Whelen and Western Powders

[KinleyWater]

Hi all,

Does anyone have any experience or loads for 35 Whelen using Big Game or Hunter? I've check my usual resources and not found anything. By usual, I mean my Lyman manual and the Western Powders guide - got loads for 30-06, so it should work, just nothing specifically for the Whelen. Looking to use Speer 250 HotCor as the projectile. Looking to keep it safe.

Thanks in advance.

 

[DrMike]

Here are a couple of QL projections that might help.

Cartridge : .35 Whelen
Bullet : .358, 250, Speer SP 2453
Useable Case Capaci: 60.685 grain H2O = 3.940 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.340 inch = 84.84 mm
Barrel Length : 22.0 inch = 558.8 mm
Powder : Ramshot Hunter

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-10.0 100 58.05 2281 2889 40155 7955 90.9 1.312
-09.0 102 58.70 2309 2960 41574 8064 91.5 1.292
-08.0 103 59.34 2337 3031 43049 8170 92.1 1.271
-07.0 104 59.99 2365 3104 44584 8273 92.7 1.251
-06.0 105 60.63 2393 3178 46182 8375 93.2 1.230
-05.0 106 61.28 2421 3254 47844 8473 93.7 1.211
-04.0 107 61.92 2449 3330 49577 8569 94.3 1.191 ! Near Maximum !
-03.0 108 62.57 2477 3407 51381 8661 94.8 1.172 ! Near Maximum !
-02.0 109 63.21 2506 3485 53262 8751 95.2 1.154 ! Near Maximum !
-01.0 111 63.86 2534 3565 55225 8837 95.7 1.135 ! Near Maximum !
+00.0 112 64.50 2563 3645 57273 8919 96.1 1.117 ! Near Maximum !
+01.0 113 65.15 2591 3727 59382 8998 96.5 1.100 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0 114 65.79 2620 3810 61644 9074 96.9 1.082 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.0 115 66.44 2648 3893 63978 9145 97.3 1.065 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 116 67.08 2677 3978 66419 9213 97.6 1.048 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+05.0 117 67.73 2706 4064 68974 9276 98.0 1.031 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 112 64.50 2703 4056 69567 8883 99.7 1.032 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 112 64.50 2379 3142 46563 8454 88.2 1.227


Cartridge : .35 Whelen
Bullet : .358, 250, Speer SP 2453
Useable Case Capaci: 60.685 grain H2O = 3.940 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.340 inch = 84.84 mm
Barrel Length : 22.0 inch = 558.8 mm
Powder : Ramshot Big Game

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-10.0 91 54.00 2291 2914 41085 7656 95.7 1.304
-09.0 92 54.60 2317 2979 42452 7740 96.1 1.284
-08.0 93 55.20 2342 3044 43867 7822 96.5 1.265
-07.0 94 55.80 2367 3111 45332 7901 96.9 1.246
-06.0 95 56.40 2392 3177 46850 7978 97.3 1.228
-05.0 96 57.00 2418 3245 48422 8051 97.6 1.210
-04.0 97 57.60 2443 3313 50054 8122 97.9 1.192 ! Near Maximum !
-03.0 98 58.20 2468 3381 51745 8189 98.2 1.175 ! Near Maximum !
-02.0 99 58.80 2493 3451 53498 8254 98.5 1.158 ! Near Maximum !
-01.0 100 59.40 2518 3521 55317 8315 98.7 1.141 ! Near Maximum !
+00.0 101 60.00 2543 3591 57205 8372 98.9 1.124 ! Near Maximum !
+01.0 102 60.60 2568 3662 59165 8426 99.2 1.108 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0 103 61.20 2594 3734 61199 8477 99.3 1.092 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+03.0 104 61.80 2618 3806 63314 8524 99.5 1.076 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 105 62.40 2643 3879 65508 8568 99.6 1.061 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+05.0 106 63.00 2668 3952 67784 8608 99.8 1.046 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 101 60.00 2655 3912 69285 8069 100.0 1.045 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 101 60.00 2387 3164 46470 8229 93.5 1.229

 

[SJB358]

Man, Big Game doesn’t look too shabby with the 250’s as far as load density and FPS…. Never would’ve guessed.

 

[DrMike]

Man, Big Game doesn’t look too shabby with the 250’s as far as load density and FPS…. Never would’ve guessed.

For sure, it would deliver a wallop to any game at reasonable distances. And Hunter appears to be a good alternative. I've not seen any Hunter available here in Canada for over a decade. When I was able to find it, it was a good powder to have in my inventory.

 

[KinleyWater]

Wow! Thanks Doc! That was way more than I was thinking.

As some of you may know, I have a hunt coming up in a few months for spring bear and the guide service packing list states a ".300 mag or similar caliber with 200 grain bullet recommended". Seems a bit odd to me, since as a kid I knew people were hunting them with 30-30s and the like (I think the biggest thing anyone I knew used was a -06), but whatever, I suppose like everything else these days they just got tougher.

Anyway, I picked up 2 pounds each of Big Game and Hunter a few years back on sale, so I thought I would see what I could use them for. If I am reading that chart correctly (and please correct me if I am mistaken) then 58.2 grains of Big Game should give me +/- 2468 fps at 98% case capacity. Now just looking at Nosler Trophy Grade 200gr Partition (loaded ammo) produced 3,357 ft lbs at the muzzle (according to the website). Now, if I calculate right, with a 250 grain HotCor, a velocity of 2459 fps (okay, 2459.3, technically) yields 3,357 fpe.

Like I said, when I was a kid, a 30-30 with 150 or 170 grain did the job, but the outfitter is the boss, I suppose.

Merci beaucoup.

 

[DrMike]

Yeah, animals have gotten so much tougher! That is what happens when Democrats get in power. You're reading the projection correctly. Big Game will work just fine in your Whelen. Consequently, you have quite a bit of room to increase the charge, though you don't really gain that much velocity or energy when you do so. You'll do well on your spring bear hunt. I've taken black bears with quite a variety of cartridges from a .280 Rem to a 9.3X64 Brenneke. All the bears dropped pretty quickly at the shot. Placement is the key. An '06 will work very well for black bear. Your guide has a preference, and since you're paying good money, you will want to keep your guide happy.

 

[wvbuckbuster]

Not 250gr bullets but used Big Game with Hornady 200gr SP. Decent velocity and group. I'd hunt with it if I wanted to. Dan.

 

[KinleyWater]

Finally got tot he range - has it really been 2 months? And thought I would give a quick update if anyone was interested (no pics, sorry). To make the story short, the best load seemed to be 58 grains Big Game with 250 grain Speer HotCor, though I have not yet chrono'd it (not sure I will, either). From a "Death Grip" tripod, it made just over an inch at just over a hundred meters, which is just fine for me taking shots over bait at a reported 30-50 yards.

If the QL predicts are correct, that should yield about 2450 fps (3334 ft lbs), which compares nicely to Nosler factory ammo 300 WinMag 200gr PT (item# 60069 / 2750 fps, 3357 ft lbs). Again, I don't see any particular need to match 300 WM performance, it's what the guide service wanted.

 

[JD338]

Good show. That load will turn even the night eat inside out. Any blood trail will be short and sweet.
Best of luck to you on your hunt.

JD338

 

[Cleveland48]

I do not own a 35 whelen, but I use big game exclusively in my 9.3x62 with 286 grain bullets. I get 2510 fps with that combo. I really like big game powder, and I figure if it works well in the 9.3x62 it should work well in the 35 whelen considering they are close performance wise.

 

[KinleyWater]

I do not own a 35 whelen, but I use big game exclusively in my 9.3x62 with 286 grain bullets. I get 2510 fps with that combo. I really like big game powder, and I figure if it works well in the 9.3x62 it should work well in the 35 whelen considering they are close performance wise.

Okay, let me stop you right there - I think I've found the root of all the problems in your life: "I do not own a 35 whelen..."

 

[KinleyWater]

All,

Thank you. I've got just a couple of weeks until I start driving, and lots to do. I will try and give as full an accounting as possible of this load assuming I am successful.