur decided to pay me a visit and make the day plumb unenjoyable. Anyway, if you've been following my progress on here, I've got the Ballistic Tips shooting at 0.7" off the bench in my rifle. I'm really trying to squeeze as much accuracy as I can out of a Remington 700 Police Sniper .300 Win Mag. So tonight I made up a test run of loads that are crimped.

Truth be told I'm a little nervous crimping my rounds because I ran in to some trouble when working up loads for my 25/06 and having too tight of a crimp. This time I "barely kissed it" as a friend would say. We'll see if this brings my 0.7" groups down to what I consider an acceptable group size. I'm looking for 0.5" or less.

This brings me to the other half of my post, the Accubonds. I'm wanting to use the Accubonds on bear, elk, moose, and any other target I deem appropriate. If I can't get them to shoot in my rifle, and I'm really trying here folks, would you suggest I look at the Barnes Triple Shocks? I tend to favor shooting the heart/lung over the shoulder as I find it waste less meat. That has me leaning towards the Ballistic Tips but given that I shoot at 300 - 600+ Yards on game, on average, I'm looking for the most accuracy I can squeeze out of any rifle I shoot. I was thinking that at the longer ranges I want a better penetrating bullet than what the Ballistic Tips are known for on game larger than deer.

This ain't paper I'm shooting although I do spend a fair amount of time shooting paper throughout the year at distance to prepare for hunting season. Given the distances, and the myriad of variables that distance shooting can impart, is the Ballistic Tip a viable option for non-deer size animals?

What say you all?

 

[DrMike]

I've certainly had good success with TSXs in a variety of rifles; I've also had a couple of incidents that gave me some concern. At the impact velocities in question, I shouldn't imagine that you'll have much difficulty with the BTs penetrating. If that is a concern, focus on developing a load using either the PT or the AB. There is always the E-Tip, as well. If a TSX is in the mix, then an E-Tip will give performance that is as good or perhaps even better. I've sure been pleased with the performance of the E-Tip on several large game animals.

 

[Vince]

Thank you Dr. Mike.

Hunting season is fast approaching and I'm starting to run out of time. I should be doping my drops by now and shooting out to 800 Yards with whatever load I'm going to use. I'll play with the Accubonds a little more and see what I can develop.

 

[Guy Miner]

Vince, a buddy of mine took his .300 Win mag to Africa for plains game. He shot all sorts of African antelope while over there and mostly used 180 gr Nosler Ballistic Tips. He, and his PH, were both very impressed with the quick kills imparted by the Ballistic Tips.

As tough as they're built anymore, with that heavy base, I'd have no problem using Ballistic Tips for elk. None at all.

Also - I don't crimp cartridges for my bolt action rifles, not at all. Not even the .300 RUM when I had it. The crimp certainly wasn't necessary for excellent accuracy and consistent velocity. What really helps my loads is when I get real consistent with the neck sizing, and do a real good job of seating the bullets straight. Those two things, along with using the appropriate powder & bullet, seem to be very important when it comes to building accurate ammo, for me.

With the .300 Win mag, I'd be looking real hard at Reloader 22 to go with those 180's...

Regards, Guy

 

[Vince]

Thanks Guy.

I'm using RL22 after trying IMR 4350, H4831, and IMR 7828. It's really good to hear about your buddy using the BT on African game. That does a lot to ease my mind.

 

[Silentstalker]

Would you consider the .270 150 gr. BT tough enough for elk too or just the bigger bore/gr. bullets?

 

[DrMike]

At the velocities generated by the 270 Win, the 150 grain BT will work well on elk.

 

[Silentstalker]

Thanks! My rifle is shooting them really well. My son drew a cow tag and I still dont have any AccuBond LR. With summers busy schedule and bowhunts starting in about a month, I think I will stick with the BT for now. I was thinking they should do the job!

 

[Antelope_Sniper]

Vince, Guy Miner really hit this one out of the park.
On average the BT's just plain shooter better the the AB's.
The 180gr BT will do everything you could ever ask of it out of a 300 WM.
With 180grs of mass you don't really need the bonding. They are accurate, open quickly, leave big holes, and are reasonable priced.

 

[Oldtrader3]

I never crimp any loads except for use in a lever action or DGR. The loads normally will get a shellac-like, dielectric bonding of the bullet to the case neck anyway, within a month or so of loading. This dielectric bonding is usually consistent enough in shear strength to keep bullets from being pushed back in most bolt action magazines.

 

[Kodiak]

What really helps my loads is when I get real consistent with the neck sizing, and do a real good job of seating the bullets straight.

Regards, Guy

What Guy says above .... the smaller the run-out, the smaller the groups.

 

[Wincheringen]

The Ballistic Tip - Hunting is improperly named. It is much tougher than most give it credit for. At the long ranges you propose, I would rather have the BT over the AB anyway. I hunt to harvest game, not pretty mushrooms.

 

[Oldtrader3]

I like pretty mushrooms, especially for elk rifles!

 

[FOTIS]

Take a look in the bullet testing forum. There are some prime examples there.

 

[Vince]

I gave up on the Accubonds.

I'll just stick with the Ballistic Tips and aim for the heart/lung. I have yet to see a deer inside 100 Yards that I can get a shot at so I focus on the longer range stuff. The 87 Grain Varmint Bullets in my 25/06 worked well on antelope last year so who knows? I might be pleasantly surprised by the Ballistic Tips.

 

[Oldtrader3]

The 85 grain ballistic tips are very accurate in my .257 Roberts and they are fast as well.

 

[IdahoCTD]

You might try H1000 too if you have some. I have never crimped a rifle case. As a matter of fact, most times I find that my guns shoot better with lighter neck tension rather than more. Maybe try a neck die or a bushing die to try and reduce neck tension.

 

[Guest]

Something to remember is that the Hunting BTs really came in two different classes, before Accubonds came around. The lighter stuff, meaning anything less than 180gr, was for thin-skinned game. The 180gr and up stuff was rated for medium game up to and including elk. That's right out of Nosler tech support about two years before the AB made its debut. Of course, it pays to remember there are no 180gr or heavier BTs in anything smaller than .308cal, and that's true even today. Of course, there just aren't very many BTs above that mark at all anymore. I've personally used one - the 180gr BT in .323cal with a muzzle velocity of 2720fps out of my 8x57 - on white-tails and can tell you it is anything but fragile. It made a nice hole going in, of about bore diameter, and a hole about the size of a golf ball going out. No bang-flop, but a dead deer that ran 60yds into some tall grass, and took me 2.5hrs to find in the dark. Part of that was my fault. I hit the deer a little high, so the shot went in the top of the rib cage, through the top of both lungs, and exited via the liver on the off-side. Also took out the esophagus on the way through. Point is, that's one tough BT, hitting ribs on the way in, plenty of tissue, and exiting, without the violent expansion so often complained about. And that shot was at about 140yds. Contrast that with the 168gr BT at 181yds (mv 2920fps from my -06) through a doe that expanded much more, and much more violently.

The heavier BTs (180 and up) are pretty stout. At longer ranges, where impact velocity will be well below 2800fps, I'd have zero issues about putting them through an elk.

 

[ElmerThud]

For interest, a good friend I hunt with in Scotland uses a .243Win Browning A bolt with 95gn Nosler Ballistic tip...has done so for years. In the last two seasons he's taken three 23stone red stags with his load, 44.5gn Vit N160. Not to mention of course 18 hinds in the same period, also with the same load.

Shot placement is everything when using this combination on rutting stags. A deer not so much smaller than elk stags, although they are a smaller species than elk.

For over ten years I used the Sierra Prohunter 100gn 1620 in my .25-06 on everything shootable here in the UK, but two years ago began to sort a load out for it using the AccuBond.
It took a while to find the right load recipe with help from some of you guys on here, but it works just fine now and I wouldn't hesitate to use the combination on any European and most North American game out to 300yds........don't know about hogs though. Never shot any and probably .25-06 is a bit 'light' for wild boar.

Do I like the AB more than the BT? - Well, the answer is yes I do.
Not that the BT isn't a good bullet, it most certainly is....it just didn't provide that bit more weight and energy at longer ranges. The BT didn't appear to do anything the 100gn Sierra wouldn't do, but is twice the price of the Sierra in the UK.

The AB is a 'leap forward' but still expensive and hard to locate in .257" in the UK. The difference is: It delivers a quicker kill at 300+yds.
Now, I have a small but growing stock of the .257" 110gn AB's. I buy them whenever I find them.
ATB ET

 

[SJB358]

ET, those are some pretty little groups right there and man, those rounds look danged sharp as well. Great shooting! I know how hard you worked for those AB's to shoot and it looks like you found the magic mark now.

I like the AB's. Really are a great blend of the PT and BT. I have no qualms of using the BT's with the heavier weights, but still tend to favor the PT's and AB's for elk hunting. The extra confidence of the bullet means more to me with heavier animals such as elk.