Neck Sizing Concern with 338 Win Mag Nosler Brass

[stevelsd]

Upon returning back to reloading for my 338 win mag, I have encountered a "possible concern" with 45 out of 50 Nosler cases (fired 2-3 times)
I also have many other brass manufacturers (Federal, Winchester, Hornady) but am not experiencing this scenario below:

I use a Redding body die to bump the FF shoulder .002-.003
I use the Lee Precision Neck Collet resizing die to size the neck
I also use when needed, the Larry Willis Belted Magnum Collet Resizing Die
Regardless of case manufacturer, all brass, including the Nosler brass fits very smoothly in the chamber.

My Concern (Only with Nosler brass):
When using the Lee Precision Neck Collet resizing die on the Nosler brass, the die catches slightly on the belt, in turn I need to pull down the ram lever an additional pull
(this might have happened also in the past but years have gone by, so I don't recall)
This is only with the Nosler brass, but it fits perfectly in the chamber

Other brass measures .5285 - .529 at the belt and .509 - .510 at the web
Nosler brass with the exception of 5 cases, measures .530 - .5305 at the belt (where the die catches) and .511 at the web

Has anyone that uses the Lee neck collet resizing die encountered that before?
I am not sure what the virgin measurements were or if these have changed.

Is this Nosler brass still reloading worthy?

Sorry for the long explanation but did not want to leave anything out.

Thank you lots!
Steve

 

[grry10]

I've not used it, but interesting! I will follow any feedback you get. Good luck on solving the problem.

 

[RL338]

My Lee collet die measures 0.5425” at the bottom of the collet. My 338 WM brass is made from 375 H&H Remington and 7mm RM Peterson. No issues with either.

 

[stevelsd]

I've not used it, but interesting! I will follow any feedback you get. Good luck on solving the problem.

Thank you!

My Lee collet die measures 0.5425” at the bottom of the collet. My 338 WM brass is made from 375 H&H Remington and 7mm RM Peterson. No issues with either.
View attachment 25460View attachment 25461View attachment 25462View attachment 25463View attachment 25464View attachment 25465

Thank you for the pics RL338
Something is not adding up so I am going to call Lee Precision on Monday or Tuesday and get their discernment. I will update all with Lee Precision explanation thereafter. Could very well be just me!
Thanks again
Stevelsd

 

[Dr. Vette]

What happens if you back off the die just a bit?

 

[stevelsd]

What happens if you back off the die just a bit?

You know, I never thought of that. I will try it tomorrow morning and give back report. I will try different slight back offs.

super thanks Dr. Vette!!

 

[RL338]

What happens if you back off the die just a bit?

That won’t work with the collet die. On the up stroke the shell holder contacts the bottom of the collet and drives it up into the forcing cone closing it up onto the mandrel sizing the neck.

 

[stevelsd]

That won’t work with the collet die. On the up stroke the shell holder contacts the bottom of the collet and drives it up into the forcing cone closing it up onto the mandrel sizing the neck.

oh.. ok

 

[stevelsd]

oh.. ok

RL338, you are correct.
"On the up stroke the shell holder contacts the bottom of the collet and drives it up into the forcing cone closing it up onto the mandrel sizing the neck."
I gave it a shot what Dr Vette suggested with different levels with the die but, yeah, your discernment is correct. Still catching slightly at the belt.

Dr Vette; your thought was appreciated. I have worked in IT for over 35 years and things that should not work, sometimes work and so nothing would surprise me.

I am going to do an executive decision and rather than just send the Nosler cases to the garbage, I am going to test out a few of the cases, review the performance and case characteristics and then make a decision to continue use or toss out.

Thanks all
Stevelsd

 

[RL338]

I’m curious to the measured inside diameter of your collet. Your brass at 0.5305” would easily work in my die.

 

[stevelsd]

I’m curious to the measured inside diameter of your collet. Your brass at 0.5305” would easily work in my die.

I will advise tomorrow morning - thanks

 

[Dr. Vette]

That won’t work with the collet die. On the up stroke the shell holder contacts the bottom of the collet and drives it up into the forcing cone closing it up onto the mandrel sizing the neck.

Yes, I know as I use them all the time, though for me it's the down stroke since I use a Forster press.
However, you might not "drive" the case in as deep was my thought. I know that I can adjust how tight the collet pinches the case by adjusting the die, so it was worth a try to see if it helped.

 

[stevelsd]

I will advise tomorrow morning - thanks

Good Tuesday Morning
Here are my findings.

For all brass that do work without catching (Federal, Winchester, Hornady, Barnes) = 0.528 - 0.5285
For the Nosler brass (exception 4-5 of them that do work without a catch) = 0.530 - 0.5305 (a few are at 0.531)

Inside diameter for the die is 0.5295

Strange almost all my other brass are between 0.528 - 0.5285 (I found a very few at 0.529 but still worked without catching)

 

[RL338]

Is your collet machined out for the belt? Or possibly not machined deep enough. Something is definitely up with your collet then.

 

[stevelsd]

View attachment 25498
Is your collet machined out for the belt? Or possibly not machined deep enough. Something is definitely up with your collet then.

Um, I am pretty sure it is not machined out at all. Straight direct purchase from Lee Precision about 7 years or so ago.
If you have any Nosler 338 brass, what are your measurements at the belt?

 

[stevelsd]

Um, I am pretty sure it is not machined out at all. Straight direct purchase from Lee Precision about 7 years or so ago.
If you have any Nosler 338 brass, what are your measurements at the belt?

I said I was going to call the Lee the other day but stayed with this forum, but I will give them a call tomorrow and get the scoop on my neck sizer.
Thanks RL338

 

[RL338]

The only Nosler Mag brass I have is for my 7mm RM. It fits fine in the 338 WM die with mandrel removed. My 7mm RM collet die has even a larger opening on that die at 0.547”.

 

[stevelsd]

The only Nosler Mag brass I have is for my 7mm RM. It fits fine in the 338 WM die with mandrel removed. My 7mm RM collet die has even a larger opening on that die at 0.547”.
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Yipee!
Got off the phone with Lee Precision Engineer and advised my die is probably close to 12-13 years old or maybe older. I explained the situation to the engineer (Chris) and he definitely agrees my collet die is out of spec. He did say that sometimes, specs over the years if a reasonable and\or legitimate concern arises, are modified to newer manufacturing specs to accommodate. He also mentioned that some collet die inside diameters can or have been altered (machined out) to accommodate such things like the belt but he was not sure right off hand if the 338 win mag collet die fell into that scenario. He stated my inside diameter should be between 0.532 to 0.535 and of course mine is at 0.5295. The belt diameter of the Nosler cases is within SAMMI specs but my collet dies is definitely not.

Lee is going to take care of it no charge. I will send my die in with 2-3 Nosler cases and they will correct the issue. The turnaround time will be aroun5-7 days. If the work to correct is not worth the labor, they will send me a new one!!

Thanks to all and especially RL338 & Dr Vette.
RL338 your snapshots were super helpful. You stuck with me to the end! Super Thanks
Steve

 

[JD338]

That's great news. Glad Lee is standing up and going to assist you in getting things resolved.

JD338

 

[RL338]

Thanks to all and especially RL338 & Dr Vette.
RL338 your snapshots were super helpful. You stuck with me to the end! Super Thanks
Steve

No problem. I’ve spent a lot of time with the Lee collet dies. One tip I do is anneal after each firing. It will give you constant feel of the collet sizing the neck against the mandrel.