Tougher animal, whitetail or mule deer?

[Guy Miner]

No - I don't mean tougher eating! :mrgreen:

Most of my deer hunting has been for mule deer, with only a bit of time devoted to whitetail deer hunting. Simply because mostly mule deer live in my area, I have to travel a bit to get to whitetail country.

For those who've hunted both, which is the tougher animal to drop? I often see references to whitetail running off after being shot, and my own experience on mule deer indicates that most of them simply collapse after being hit.

Is it a difference in the animals, or a difference in shot placement by hunters? Seems to me that many mule deer hunters, myself included, often use a high shot to the shoulders/spine, for an instant or near instant drop, whereas I hear a lot of whitetail hunters talking about lung shots almost exclusively.

Thoughts?

 

[DrMike]

Guy,

In my limited experience, I consider the whitetail to be one of the toughest animals hunted in North America. They seem to take a great deal of punishment and still run. They have the constitution and stamina of an elk. Mule deer don't appear to absorb as much punishment before giving up. Any animals that is spined will drop to the shot; its a physical absolute. However, given almost any other "killing" shot, the whitetail will run, whereas the mulie will drop. I've watched several stagger about, much like a hard-hit elk, but the majority simply collapsed. I've certainly had whitetail drop to the shot; but most do run. Consequently, I've never lost either a mule deer or a whitetail, though I have had to track a few whitetails who managed to cover a surprising amount of territory before giving up the ghost.

 

[IdahoCTD]

I agree with Mike although I believe it's because whitetails are schizo. I swear they have ADD.

 

[sask boy]

I have hunted both & I would give the WT the out right win over the Mule deer.
They are faster & smarter??
Now that is my opinion only

Blessings

Dan

 

[REDGREEN]

Yep. Whitetail wins hands down, and much smarter than a mulie.

 

[257 Ackley]

Yep. Whitetail wins hands down, and much smarter than a mulie.

I have hunted both quite a bit and consider the whitetail to be the tougher of the two. The smarter part in the quote is what makes me laugh...first time I hunted mulies, we jumped two bucks that po-go'd up a hill, and the guy I was with said "wait to shoot", they always stop to look back before they run over the hill. Sure enough, they did, and I had an easy standing shot at 150 yards...not smart.

 

[Oldtrader3]

I have been hunting and killing deer since about 1955, with 1964 being when I started to get proficient on whitetail, mostly jump shooting. Killing running whitetail is hands down harder to deck them than mule deer, usually. I have killed 40+ whitetail in places from Georgia to Wyoming, Texas and Anticosti, for the geographic spread with lots of other places within. Washington only has a small herd in one part of the state as Guy mentioned.

Calibers of rifles used were from .243 Win to .375 H&H. Half of alll killed by a Model 70, .270 Winchester, 130 gr. Nosler Partition. Rifles include: .32 Special, .35 Rem, .243 Win, .257 Roberts, .25-06, .270 Win, .280 Rem, 7mm Mag, .30-06, .308, .300 Savage, .300 H&H, .308 Norma, .338 WM, .375 H&H and several other calibers.

Mule deer can be hard to kill if you hit them in the "Taint" (taint lung, taint spine). In addition to whitetail, I have kiilled probably 60 or so Mule/Blacktail deer from Califonia to Washington, to Texas, to Wyoming and all in between. I try to use a "high lung" shot which is very specific and deadly on deer. Most of my kills now are one shot, high lung, if at all possible.

 

[cloverleaf]

Just last week a friend related the folowing tale of his very large whitetail shot with a bow in Mn.

"I let the first arrow go....to high and too far back. Seemed to catch the deer's spine and impair the hind legs some what. He went down but got back up. When he did I (my friend) put an arrow through the lungs. Must have hit a rib on the far side because it was not a pass through. The deer turned its head and bit the shaft in two... :shock: before his hind legs gave out again. When he got back up the second time (he) put another arrow in the lungs which the buck turned and bit off again :shock: :shock:". The buck tried to walk/drag itself from the small clearing and my friend got out of the tree and put another arrow in the deer from the paunch going forward. This time when it went down it stayed down.

I have put two 12 ga slugs in a deer either one of which should have been fatal. It took a third.

The only thing I have ever seen drop a deer w/ athourity was Dads 7mm Mag and that may have been shot placement. Muley and whitetail went the same "bang- two steps flop".

My theroy is this, there is no substitute for velocity and adrenaline is the wild card. Antelope are smaller than either one and I have heard of antelope that were being chased shot to pieces and still keep going. Nevr shot a muley myself. so what do I know.... CL

 

[Oldtrader3]

My 10 or so longer range deer hit with a 165 Partitions at 3160 fps from the .300 H&H, died during my recoil motion. I thought that I had missed the first mule deer (a big 3-point) which I shot with the .300 H&H. All I saw in the scope after firing, was water, dust and hair! They all died that way regardless of species when hit with the .300 H&H. DRT!!!

 

[Ridgerunner665]

I've seen more than a few whitetails run 2-300 yards after being shot...only to find upon dressing them that their heart/lungs were complete mush.

An old buck is even tougher still...I've seen this with my own kills...a shot that would drop a young buck rather quickly will slow down a 5-6 year old deer some, but he'll likely cover nearly a mile before dropping (e.g. high lung shot, too far back for the shoulder)...still alive when I found him, wheezing, blood running out his nose...and still trying to get up.

Those tough rascals don't have any "quit" in them...the deer I'm speaking of is the first deer I ever shot (Nov. 1987), and to date he is the biggest...big racked 10 pointer, probably at least 140 or so maybe even 150...huge for this area), he dressed 190 lbs and was aged at 6-7 years at the check station.

He took the first bullet from a 243 (the high lung shot), it was my buddy's gun but I pulled the trigger, we were getting in the truck to leave when I saw the buck running across the field with his nose to the ground...Stan's gun was within reach, mine wasn't.

When I found the deer...he took 2 more well placed, point blank shots from a 30-30 before dying...to date, that is the only deer I've ever witnessed that gave a long loud moan as he died...and by far the hardest to kill.

I was a wet behind the ears kid then....but the 243 shot was a decent hit with a 100 grain bullet from about 200 yards...the 30-30 rounds, both through the lungs were fired from about 10 feet.

I truly wish I could have mounted that deer...but I didn't have the $$$...the sad thing is, I don't even have a picture but I do still have the kill tag...Most folks hunt a lifetime and don't get a buck like that, and I did it my first time out...been trying to do it again for 25 years.

The guy I was hunting with (Stan) was a guy that Grandad gave permission to hunt on the condition that he take me with him, Grandad wasn't a deer hunter (he preferred thing you hunted with dogs...coons, birds, etc.)...but he made sure I learned...I hunted deer and bear with Stan for over 10 years, right up until he passed away...he also taught me about reloading.

I don't have any experience with mulies...I've seen a few from the road as I drove by and had a chance encounter with a really nice buck early one morning on the top of a mountain somewhere in eastern CA if I remember right (likely somewhere along I80)....I stopped to wash off a tire :mrgreen: and he stepped out of the trees about 40 yards away...big rack, he looked like an elk to me, lol, as this was the closest I had ever been to a mulie buck...

I have since learned of the high shoulder shot, and have been using it with excellent results for the past 10 years or so...even with a 45acp, it works...it may not kill them instantly, but it will put them down on the spot.

 

[Dr. Vette]

I think you already get the trend here.

I've rarely seen a Whitetail "drop" unless I'm watching a hunting show on TV. :shock:

However, all 4 mule deer we've taken essentially dropped on the spot. In addition, I've shot at a mule deer doe 6 times with a 44 magnum (didn't know the scope base was loose, shooting 18 inches low) from about 40-60 yards as I kept walking after her and she would trot a few yards ahead. No way a WT would ever do that.

As noted, even with heart shots that take out half of their hearts the WT seem to walk/trot/run off like nothing ever happened.

 

[Wincheringen]

I guess you guys have a lot tougher Whitetails than I do. I've shot plenty of both and I've had just one of each give me a hard time about dying.

If you had to live outside through the winters here, you'd be pretty dang tough too.

 

[Kodiak]

Whitetails !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Oldtrader3]

Dr. Vette if you are using the .270 Weatherby as your whitetail battle rifle and have access to the game, I can't see any well hit whitetail with that caliber, running off into the sunset after a lung shot!

I use the 7mm Rem Mag a lot for beanfield (alfalfa) type stuff. A deer hit with that velocity and good bullet constuction is going to die! and sooner than later!. My kills with the 7mm Rem Mag have been dramatic to say the least and even out to 400 yards. The deer never know what hit them with these magnums.

 

[Dr. Vette]

Dr. Vette if you are using the .270 Weatherby as your whitetail battle rifle and have access to the game, I can't see any well hit whitetail with that caliber, running off into the sunset after a lung shot!

I use the 7mm Rem Mag a lot for beanfield (alfalfa) type stuff. A deer hit with that velocity and good bullet constuction is going to die! and sooner than later!. My kills with the 7mm Rem Mag have been dramatic to say the least and even out to 400 yards. The deer never know what hit them with these magnums.

OT,

7mm Weatherby, but same effect.
Oh yeah, they can still run without a heart. I think the shortest I've seen one go is about 15 yards when I got one 2 years ago. Hit it through lungs/liver, and it waddled 15 yards before flipping over onto its back just like in the cartoons.

Last year hit a WT in TX with my 7mm Rem Mag at 85 yards. Entered back ribs on the right and lodged in the left front shoulder taking out heart and lungs on the way. He trotted off about 50 yards before falling over.

Them whitetail can be tough critters.
I can only recall spine shots as knocking them down in place.

Patrick

 

[Hegland]

Never hunted mulies, so I can't make the comparison. Need to fix that one of these days... But here's what I know about whitetails:

Shot cleanly through the heart, they will more often than not cover at least 60-70 yards before bleeding out. This is the case whether they are hit with a 130-gr AB from a .270, a 300-gr XTP from a muzzleloader, or a Muzzy broadhead. Through the lungs, they can go much further depending on circumstances. I've seen an unbelievable amount of pink frothy material on the ground from deer that should long ago have dropped charge pressure.

As the others have astutely noted, the variables are adrenaline, shock to the nervous system and bone damage. A deer which knows it's being pursued can run seemingly forever. If they catch a whiff of scent, hear something out of place or see movement from the hunter, there's likely to be a tracking job in order. Alternatively, if they're unaware of the source of the projectile, they'll often go down within sight. I've noticed that high-speed cartridges, such as .30-caliber magnums, placed high lung or just under the spine will usually knock them down. However, if there's no permanent spinal damage, they just might get back up. Finally, even minus a front shoulder they can go a long way, but as Mike and now Dr. Vette pointed out, a hole in their spine is insurmountable.

 

[Oldtrader3]

I remember having killed a few whitetail with high lung shots that only went 20-30 yards. All of several whitetail, lung shot with the .300 H&H or 7mm Mag, DRT'ed within 3 feet.

My largest whitetail for body and horns, I shot with a .35 Rem, Marlin 336 at the base of the ear, in his bed with head up at about 40 yards using a 2.5 Leupold scope (1969). He did not move, except to drop his head. I had been hunting that deer for two seasons in his home ground.

I had one mule deer go nearly a mile and two drainages when shot in the sternum at 8000 feet elevation with a .270 Win at 425 yards (1987). I misjudged the yardage and nicked the heart and the lungs. I harvested the deer later in the day and had to shoot it again despite losing much blood and leaving a mile of slight blood trail across cedar scrub and sagebrush (Utah). That is the only deer that has gone further than maybe 200 yards after being shot by me, ever.

 

[tecumseh]

Living in Ohio my experience with Mule Deer is very limited too say the least, my vote would have to be for the Whitetail.

 

[FOTIS]

Whitetails for sure. They are the dominant species.

 

[mcseal2]

I've taken several of both, more whitetail than muleys, and would agree on the whitetail being tougher. I usually do take a lung shot if it is available.

I've seen whitetail do some amazing things after being hit. I shot a 162" buck that took a 180gr BT with a MV of 3250fps that did not exit. That buck still jumped a fence and covered a ranged 150yds after the shot before dying. His lungs came out as a liquid when we cut him open. My buck last year took a 140gr AccuBond from my 264WM through both shoulders and still ran 30yds and cleared a fence. I took the shoulder shot specifically so he wouldn't do that. The bullet did major damage to both shoulders and still he somehow made it. I truly wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't seen it.

The fastest and most dramatic kills I've seen on whitetail have been with Berger bullets, or 85-90gr bullets in 25-06. Bullets that dump a bunch of energy in the vitals real fast. I use accubonds and have never had a deer go 100yds after the shot but many have made it 70-80yds. The accubonds have all exited also which I liked. I definitely don't consider them to much bullet for a whitetail. Often low light plays into my hunting situation and I have limited time to take a shot, I want enough bullet to take any reasonable angle. In my experience the hardest to kill deer have all been mature bucks. They have an amazing survival instinct and don't quit easily.