It doesn't take a lot of cartridge, just a good shot

I love the 6 mm class including the ol .243 , but that is pushing the envelope. Maybe I am bias but I reserve those types of shots for vermin not big game.
 
Thebear_78":32si60ui said:
I don't doubt that placed right in the ribcage, even at long ranges, the berger could be very deadly. I just feel better with a higher chance of an exit.

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That's actually why, although I like the Berger VLD's, I went back to my favorite hunting bullet, the Nolser Ballistic Tip, for my deer & pronghorn hunting. It too is a very quick killer, but has substantially more strength, and tends to hang together well enough to penetrate deeper and likely exit.

Never did worship at the altar of retained bullet weight though. I figure a quick kill is what I'm really after. If the bullet breaks up somewhat while doing that. I can accept that.

Regards, Guy
 
Oh my, I am still worshipping at the alter of retained bullet weight with Partitions. :mrgreen: I do use the Accubonds in some calibers though, .257 Roberts , 7mm mag, .30-06.
 
Guy Miner":39cr5xeu said:
Frankly, after using them, I think it's the Berger VLD bullet. It is an instant killer in my experience. Only three mule deer, from the 115 gr .25 cal Berger, but not even a twitch after the bullet hit in two of the three. One severed the spine (shot from way above) and the buck needed a second shot into the lungs to finish him. They are devastatingly deadly bullets, usually breaking up in the vitals.

So, placed well, they produce instant, or near-instant death, even at long range.

But, that's just my thought. Others WILL disagree.

Regards, Guy

I'll disagree with you after my expierence w them in my 264.
Had one explode on contact w an Auodad sheep hit low behind onside shoulder at 150 yards.
All it did was blow a 2 inch hole in the hide and not one fragment made it throught the rib cage.

The next one was an Auodad as well. Quartering to me at 35 yards. Point of impact was base of the neck/shoulder junction.

Goat number one then took two 62 gr .223 BTHPs through the lungs at 25 yards and still managed to cover about 400 yards straight up a ridge.
Goat number two went 75 yards into a cactus thicket.

Maybe at extended ranges they would behave differently, I'll never know
 
That is why I always look at them with a stink eye. Good out far bullets I am sure, but they do have an upper window that is tricky with the big jugged cases...
 
Scott that may have been the case in my circumstances.
I was running them at 3400 fps out of the muzzle.

Creedmore's son shot a 100 lb Tx whitetail with one out of his 25-06.
It's only got a 22 inch barrel, not a velocity champion in any sense.
115 Berger hit the deer quartering away behind onside shoulder 1/3 way up body.
Deer jumped into a cedar thicket and disappeared.
A couple drops of blood where deer was standing.
It was close to dark.
The deer went 75 yards or so, but the only reason they found him was his eyes glowing in a flashlight.
Insides were scrambled, liquified nearly.
Bullet was under the offside hide and the other shoulder was ruined.....
 
Years ago I bought some 140 gr. PT's in 7mm for my wifes 7X57. I couldn't bear the temptation so I loaded some with 65 gr. IMR 4350 for the 7 mag.
I shot a small buck at about 10 yards. It blew a hole about 4" diameter where the bullet hit. I could see it real well as the deer ran off. It fell about 20 yds. away quite dead. The exit hole was about an inch in diameter.
Point is; There WAS an exit hole. Pretty good performance in my book.
The deer my wife took at 7X57 velocitys gave much better, textbook bullet performance. Of course all her shots were well beyond 10 yards also.
 
HTDUCK":3kcadbuj said:
Scott that may have been the case in my circumstances.
I was running them at 3400 fps out of the muzzle.

Creedmore's son shot a 100 lb Tx whitetail with one out of his 25-06.
It's only got a 22 inch barrel, not a velocity champion in any sense.
115 Berger hit the deer quartering away behind onside shoulder 1/3 way up body.
Deer jumped into a cedar thicket and disappeared.
A couple drops of blood where deer was standing.
It was close to dark.
The deer went 75 yards or so, but the only reason they found him was his eyes glowing in a flashlight.
Insides were scrambled, liquified nearly.
Bullet was under the offside hide and the other shoulder was ruined.....

Howard, I'm with you brother. I'll stick to what works.

A fella told me a little while back, we are not bullet testers, were hunters and should know exactly what to expect when our bullets hit game. There should be no guesswork. This fellas happens to shoot Partitions primarily and he's right. As a hunter, I'll give up some of the BC to know what is going to happen when flesh is hit.
 
I have witnessed 4 seperate bullet failures in my lifetime. The first in 59 when my dad shot his first elk. A Sierra 180 gr., failed to penetrate a large bull elks ,shoulder bone, in a 30:06. The bull was recovered several shots later, a ways, away. Second was a 180 gr. Silvertips, out of a 300 Savage at 100 yards or so. The bull was quartering away, and the bullet failed to penetrate and channeled, pretty much the full length of the elk along, the "outside" of the ribs. This slowed him down significantly, and another round from the 99 put him down. I personally put two, 180 Speer GS, into, two large Mule Deer does, facing me at 20 yards. Killed both instantly, with high chest shots. A "significant" amount of meat loss. Speer said they were not designed to work out of a WM at close range.
I have two cow elk, both well hit with a 180 Barnes TSX, require what I though was an unnecessary second shot. Not a failure, but very irritating to say the least.
I want to see blood, lots of blood from "both" sides. It makes things much easier in the dark. I have trailed a few right up to their dead body, with a headlamp.
 
I have had two bullet failures during my hunting career, both on elk. The first was a 175 gr Corelokt from a 7mm Rem Mag at about 80 yards, shoulder shot did not penetrate and I never saw the elk again, despite looking for several hours with no blood trail. The second failure was a 180 gr Failsafe at about 125 yards. I got a second shot a few minutes later and a 100 yards further. The second shot killed the bull elk with a heart shot.

I have used mostly Partitions for 50 years and have never had a failure with a Partition.
 
The first deer I shot was a bullet failure.
Hornady, Factory GMX, .308 Ruger Scout Rifle.

Looked to be a heart / lung shot and all indicators were that he was hit good. Ten hours later we still couldn't find that sucker. He was coughing up blood and walked in to a covered area and bedded down.

I'm not a fan of the GMX. It requires more velocity than the Barnes bullet to work properly. That's strike one. Strike two was my choice of rifle and one I'll not repeat for hunting in the desert southwest. A wee bit more speed than what that short barreled Col Cooper aberration gives. As a truck gun it's handy but as a rifle for making 300+ yard shots on game I find it lacking.
The bullet choice was my fault and so was the selection of the rifle.

I learned a lot that year and I'm still learning. I pay a lot more attention to bullet performance these days.

Somewhere out there is a coues deer that died a slow death. When we went to get him he jumped up an ran downhill while the other two ran uphill. That's an indicator he was hurting but I was unable to get another bullet in him. I looked for him with help from two friends to no avail.

Like I said, it was a learning experience for me. I've changed my POA and pay a lot more attention to bullet performance and velocity to know how far I can reasonably expect my chosen bullet to perform.

Vince


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Guy Miner":30uxiq66 said:
I've maintained that for 40 years, since starting to hunt with a 6mm Remington. Time to time I do use the larger bores, even up to .375, .458 and a muzzle loader in .50 cal... But mostly it's been .24 and .25 cal rifles.

Quite the example here, elk at 688 yards, with a .243 Winchester! Nice shooting...

https://video.search.yahoo.com/video/pl ... mp=yhs-001


Guy
I'm with you Guy, my first big game rifle was a Remington 700 BDL 6mm Rem. I have shot many Deer & Antelope with it as well my Son shot his first Antelope with it. I would not hesitate to shoot a Deer out to 500-600 Yds with it. When I bought my Son a Rifle it was a 25-06, I would of bought him a 6mm Rem but Remington's 700 CDL does not come in 6mm Rem.
I also feel most people shoot a larger caliber than needed. I my self bought into all the hype and shoot a .264 Win Mag now, but I would be just as successful with my old 6mm Rem. Even though I practice and have my .264 Win Mag set up for 700-800 yds shots I have only once shot more than 500 yds & it was just over that. My average shot on Antelope in both WY & MT has been just under 300 yds & Mule Deer less than that.
 
G'Day Fella's,

Some great shooting!
Not my idea of hunting but no denying, that was very impressive shooting and a quick, clean kill!!!

I have read and heard, that Elk/Wapiti are not difficult animals to kill.
How true is this and also, is this above video, a good example of this?

Doh!
Homer
 
Homer,

Actually, elk can be quite hardy. Their bones are quite strong. I've seen elk travel some amazing distances after a shot that would have killed a moose. They can clear the county in very short time. Still, a hole through the lungs and/or heart is going to mean a dead animal, regardless of how hardy they may be.
 
DrMike":vf1d3t4x said:
Homer,

Actually, elk can be quite hardy. Their bones are quite strong. I've seen elk travel some amazing distances after a shot that would have killed a moose. They can clear the county in very short time. Still, a hole through the lungs and/or heart is going to mean a dead animal, regardless of how hardy they may be.

Couldn't have said it better. They are tough but still die like anything else when poked through the lungs with a decent bullet.
 
Most of the deer that I have shoot died within 10 yards of where I shot them. My .257 R with 110 Accubonds will kill deer dead within a few yards. My .270 Win is a laser on deer to 400 yards.

Elk are a different animal but any .300 mag or .338 will kill an elk in decent time. My Model 70, .30-06 kills them fine when I use 180 Partitions. Just like the .338's better, more insurance.
 
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