Max Load for N160 with 130 grain Accubond in Modern 6.5x55SE

[azsixshooter]

I emailed Nosler to ask if they could give me a max load limit for using N160 with 130 grain Accubonds out of my 6.5x55 CZ550 American. I normally load 48 grains of N560 with 130 grain Accubonds for good results, but I'm out of that and I have a couple of pounds of the N160 I want to use.

Vihtavuori's data lists a 130 grain Norma HPBT and says that the starting load is 43 grains and max load is 47.3 grains, but that is the closest I have been able to find. I'm planning to start at 45.3 grains and work up towards 47.3 using my chronograph and mic'ing the caseheads to keep track of any expansion and keeping an eye on other pressure signs too. But I was hoping Nosler might be able to give me a number for max loads for this bullet. They replied to my email with a link to these forums so I thought I would drop a post here and see if anyone had any experience with this combination while I wait to hear back from someone at Nosler.

I've always been a big fan of Nosler bullets and I have shot both the 120 grain Ballistic Tips and the 130 grain Accubonds out of my Swede for many years. I would like to work up some other loads too, such as a 100 grain Partition load my daughter might be able to start shooting for youth deer here in Michigan and a 140 grain AccuBond load. Or possibly the 142 grain LR AccuBond. I'm pretty happy with the 130 grain Accubonds though, with the N560 I'm getting around 2800 fps with the 130 grain Accubonds so the MPBR trajectory is nipping at the heels of the .270 with less powder and less recoil I think.

Anyway, thanks for any info you might have and God bless you.

 

[gerry]

Welcome to the forum. I'm a big fan of the 6.5x55, we have one in a Tikka. Haven't used that exact combination but I'm sure there are some who will be able to give you some info.
Shot a deer last year with the 100 gr Partition (260 Rem) and it works well. Not as accurate as other bullets though. H 4895 with 120 gr Ballistic Tips was what I loaded for my wife to start with hunting and it would be great for your daughter, low recoil and accurate. The 130 gr AccuBond is a favorite bullet in our 6.5's.

 

[azsixshooter]

Thanks Gerry, I like your signature. I was just reading a book last night called "Alone In The Wilderness" and the section I was reading about hunting rifles was written by Col Townsend Whelen. I would like to read more of his work. I might be coming into an old sporterized M1903A3 and I had thoughts about turning it into a .338-06 or a .35 Whelen. I appreciate your welcome and your feedback on the lighter bullets for new shooters.

 

[SJB358]

I’ve never used 160 or 560 in the Swede but I’d bet if you provide your barrel length one of the kind folks here can run a Quickload profile for you to give you some good starting and ending places. If you have a modern Swede I’d also ask them to set the PSI at 58-60K so you can see what is possible for your cartridge combo.

That 130 AccuBond has been impressive in quite a few rifles for me. From the 6.5 Creed to the 264 Win Mag.

 

[DrMike]

Cartridge          : 6.5 x 55 Swedish
Bullet             : .264, 130, Nosler AccuBond 56902
Useable Case Capaci: 52.511 grain H2O = 3.409 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.150 inch = 80.01 mm
Barrel Length      : 22.0 inch = 558.8 mm
Powder             : Vihtavuori N160 *C

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-10.0   81    40.23   2486    1784   39443  10133     97.5    1.360
-09.0   82    40.68   2512    1822   40647  10239     97.8    1.340
-08.0   83    41.12   2538    1859   41887  10341     98.1    1.321
-07.0   84    41.57   2564    1898   43163  10440     98.4    1.302
-06.0   85    42.02   2590    1936   44475  10535     98.6    1.284
-05.0   86    42.47   2616    1975   45827  10626     98.9    1.266
-04.0   87    42.91   2641    2014   47217  10714     99.1    1.249  ! Near Maximum !
-03.0   88    43.36   2667    2053   48649  10797     99.3    1.231  ! Near Maximum !
-02.0   89    43.81   2692    2093   50123  10877     99.5    1.214  ! Near Maximum !
-01.0   90    44.25   2718    2132   51640  10952     99.6    1.197  ! Near Maximum !
+00.0   90    44.70   2743    2172   53201  11023     99.7    1.181  ! Near Maximum !
+01.0   91    45.15   2769    2213   54810  11090     99.8    1.165  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0   92    45.59   2794    2253   56466  11153     99.9    1.149  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.0   93    46.04   2819    2294   58171  11211    100.0    1.133  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0   94    46.49   2844    2335   59928  11264    100.0    1.118  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+05.0   95    46.94   2869    2376   61738  11313    100.0    1.103  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 5% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 5% relative to nominal value:
+Ba     90    44.70   2803    2268   58157  10829    100.0    1.136  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 5% relative to nominal value:
-Ba     90    44.70   2671    2060   48288  11074     98.3    1.232  ! Near Maximum !

 

[DrMike]

Per Scott's suggestion of setting the maximum chamber pressure to 60K:

Cartridge          : 6.5 x 55 Swedish
Bullet             : .264, 130, Nosler AccuBond 56902
Useable Case Capaci: 52.511 grain H2O = 3.409 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.150 inch = 80.01 mm
Barrel Length      : 22.0 inch = 558.8 mm
Powder             : Vihtavuori N160 *C

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-10.0   84    41.49   2559    1891   42929  10422     98.3    1.306
-09.0   85    41.95   2586    1930   44276  10521     98.6    1.287
-08.0   86    42.41   2613    1970   45664  10616     98.9    1.268
-07.0   87    42.87   2639    2010   47095  10706     99.1    1.250
-06.0   88    43.33   2666    2051   48568  10793     99.3    1.232
-05.0   89    43.80   2692    2092   50086  10875     99.5    1.214
-04.0   90    44.26   2718    2133   51650  10953     99.6    1.197  ! Near Maximum !
-03.0   91    44.72   2744    2174   53262  11026     99.7    1.180  ! Near Maximum !
-02.0   91    45.18   2770    2215   54923  11095     99.8    1.164  ! Near Maximum !
-01.0   92    45.64   2796    2257   56635  11159     99.9    1.148  ! Near Maximum !
+00.0   93    46.10   2822    2299   58400  11218    100.0    1.131  ! Near Maximum !
+01.0   94    46.56   2848    2341   60220  11273    100.0    1.116  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0   95    47.02   2874    2384   62097  11322    100.0    1.100  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.0   96    47.48   2899    2426   64033  11370    100.0    1.085  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0   97    47.94   2924    2469   66029  11418    100.0    1.070  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+05.0   98    48.41   2950    2511   68089  11464    100.0    1.056  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 5% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 5% relative to nominal value:
+Ba     93    46.10   2879    2393   63811  10989    100.0    1.089  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 5% relative to nominal value:
-Ba     93    46.10   2753    2187   53024  11346     99.1    1.180  ! Near Maximum !

 

[gerry]

Thanks Gerry, I like your signature. I was just reading a book last night called "Alone In The Wilderness" and the section I was reading about hunting rifles was written by Col Townsend Whelen. I would like to read more of his work. I might be coming into an old sporterized M1903A3 and I had thoughts about turning it into a .338-06 or a .35 Whelen. I appreciate your welcome and your feedback on the lighter bullets for new shooters.

Lot's of love for those two rounds here and also the 9.3x62, can't go wrong with any of them. I chose the 35 Whelen myself and haven't regretted it.

The 100 gr Ballistic Tip would be another good one for a reduced recoil load in your 6.5x55. Should work about as well as the 120 gr version. When I started my wife shooting her rifle we started with Trail Boss and some cheap 140's. Didn't take too long and we were using the 120 gr BT H 4895 load mentioned earlier and then went to H 4350 full power loads with the 120 gr BT for a bit more speed. Trail Boss and H 4895 are such good powders to start new shooters out.

 

[azsixshooter]

Thank you so much SJB358 and DrMike! I certainly appreciate that. The 60K PSI profile matches the data VihtaVuori lists for the Norma 130 grain pretty close, within about a grain of what they say is a safe max load. I will definitely use this data here as the limiting factor though and not go above 46 grains. I have a 23" barrel so that is pretty close to the 22" barrel listed in the data. I'm looking for a nice accuracy load for general purpose deer hunting so I don't need to get too crazy. Anything around 2700 - 2800 fps will make me happy and like DrMike's signature says Accuracy Trumps Speed! Thanks again guys, these forums look really nice. I usually go to 24hourcampfire for hunting/shooting/reloading forums but I will be sure to visit this one more often. Have an awesome weekend!

 

[DrMike]

You'll find good people here. No one is trying to advance themselves at your expense. Good to see your query. Hope to see you more frequently. Consequently, let us know how the N160 works out for you. I've used a ton of the Vihta Vuori powders over the years, and always found good results.

 

[noslerpartition]

Nothing wrong with the 6,5 X 55.
I only got a Creedmoor because few rifles out there in Swede for lefties.

My ex-wifes first rifle was an old Mauser and she killed a few deer with it - with the AccuBond.

Those old rifles are the reason max pressure is rather low. The steel wasn't too good on some of them.
In a modern rifle you might go higher, but actually there is no need.
It does what it shall do within the official limits.

 

[SJB358]

You'll find good people here. No one is trying to advance themselves at your expense. Good to see your query. Hope to see you more frequently. Consequently, let us know how the N160 works out for you. I've used a ton of the Vihta Vuori powders over the years, and always found good results.

These days I am using more and more of the VV powders. Stuff is somewhat available and with the price hikes on others, it's no longer the most expensive and the few instances I have been using it, it is GOOD!

 

[Jimbeaux82]

I have used N160 extensively in my CZ 550 with 140 gr BT’s. I run 46.0 grs at 2730 fps with MOA accuracy

 

[Blkram]

Interesting thread here!
I have pretty much stuck to IMR4350 and 140 gr Partitions and X Bullets in the past for my previous 6.5x55 Swedes (Rem 700 Classics).
I do have a supply of the 130 and 140 AccuBonds to work up loads with in my LH Sako 85 Hunter...have some Re-26 to try...along with both N160 and 560.
Although, I am considering using the 140 in the Swede and the 130 in the Creedmoor...
Love the AccuBonds! So easy to find good loads for produces excellent accuracy, and performs very well on a wide spectrum of big game! My favourite hunting bullet!

I have shot the Nosler factory ammunition with the 140 AccuBond, and it is producing 1/2" groups in my Sako...just haven't taken game with it yet. A good load should be easy to find!

I did shoot the Nosler factory ammunition with the 130 AccuBond in my 6.5x284 Norma while I had it, and it to shot sub-MOA...unfortunately my only shot on game with it (mule deer buck) was off a shaky single shooting stick and missed clean at 300 yards...so no field experience with this bullet on game yet.
It should work every bit as good as the factory 6.5 Creedmoor Federal Premium 130 gr Terminal Ascent bullet just performed for my wife and I on red stag (296 yards), fallow buck (267 yards) and arapawa rams (120 and 122 yards). (shoots better than 3/4MOA in my rifle - LH Browning X Bolt All Weather)

 

[wvbuckbuster]

Welcome to the forum and good to see another 6.5x55 shooter. Can't give you any info on your load request but the good Dr has supplied that for you. I have used starting loads of IMR 4350, RL19 and H4895 with the Nosler 100gr BT for a reduced load in my Win Mod 70 Fwt that my grandson Landon put to good use on a couple of deer. I then moved him up to 45grs of IMR4350 with the 120gr BT and he didn't have any recoil issues. Hope this might be of help for you and your young ens. Dan.

 

[azsixshooter]

DrMike, I got Quickload 3.9 now and I attempted to match the data you provided, but I'm getting different results. I left everything set to default for 6.5x55SE and N160. I only changed my barrel length to 23", PSI to 60K (Piezo CIP was default there), COAL: 3.135", charge increment to 1% and lot-to-lot variation to 5%. I left the ratio to specific heats to the default 1.242 and since I am seating .020" off the lands I left the Shot Start (Initiation) Pressure to the default 3626.

It looks like I am getting data that shows a larger charge weight getting less velocity than the data you listed. I'm going to work up some loads today starting at 44.5 grains and ranging up to 46.5 grains and carefully chronograph, mic caseheads and watch for any signs of overpressure. I'm curious though, how my data might have come back so different than what you provided? It seems that if anything my velocity would be higher since you used a barrel length 1" shorter than mine. There is the difference in COAL too. I also see that the usable case capacity in your data is slightly different than what I have. I attribute that to the difference we have in COAL, if I'm not mistaken.

Any thoughts you might be able to share would be greatly appreciated sir! I will be reading through the users manual and doing everything I can to use this software safely and accurately. When I get back from the range I will have some empty cases with spent primers in them so I'll be able to measure the H20 capacity of my Lapua brass and get a more customized value for that setting. I will also have chronograph data to match against the Quickload data so that should help me make more sense of what is going on.

Here is the data I generated but I want to point out to anyone looking at this thread ***THIS DATA IS FOR REFERENCE ONLY*** I am not experienced with this software and I am only providing this as a way to try and improve the way I am using this software. It's very possible I may have something set way off inadvertently so I would discourage anyone from using this data to calculate loads until I can further test and provide real-world results here.

EDIT: Erroneous data removed for safety

Thanks again, have a great day!

Steve

 

[DrMike]

Making the adjustment for 23 inch barrel length at 60K psi max chamber pressure.

Cartridge          : 6.5 x 55 Swedish
Bullet             : .264, 130, Nosler AccuBond 56902
Useable Case Capaci: 52.511 grain H2O = 3.409 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.150 inch = 80.01 mm
Barrel Length      : 23.0 inch = 584.2 mm
Powder             : Vihtavuori N160 *C

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-10.0   84    41.67   2600    1951   43450   9941     98.7    1.331
-09.0   85    42.13   2627    1991   44819  10030     99.0    1.311
-08.0   86    42.60   2653    2032   46230  10114     99.2    1.293
-07.0   87    43.06   2680    2073   47684  10195     99.4    1.274
-06.0   88    43.52   2706    2114   49181  10271     99.5    1.256
-05.0   89    43.99   2733    2156   50725  10344     99.7    1.238
-04.0   90    44.45   2759    2197   52315  10412     99.8    1.220  ! Near Maximum !
-03.0   91    44.91   2785    2239   53955  10475     99.9    1.203  ! Near Maximum !
-02.0   92    45.37   2811    2281   55645  10534     99.9    1.187  ! Near Maximum !
-01.0   93    45.84   2837    2323   57387  10588    100.0    1.170  ! Near Maximum !
+00.0   94    46.30   2863    2366   59183  10638    100.0    1.154  ! Near Maximum !
+01.0   95    46.76   2889    2408   61036  10685    100.0    1.138  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0   96    47.23   2914    2451   62946  10730    100.0    1.122  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.0   97    47.69   2939    2494   64917  10775    100.0    1.107  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0   97    48.15   2965    2537   66951  10819    100.0    1.092  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+05.0   98    48.62   2990    2581   69049  10862    100.0    1.077  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 5% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 5% relative to nominal value:
+Ba     94    46.30   2918    2458   64661  10417    100.0    1.112  !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 5% relative to nominal value:
-Ba     94    46.30   2795    2255   53737  10798     99.3    1.203  ! Near Maximum !

 

[DrMike]

It is likely that the difference in usable case capacity between the two accounts for the difference. Your cartridge OAL is 3.135 rather than 3.150 as I used.

 

[azsixshooter]

Thanks DrMike! Even with the discrepancies in barrel length and COAL your data was ON POINT! I fired 6 shot groups of 44.5, 45.0, 45.5, 46.0 and a 7 shot group of 46.5. The velocities I was recording on my Chronograph 10 feet from the muzzle were extremely close to the data you provided. I didn't see any signs of overpressure and even with the 46.5 grain loads my casehead expansion was around .0003". I was a machinist for 9 years and I used some mics that were calibrated at the last shop I worked at so I'm somewhat confident in my measurements there.

With the 46.5 grain loads I had a SD of only 7 and that was because one round was 2849 fps and 5 others were all duplicates at 2842 fps. There was one odd round that went 2836 fps and hit low and made my 7 shot group 1.5", but the other 6 all grouped a very honest .906". That was significantly better than the rest, the next closest was 6 shots a little over an inch at 46.0 grains.

I am thinking I'll reload another 30 rounds or so in groups between 46 and 46.5 grains. I hate to go too close to 46.5 based on the pressures you provided me with. With my real-world velocities being so close to your predicted velocities I would imagine the pressure values are very accurate as well. Hopefully I'll find something between 46.0 and 46.5 that will do really well. I'm pretty excited about the performance I got here with this N160 and the 130 grain Accubonds. If I can safely load to 2800 fps and it's in the sweet spot for this combination I'll have a 280 yard maximum point blank range deer load that carries over 1500 psi at impact with an impact velocity that falls right in the middle of where these Accubonds are designed to operate, according to the box. As a general purpose Whitetail, Mulie, Antelope, etc load I think I'll be doing really well. The recoil is so light and I can get ~150 loads from a pound of powder so that is nice too! Out to 200 yards I wouldn't be afraid to shoot an elk with it, but if I go on any more elk hunts I'll be stepping up to a big 7 or something in the .300 - .338 range.

Another thing I want to mention. I have always neck-sized my cases and recently I have found some information about a better way of resizing using the full-length die and just bumping the shoulder .002" or so. I think I will start doing that because I have difficulty with sticky bolt lift and chambering occassionally and I think it is more a result of the neck-sizing than being related to overpressure issues. I don't know how that will affect my loads, but I think I'll back off and work back up to the safe maximum after I make that change.

Once I do that and find a good sweet spot between 46.0 and 46.5 using the shoulder-bump sized cases then I can start playing with the seating depths and fine-tune it further. I'm excited to work with Quickload and try to get things set correctly so I can match the data you generated for me. Thanks to you and the data I collected today I have a pretty good idea of what these loads are doing now. That will help me figure out what I need to set in Quickload to get more accurate predictions. I went ahead and removed the bad data I posted previously so nobody mistakenly uses it.

Thanks again, you really helped me out a lot!

God bless,

Steve

 

[RL338]

Now would be a good time to measure the internal case volume. Entering that value will get your QL more accurate.

 

[Blkram]

The sub-MOA 130 AccuBond @ 2800 fps will be a great performer!